Take Me to Church Lyrics and Meaning – A Christian Analysis and Critique

If you have a radio in your car, you have probably heard the popular song “Take Me to Church” by Irish recording artist Hozier. For those who don’t listen to the radio or care about pop music, all you need to know is that this song was nominated for Song of the Year at the Grammy’s.

Hozier Take Me To Church

Recording Artist Hozier

The song is hauntingly beautiful with subtle verses and a soulful chorus. Admittedly, when I first heard it, I thought, “Wow, this is a powerful song. It’s almost hymn-like.” It’s Elton John mixed with an old Southern Spiritual from the American Civil War.

But then I started listening to the lyrics…

“Take Me to Church” by Hozier could only have been written by an Irishmen with Catholic roots. When he sings of “Church,” it is a “sacrifice” at a “shrine” with a “ritual” and includes “I’ll tell you my sins.”

However, Hozier’s religion is not Protestant or Evangelical Christianity. This is Irish Catholicism with a blasphemous twist…

Take Me to Church Lyrics Analyzed

Regrettably, the lyrics to “Take Me to Church” are pretty blasphemous. Here’s my theological analysis with my commentary in the red:

[Verse 1]
My lover’s got humour
She’s the giggle at a funeral
Knows everybody’s disapproval
I should’ve worshipped her sooner (So this is the cue. The God throughout the song is a girlfriend.)
If the Heavens ever did speak (“If the Heavens ever” = revealed religion is cast into doubt)
She’s the last true mouthpiece
Every Sunday’s getting more bleak
A fresh poison each week
“We were born sick”, you heard them say it (“they” [Catholics] teach original sin)
My church offers no absolutes (So unlike Catholicism, there are no moral absolutes – only relativism)
She tells me “worship in the bedroom” (the liturgy is sex. It’s the place of union between him and the “god”/girlfriend)
The only heaven I’ll be sent to
Is when I’m alone with you
I was born sick, but I love it (acknowledges original sin – but he loves it)
Command me to be well (a reference to Christ commanding people to be well in the Gospels)

[Pre-Chorus]
Amen, Amen, Amen

[Chorus] (x2)
Take me to church (remember, “Church” here is sexual reference in this song)
I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies
I’ll tell you my sins so you can sharpen your knife (confession reference)
Offer me my deathless death
Good God, let me give you my life (he hands over his life to her the “god”)

[Verse 2]
If I’m a pagan of the good times
My lover’s the sunlight
To keep the Goddess on my side (the god/girlfriend is also a goddess)
She demands a sacrifice (here’s where the song gets “Eucharistic” with reference to sacrificial meal and hunger…)
Drain the whole sea
Get something shiny
Something meaty for the main course
That’s a fine looking high horse
What you got in the stable? (reference to the Christ Child “in the stable”)
We’ve a lot of starving faithful
That looks tasty
That looks plenty
This is hungry work

[Chorus] (x2)

[Bridge]
No masters or kings when the ritual begins (egalitarian ritual – sex)
There is no sweeter innocence than our gentle sin (hey, at least he knows it’s sin – he’s Irish!)
In the madness and soil of that sad earthly scene (a reference perhaps to leaving earth into the “heavenly bliss” of sexual embrace)
Only then I am human
Only then I am clean (he ends with a reference the sexual completion as a kind of baptism or absolution)

Amen, Amen, Amen

Download Your Take Me To Church Study Guide 

Take Me to Church Meaning

What’s amazing about his song is that it’s about as offensive as anything produced by Marilyn Manson, Judas Priest, or Slayer – yet hardly anyone recognizes it! It takes rich Catholic sacramental language but re-signifies the imagery as a sexual encounter. And that’s the so-called “genius” of this song.

The music industry is now much smarter than it was in the days of Judas Priest, Black Sabbath, and Slayer. Your daughter is not likely to love Marilyn Manson and erect an idol to Satan in her bedroom. Your son will not likely consecrate his baby to Lucifer and baptize him in goat’s blood.

Overt Satanism is out of style. However, young people are likely to exchange their Christian faith for sexual license. The stats show that young people will likely exchange the sacramental life and liturgy for the liturgy of sexual experimentation.

And that’s exactly why this song has become an American anthem. The devil doesn’t needs a league of heavy metal Satanists. He’d almost prefer to have people mocking the Christian sacraments and images.

If God isn’t real – “If the Heavens ever did speak” – then the only goods to be enjoyed in this life are the pleasures of food and sex. That’s all there is left for humans to experience transcendence. Hozier gets it and he sings for us a catchy hymn.

In an interview with New York Magazine in March 2014, the artist Hozier stated:

‘Take Me to Church’ is essentially about sex, but it’s a tongue-in-cheek attack at organizations that would… undermine humanity by successfully teaching shame about sexual orientation — that it is sinful, or that it offends God… But it’s not an attack on faith… it’s an assertion of self, reclaiming humanity back for something that is the most natural and worthwhile.

So there you have it from Hozier himself.

Conclusion

I know it’s a catchy song. There’s a part of me that likes it. But seriously, this is probably one of the most sacramental songs every popularized – and it sacramentalizes the wrong values. That’s my two cents. Godspeed, Taylor

Download a pdf Study Guide by Taylor of the Lyrics for “Take Me to Church”:

Download Your Take Me To Church Study Guide

Question: Okay, now I want to hear from you. Do you agree? Did I miss something about this song? You can leave a comment by clicking here.

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  • Lindsay

    Check out the music video….

    • I’ve heard it gets even worse…

      • GM

        Yo! You heard correct. Out of curiosity I went to YouTube and clicked to hear. And bang! Two dudes take a walk smoke a joint and kaboom! I get burned with Perversion. Disgusting. I remember hearing somewhere the demons tempt toward unnatural sins and then boogie even they know how repulsive it is. Arch-ultra fornicatio of musical talent.

        • Gandolfication

          Burning with perversion is his next albom title

          • Michael Stevenson

            Album*, if you’re going to insult an artist at least try a bit harder

          • Gandolfication

            I wasn’t insulting the artist, I was satirizing the above comment. Spell check is tricky on a phone.

          • gods faithful servant

            Please don’t fall for the false teachings of athiests. If you honestly non biastly think about it atheists are quite hypocritical because they say they hate god but if they are athiest they don’t think he exists how can you hate something if it doesn’t exist? Therefore they admit god is real by saying they hate him. Michael

          • Freed Mind

            No, they hate ignorant sheep who believe in story book characters and judge others because of it.

          • Bershawn300

            You do realize that Christians will not turn because of ad hominem insults from nonbelievers, I trust? Surely there’s an atheist website you can haunt where beliefs about the fruitlessness of belief and debates about the non-debatable non-existence of God will be supported and coddled to the extreme? Why aren’t you there? Trolling a Catholic site seems an odd pastime for a non-believer. Peace, love, Jesus and Catholicism to you.

          • Mark Burns

            That wasn’t “ad hominem”. AH is when you refer to a personal character trait or flaw of your opponent as a means to discredit his argument. It doesn’t just mean that you say something insulting.

          • Bershawn300

            Sorry, no. you are wrong. Ad hominem can have two forms – one is called ‘ad hominmen circumstantial’: when someone attacks the source rather than the argument –and the other is ‘ad hominem tu quoque’: when some pot basically calls the kettle black. With these in mind, calling believers ‘ignorant sheep’ and the Scriptures a mere ‘storybook’ definitely fall under ad hominem. Peace.

          • Mark Burns

            That was an interesting detail about Tu Quoque that I had never heard before. Thanks for the insight. However, I don’t agree with you that the original insult was hypocritical. I find atheists to be far less ignorant than “the sheep”. In fact, I did a correlative comparison of the average IQ of each state in the US as compared with the general religiosity of the same state. The trends are pretty uniformly comparative. Seems that anyone can be called hypocritical, but I don’t think that it would be as easy to cite compelling evidence in this case.

          • Bob

            I know he’s probley basing this on one person but I believe a lot of atheist do tend say that

          • BLC-LM

            Hi there, here is a good one. Alain de Botton is a philosopher who come up with what he calls it Atheism 2.0. He explores What aspects of religion should atheists (respectfully) adopt?
            Alain de Botton suggests a “religion for atheists” — call it Atheism 2.0 — that incorporates religious forms and traditions to satisfy our human need for connection, ritual and transcendence. You Check his talk (Recorded at TEDGlobal 2011, July 2011, in Edinburgh, Scotland. Duration: 19:20.)

            This is just awesome. I love his concept.

          • Mark Burns

            I’ve heard about it. Not to disparage you, but I’m not into it. It’s basically akin to saying, “We don’t need your stinkin’ religion, but let’s adopt a lot of it anyway.”

            Humans need interaction, social customs and order, and togetherness, but religion doesn’t own those things. We can still have them on our own terms.

          • Paul Caston

            It’s interesting you should say “We don’t need your stinkin’ religion…” since virtually every Christian and Catholic holiday and tradition is taken from older Pagan religions. Not a single word, or concept, in the bible is original. Immaculate births, healing, fire and brimstone, even David v. Goliath are adaptations from far older religions. The Catholic day of Epiphany is the only original idea. The next time you put an evergreen in your house or hunt for Easter eggs, or celebrate the “birth of Christ”, do a little research and find out the origins of your own religion.

          • Tabitha

            Yes Easter is from the word Ester. (Goddess of fertility) Pagan. Christians did not still the date or dates of any other holiday. The people hundreds of years ago got together and combined everything together because more people were off than working. You could not work on these days.

          • Jaime Woodard

            Virtually ALL of them are. Christmas is what pagans called winter solstice where they decorated trees and passed out gifts.

          • A Smarter Atheist

            Wrong, Christmas, CHRISTmas, is the celebration of the birth of christ. The dumb crap where you put stuff on trees has little to nothing to do with Christmas, rather the winter solstice itself.

          • Rachel

            Except that Christ was not born anywhere near December 25th. Most Bible Historians put his birth in April based on surviving census records. The day we celebrate as Christmas was chosen to make pagans convert to Christianity by saying look we have the same holidays etc.

          • Old Newy girl

            Yes, and summer solstice in Australia 🙂 My kids went to a Steiner (Waldorf) school where they learned about religion and celebrated Easter, Palm Sunday & Christmas but also celebrated the beautiful ancient rituals of the winter solstice and summer solstice. I was brought up in a strict Catholic household, went to church every Sunday, went to Catholic school for 13 years but it didn’t answer a lot of the questions of the unfairness of life. But, in my early twenties I discovered new age spiritualism with reincarnation, karma, meditation etc and it answers all of the questions of life. I still believe in Jesus but as an advanced soul as were others who walked this earth and suffered. I believe if religious people were more open minded about what else is out there and that one can still be a “good, kind & moralistic” person without religion, the world would be in peace. Amen 🙂

          • ManassasGrandma

            No one knows the actual birthday of Christ. Ancient Israelite s did not celebrate birthdays. The winter solstice was chosen because of the symbolism, the Light of the World coming into the world in its darkest hour.

          • razor bradley

            incorrect…… jesus was a man and he knew what his birthday was…..

          • Ashton

            Actually its from Oester or Ostara

          • ManassasGrandma

            Catholicism baptized a lot of pagan customs. Pretty shrewd, eh?

          • Joshua Griffin

            No we can’t have them on our own terms, our understanding is too limited.I pray that god shows you that brother.till then have a great day:)

          • Mark Burns

            I don’t want your prayers, or God. What I would like are further insights into what you said. I welcome advice, but would like to ask some follow up questions:

            Why (i.e. for what good reason) can we not live life on our own terms? How do you know that our understanding is too limited, when it is precisely your understanding that you are relying on in order to make this determination? Are you arrogantly presuming that you understand God better than I do and I’m blind to some truth you can see? Follow up questions: If so, what makes you so special that God would give you this insight and not me? Are you a better, or somehow more deserving person than I am?

            As far as God goes, I was a Christian for 35 years, a vast majority of my life. It is only recently, thanks in large part to the plurality of voices and ideas available to compare and contrast via modern technology, that I’ve seen the light and emancipated myself from the mind shackles of theistic ideology. I’ve had plenty of time to see what God wants to show me. I’d appreciate you not making presumptions about me since you don’t even know me.

          • PTA mom

            “Why (i.e. for what good reason) can we not live life on our own terms?” seems like an odd question for an atheist to ask a believer. As an atheist don’t you value your free will and your freedom from judgement? Right so…. let believers do the same. This society in general is made for atheists, there is nothing here that can be said to sway a person in one way or the other so why bother asking a believer why they believe what they believe – you don’t want to hear what they have to say anyway. Anything they tell you will be dismissed – likewise no kind of “enlightenment” from you will sway them to believe what you say and reject what they believe. We have all heard about the “big bang” and evolution – makes no difference to a believer who has a relationship with God because that relationship came to them by His grace (and in case you were wondering I have an IQ of 140 so the science is not beyond my understanding either). The fact that you once believed and no longer believe is inconsequential. I’m curious as to which church you attended that you felt you “knew God” and saw “what he showed you” – in your own words you knew and saw something that does not exist to you. Perhaps you were indoctrinated from infancy – in which case the concept of grace must have been taught to you – a relationship with God is not a birthright it either is or it isn’t, in other words it cannot be taught per se just introduced. Your revulsion to faith in God makes it seem like there is a lot more than just atheism and curiosity behind your comments. Otherwise what is the need to be on a christian forum? Wouldn’t you rather listen to the plurality of voices and ideas somewhere else? Seems like a ridiculous waste of time to me.

          • Mark Burns

            “As an atheist don’t you value your free will and your freedom from judgement?”
            No. Actually I don’t. I’m not even sure we have free will (as most Christians understand it), nor do I hope to live a life free from judgment. I think that we should all be subject to criticism (i.e. “judged”) fairly and equally.

            “…there is nothing here that can be said to sway a person in one way or the other so why bother asking a believer why they believe what they believe – you don’t want to hear what they have to say anyway…Anything they tell you will be dismissed…”
            Your pessimism makes me sad. I (and most atheists) highly cherish doubt, skepticism, and an ability to comport one’s beliefs to the truth of reality. If you really believe that no one can be swayed by discussion and that atheists don’t really want to know what you have to say anyway, you clearly don’t know many atheists. Engaging in conversation and both learning about others and having them learn what motivates our worldview is a very integral part of who we are. It’s too bad you aren’t more open to at least considering that you might be wrong and could learn something from those who disagree with you.

            “The fact that you once believed and no longer believe is inconsequential.”
            I disagree. I think that this is a crucial detail. It demonstrates a willingness to change my beliefs to comport with reality, and this is something I continue to strive for (as I discussed in the previous paragraph). It is one thing to claim to be open-minded, but my willingness to challenge/confront my beliefs and change them when they don’t map to reality is something I am proud of, because it was the hardest thing I have ever done.

            “I’m curious as to which church you attended that you felt you “knew God” and saw “what he showed you…”
            I attended an Evangelical Free Church of America my whole life, but it was only so in affiliation for structural purposes. It was very much “non-denominational” Protestant. Without going into great detail on a public forum, I was devoted to Christianity and very proactive in seeking out my faith for 35 years before I finally had the courage to question the truth of it.

            “…what is the need to be on a christian forum? Wouldn’t you rather listen to the plurality of voices and ideas somewhere else? Seems like a ridiculous waste of time to me.”
            This theme comes up continually…the idea that atheists are not welcome in Christian/Catholic forums. Is this some sort of mutual “pat one another on the back” club where only like-minded people are welcome, and ‘you people’ aren’t welcome? I personally much prefer to have discussion with people who disagree with me so that I can weigh different ideas against one another, rather than surround myself with a bunch of “yes men” as it were. And I know that I am not the only one because I have had theists comment on this very thread that my voice is appreciated.

            You see, PTA mom, there are some people who are reasonable and open-minded to at least consider what other people think before closing themselves off simply because we disagree. I would humbly suggest that you might learn more from people like me if you could learn to be more open to hearing what I and others like me have to say.

          • Catherine Cobbold

            I’m going to end up liking every single one of your posts , eloquent, polite, fantastic mind.
            It is bothering me slightly that some of the key points of this song are misinterpreted. Not least that the protagonist is bearing his willingness to be judged and punished for his feelings. Also that church isn’t predominantly a sexual reference, it’s literal-As a Christian he will choose to go to church and accept punishment for what he is also accepting he cannot change about himself. The reference to no sweeter innocence than our gentle sin, is that their love is innocent and gentle – it’s genuine emotion between two adults. The use of the word sin here is to be considered irony, it’s preceded by the word ‘gentle’ in any case which is trying to tell you it harms no one.

          • Mark Burns

            Hi Catherine, and thanks for the “follow” and “likes”, but mostly for the compliment. You’re far too kind.

            I was recently interviewed by a woman who also read this comment thread because she is writing a paper on the song and wanted the perspective of an atheist. In the interview, I compared Hozier’s work with The Eagles’, “Hotel California” or Leonard Cohen’s “Hallelujah” (though I much prefer Jeff Buckley’s musical interpretation). Songs like these are written open-endedly. The listener is afforded some freedom to find his/her own meaning in the lyrics. The vagueness and ambiguity allows some translucence, don’t you think?

            I’m interested in the number of people who say that the song is an admonishment of those who oppose homosexuality. That is clearly a theme in the music video, but an interview of Hozier suggested something more broad. Even in the interview, he doesn’t identify one particular subject that the song is “about”. Rather, he says that the song is about a theme of institutions condemning behavior which is a natural aspect of what it means to be human.

            Certainly the points you’ve raised can fall within this broad theme, and I think your interpretation is freer and more lucid than most that I’ve read here (the silly interpretation of the blogger himself notwithstanding). As stated, you also point to thematic elements without being too concrete in precisely how he sacrificing himself to the church, or for what sexual “misconduct” he has committed himself to their charge.

          • Catherine Cobbold

            Hi thanks for the reply , and you are welcome in regards to the compliment!

            Interesting point that the song was intended to cover the entire plethora of natural human behaviour that is sometimes condemned under original sin, and I guess really I did subconsciously interpret it as so, as it stirs up the same sadness inside when I see people judged in any way for something that is out of their hands or a choice that doesn’t harm anyone else.

            I like to believe that if no one is doing anything they don’t want to and it affected no one else directly in a negative way, then nothing should be condemned by another person.That does not mean I understand and am not perplexed sometimes why people want to do anything extremely unusual (or outside my admittedly boring perception of usual!) but that I understand it’s none of my business, I don’t know how they feel because I am not them and they can be happy! Is this where you are coming from too, I recall you were told to start your own religion, when I just see this as part of personality which has formed from what we’ve seen, learnt, and felt. You are completely right when you say beliefs should be malleable and subject to change with future learning.

            I think the interpretation that I admittedly focused on primarily, and that you highlighted as a common one, that this song is written solely on the subject of sexual orientation, comes obviously from the video, but also from the Wikipedia page which said exactly that near the top- and pretty much in the lyric interpretation section- maybe it should be clarified!

            I see what you mean with the song comparisons and you are right, the ambiguity is there and it makes the song all the more powerful if listeners can apply it to a multitude of situations. There’s always something more powerful in words that wind around a subject, not hitting directly or crudely, but still delivering a message. And that is when a good song or poem brushes against genius. I guess it’s one of the main weapons in an advertiser’s inventory too. I was happy when I realised that Hozier used this ability for this cause.
            It’s a beautiful song and Hozier should be proud to have opened up these discussions. I feel like doing music A level just to write about it. Hozier, what a champ!

            Do you mind me asking, do you call yourself an atheist but still believe a lot of the bible’s general teachings, because I love all the aspects of religion that encourage tolerance, community and being the best you can be, particularly when it encourages you to think twice before making a mistake or being unkind. But I can’t subscribe to all.
            Atheist isn’t a big thing in these parts, normally the option on forms I fill in is ‘Nothing’. So normally I’m a nothing.

            We are happy nothing’s!

          • Mark Burns

            Catherine,

            Are you a Libertarian? If not, you should be 🙂 I am, and that is exactly the mentality you are describing in your third paragraph. The idea that no one else (to include the government) should interfere with you if you are engaged in an activity that is not harmful to others and willingly engaged in yourself is a key development in my views. Not so much in regard to religion as you pointed out, but more to politics. On religion and morality, my views are shaped by humanism and egalitarianism.

            I was interested in the Wiki page on the song. I agree that Hozier does say that the song lyrics do deal primarily with forbidden love. I went back to the source quoted in the lyrics section (footnote 6). In the original article, Hozier seems to both acknowledge this and tie it in to the broader themes. Here is the question:

            “Take Me to Church” is a critique of oppressive institutions, with a woman or female pronoun used as a sort of savior.

            The complete answer is too long to quote here, but I’d encourage you to look it up as it does tie sexuality into the theme of an “an assertion of self, reclaiming humanity back for something that is the most natural and worthwhile. Electing, in this case a female, to choose a love who is worth loving.”

            > Do you mind me asking, do you call yourself an atheist but still believe a lot of the bible’s general teachings?

            I am an atheist, but I read and quote the Bible often. I believe that we can find moral wisdom in many places, but I do not believe that it can be found in only one place. I evaluate the morality of the Bible against the concepts of egalitarianism and humanism. If the Bible says something moral, I adopt the wisdom. One of my favorite passages is Matthew 7.

            We aren’t nothings 🙂 We are unaffiliated, or “the nones” (and none of the above is much different than nothing!). And the nones comprise about 20% of the US population (and over 30% of the 18-29 year old demographic).

            Those who have been marginalized by the religious institutions of our country are in a paradigm shift. In our modern age of information availability, non-believers are no longer relegated to sitting quietly in the shadows, subservient to the will of the theist majority. We are still very much in the minority and there is a long way to go, but–like the LGBT movement–we can now be openly expressive of what we believe with less and less fear of reprisal from the “moral majority”.

          • Catherine Cobbold

            Hi Mark,

            Thanks for the interesting reply, hope you are well.

            You are right to map this subject into political beliefs as well, where you mentioned that no one has the right to oppress another.

            I see a possible similarity also in religious and political persuasions in people, as these sort of fundamental beliefs (or willingness to believe and not question total bollocks-sorry but that’s what is happening here!), as well as a package of morals we each have etched into us, (learnt and tailored as we mature) do map directly onto our political agendas as much as they seem to be wrapped around religious belief. I find this link absolutely fascinating. Is there a link between IQ and choices we make in religious belief and political persuasion? The latter is harder to map because political persuasion is guided by your personal situation and what would benefit you, but the blind followers of a party who doesn’t help them aren’t dissimilar to religious believers who end up losing gay family members because of unwillingness to recognise that parts of religion aren’t quite fair.

            Yes I am a libertarian with my views, although here in the UK, our far left Liberal Democrat party have successfully wasted the chance of (to the point of even undoing) the promotion of this political philosophy to the public when they finally got into power for the first time as part of a coalition in 2010 with the right wing capitalist loving Conservative party, as I’m sure you are aware. It’s sad they wasted this opportunity to educate and demonstrate. But I guess the power was stripped from them by the Tories. We now have more determined left wing parties such as the Greens collecting interest and becoming contenders in the foray, with new far right parties also frighteningly gaining serious momentum, and the lefter of our two Omi-parties making promises in their Eton-honed accents that actually have left wing roots for the first time in a long time.

            I find myself looking at communist theorem and blinking in a confused manner at the struggling poor people who are so sure that sharing is bad even though it would lift them.
            The same confused blink mode that kickstarts when I see a Christian talking about the love and forgiveness the religion claims in one hand it promotes, then completely missing the painful points made in the original song and video we were discussing, and how more tolerance could benefit everyone.
            People -how can you just say ‘oh I heard the video is even worse’ in the sense that the video is wrong, when actually the video is condemning such evil wrongdoing, how can you just pretend to ignore this?? BLINK BLINK.

            I’m babbling on about politics because I’m really interested in how the American Parties map onto our parties in the UK and I bet you could give me a fab insight?
            We have the uber parties – labour and conservatives , which (centre) left and fairly far right (these days) respectively I think labour map onto Obama’s Democrats and Tories onto Republicans. Without the anti-choice and anti-tolerance that I think comes from the overlap of religion onto the Republican Party. Not sure if you have other smaller parties that even get a look in though?

            You mentioned that percentage of atheist is 20% I thought much lower, that has opened my eyes. It’s still very alien to think your country is so religious. And then I see in TV programs, the religious pro-life, anti-gay and then some racism too in such a raw form (that sort of thing is creeping back into the UK now thanks UKIP) and it’s quite scary to see people oppressing each other. I think you guys here are brave opening up dialogue, given that you are rather outnumbered. Not that you are trying to re-educate but share knowledge. It’s apparent to me that there are many religious people who switch themselves off from listening and learning. I find that frightening but you have challenged this really well.

            To get this back on track as I digress, I see similarities here between a group of people (voters) being told what they want to hear by parties (particularly UKIP) in the UK (simple solutions to what they see as problems in their lives as workers e.g. the media’s magnified fear of immigration and Islam) rather than thinking about what is actually right and good for everyone including them(I.e. challenging the removal of public services and challenging that a very small group of people hold an amount of money that could improve everyone’s lives), and the unquestioning following of a religious regime that oppresses people and encourages judgment of people with such negative outcomes to people’s lives (such as homosexuals). This blind following to your own detriment is similar.

            To me liberalism isn’t a theory, as equality and freedom is common sense because we all want it, and I’m struggling with that.

            The struggle I have is that whilst I am utterly aware and comfortable that my views are receptive to shapeshifting, moulding, improving, and sometimes completely changing according to new information, I find my view is set in stone that equality is right (and the sense to recognise that some of us need more that others to achieve a level of equality). I find it utterly wrong that anyone could think differently and that’s a problem because isn’t that being as closed minded as someone who blindly condemns something.

            It’s great that America is changing in this way isn’t it. What people will do with it will be interesting because I do sometimes wonder whether the main positive with religion is the enormous bond that believers seem to share. And when that’s not being used to persecute anyone it’s a beautiful thing that might help in achieving things together. That’s why I agree whole heartedly with you about taking the good lessons from the bible. There is of course merit in anything that encourages humanity towards each other. Shame it causes a load of other stuff too though.

          • Ashton

            Compare ones beliefs to the truth of reality? Im a little confused by this statement. Perhaps i am misunderstanding you though. What exactly is the truth of reality and with no hard or concrete “we can see/touch this” type of evidence that most atheists require (from my personal experience with atheists anyway) how do you know what is or is not truth? Science and religion can co exist. Being able to explain evolution or the creation of the universe (which isnt proven still only a theory though for the record i do believe in the big bang theory and evolution) due to science does not in any way disprove “Gods” existence. Christianity personifies the divine sacred and gives it a mame like God. Other religions have different names for the same thing different personifications for the same concept. The eternal source of life and love. That which is divine or sacred. Science is just another way to understand how “God” creates his works, to understanding the numinous and the awesome. The things that give us consciousness, conscience, intelligence and the ability to see the inherent beauty in our universe, even through all the evil and hatred. There is no set “Truth of Reality” we all have our own truths within our souls

          • Mark Burns

            “Compare ones beliefs to the truth of reality?…How do you know what is or is not truth?”

            It isn’t just about being material (see, hear, touch). Something is true when it has characteristics such as these: independently verifiable, observable, and produces predictive results.

            “Being able to explain evolution or the creation of the universe…does not in any way disprove God’s existence.”

            I agree. It’s a separate issue. However, it is worthwhile subject matter in some religious discussion. For example, evolution proves that there never was a first man or woman, and it proves that there was death and suffering in the world prior to mankind. So science does overtly and directly trespass on specific religious beliefs, such as inherited sin from the total depravity of man, and the introduction of evil into the world based on man’s sin. The magisteria do overlap.

            “Science is just another way to understand how “God” creates his works, to understanding the numinous and the awesome.”

            I disagree. Science does more than help us understand what God did. Through the scientific method, we can understand our Universe without a need for God. It doesn’t show us what God did; it shows us how the Universe is explicable sans a deity.

            “There is no set “Truth of Reality” we all have our own truths within our souls.”

            There are many differences between people and their perceptions and intuitions. The beauty of science is that it distills through all of that bias and identifies what is measurably and objectively true in spite of our personal biases. And it works. It flies planes, creates vaccines, puts men on the moon, and continues to be the driving force of progress for humanity. This accomplishment is not dependent on “our own truths”. It is measurably and objectively true in spite of our individual shortcomings, and you do science a great disservice to presume otherwise.

          • Mark Burns

            And, though this isn’t crucial to the discussion, “This society in general is made for atheists…” is perhaps the most laughable opinion of the state of atheism in America I’ve ever heard. Atheists are equally distrusted to Muslims in the U.S., and I hope I don’t have to delineate exactly how much that is. Search out Pew Research of July 16, 2014 to review the numbers yourself if you’re interested.

            I don’t like being unkind to people, but it was all I could do to make my response to this so measured, tame, and conciliatory. Frankly, your claim is so ridiculous that it truly does deserve to be treated with immeasurably more contempt and animosity.

          • PTA mom

            The “state of atheism in America” is growing every day all you need to do is visit a university or high school, watch television and popular media. Do that and tell me again that it is a laughable comment to make. Atheists are not distrusted, it is just hard to have a critical discussion with any person who immediately assumes you are ignorant or stupid for the very beliefs they want to discuss with you. Good for you for being open minded and being open different opinions, I just want to know why you assume believers are not. I lived a life parallel to yours in ways in that I was an atheist from childhood right up through university and came to “know God” as you would say later in life although I would just call it deciding to have a relationship with my creator. I have not turned back on my faith since but that does not mean I am not open to learning about science or the opinions of others in fact it’s just the opposite I have never been hungrier to learn more about the natural world, history and different societies than I am today. And I will try to end this as quickly as possible , I came to this discussion to do one thing and that was to read a discussion on the Hozier Song and the misuse of liturgical metaphors in popular media. Now without sounding contemptuous – because unlike you, a faceless discussion has yet to bring out feelings of contempt or animosity from me, just curiosity – I want to know how a discussion about a pop song brought you here to this board to criticize people for their beliefs at length. No animosity here, I’m just curious….now ….about that Hozier song.

          • Mark Burns

            “The “state of atheism in America” is growing every day…”
            This is a much, much different statement than your original, “This society in general is made for atheists.” Until 1972, all the “nones” in society comprised only 7% of the U.S. population, whereas it was near to 20% in 2010. The U.S. has only recently become relatively more atheistic, though theists still occupy 80% of the space. That is hardly a space “made for atheists”.
            We can all thank Al Gore for giving us the Internet and making information more readily available and discussion like this easier. It is exposing people to more ideas, and–to your point–atheism is growing more rapidly in recent years as a result. I hope true ideas continue to trump false ones, whatever they may be.

            “…all you need to do is visit a university or high school…”
            I challenge you to find one, singular high school or accredited college that has a class on atheism. It won’t happen, nor can you cite one example of atheism being forced on students. Higher education provides knowledge, and nothing more.
            If you mean that higher education is secular and liberal-leaning, I would both agree and express my approval. But those things are not atheism.

            “…watch television and popular media…”
            I looked. I couldn’t find any popular media about atheism whatsoever, certainly not to have any significant influence over society. There are world-wide television networks that broadcast religious programming 24/7/365. Please find the atheist equivalent and I will concede the point.
            I think you are tilting at windmills, PTA Mom, because I don’t see atheism anywhere in these areas you mentioned.

            “it is just hard to have a critical discussion with any person who immediately assumes you are ignorant or stupid for the very beliefs they want to discuss with you.”
            I have not assumed that you are ignorant or stupid. In fact, I went out of my way in a recent post to say the following:
            “You may or may not have read previously, but I wrote earlier in this thread that I don’t feel intellectually superior to theists…In fact, I went out of my way to point out that I was a believer for far longer than I was a non-believer. I wasn’t dumb before, and I didn’t get smarter afterward. I don’t feel superior to Christians whatsoever and want to go on record saying so.”
            I hope this finally clears it up. I don’t think that atheists are smart and theists are stupid. Have we got that straight now?

            “Good for you for being open minded and being open [to] different opinions, I just want to know why you assume believers are not.”
            I didn’t say that believers in general are not open-minded, I said that you are not. My reason for saying so is because you said, “likewise no kind of “enlightenment” from you will sway them to believe what you say and reject what they believe.” That is the sheer and unadulterated embodiment of closed-mindedness.

            “I came to this discussion to do one thing and that was to read a discussion on the Hozier Song…”
            I came for the same reason, and posted several comments and replies directly relating to the song. Comment threads develop as people inject their ideas, thoughts, and questions, and I am engaged in that development in exactly the same manner as you are.

            “Now without sounding contemptuous – because unlike you, a faceless discussion has yet to bring out feelings of contempt or animosity from me…”
            ‘Contemptuous’ is precisely how you sound in how you’ve characterized me. I have no contempt or animosity. I have a dissenting opinion and the courage to speak my mind. It doesn’t mean I’m angry. Please stop projecting on me. I haven’t been unkind to you.

            “now ….about that Hozier song.”
            Hozier has given an in-depth discussion of what he means to convey with his lyrics. It is easily found with a YouTube search for “Hozier on the story behind ‘Take Me To Church’ – Gigwise Interview”.
            It isn’t about gay rights as many people seem to think (though the music video is themed around the mistreatment of the LGBT community in Russia). Rather than listening to Dr. Nobody give his opinion on the meaning of the lyrics, we can simply listen to the artist explain it. It’s drastically different from what this blogger claims the song is about. Here is an excerpt:

            “I wouldn’t like to think of [the song] as an indictment against religion, or an indictment against institutions, but specifically…institutions that undermine the more natural parts of what it means to be a person…undermine humanity in some way, shape or form.”

            He does go on to discuss how the church falls under the umbrella of that overarching premise, but the song isn’t about the church specifically. The lyrics are broad and open-ended, capable of being applied to many different societal circumstances that fall under this theme of the institutional undermining of humanity.

            Since this is what you came to read and discuss, do you have any thoughts on how the author describes his song in the interview compared with how Dr. Marshall interprets it? I’d be interested to hear if the YouTube interview alters your perception of the lyrics.

            And try to be nicer to me. I’m not your enemy. I’m just a guy who happens disagrees with you on some things.

          • rex

            Well said. I’ve always thought if God exists, he gave us the ability to think and reason for ourselves. But organized religion takes away that gift. It creates sheep. I think its funny man creates a religion or religions that are utterly out of touch with our world.

          • Mark Burns

            Thank you for the comment and the support. With so many different religions throughout the world and history, it makes far more sense that religion was invented by man rather than for man. What God who had the capacity to create the astounding awesomeness of the universe would also be the author of such confusion? With more than 99% of all life on earth completely eradicated/extinct, what all-powerful God would allow something like this to happen? Those who blame it on mankind being fallen and sinful should remember that all this death and destruction took place long before mankind existed on this planet.

          • Cooper Gossage

            Mankind always exited on this planet before the animals

          • Mark Burns

            Silly, silly young man. There are science books at the library that you can borrow and read for free. It contains these things called “facts” that are in direct contradiction with your statement (also known as a false belief). And we can know the difference: the facts have actual evidence that prove them to be true, whereas your false beliefs have no evidence to support them.

            Please do a little bit of reading before you parrot anymore nonsense in reply to my comment.

          • Cooper Gossage

            That’s why he gave you the choice to follow him and live in what will be glorious forever or what will burn your soul forever

          • paula

            I may not agree with you Mark but I do believe you have the right to your opinion. God gave us freedom of choice so we could freely choose him this means you have the right not to choose him although you say you don’t need my prayers I will still pray for you I make no presumptions about you may you have a life full of happiness and joy

          • Mark Burns

            Well, that was perhaps the nicest comment from a theist I’ve had thus far. Thanks for your kind wishes. I hope you have the same. If the praying is for your own sake, pray as much as you’d like. However, if you are praying for my sake, I’d much prefer you didn’t. Our lives our too short and fleeting. If you want to do something for me, invest your time into something that will make you and those you love happy. We don’t have but the blink of an eye to make a difference while we are in this world, irrespective of what happens after we die.

          • Rachel

            You say that God gave us the freedom of choice – but has he? When something goes bad, people say “it was God’s plan”. When a child gets sick “God has a plan for all of us”. If God has a plan, do we really have free-will?

          • Mark Burns

            Great questions, Rachel. Have you seen Sam Harris’ discussion on Free Will? I haven’t read his book, but there is a talk on YouTube that is fantastic. If you haven’t seen it yet, you ought to check it out.

          • A Smarter Atheist

            God dammit you’re the reason why people hate us atheists so much. Just feel good that the Christian wants to offer you his prayer

          • Mark Burns

            First of all, fuck you for telling me how to feel.

            Secondly, I didn’t claim to feel good or bad about it. I just said that I don’t want someone to pray for me. If someone really cares about me and is doing something FOR me, my wishes ought to matter to them, and I’d much rather a person use that time more productively. If my desires don’t matter, they aren’t doing it for me, they are doing it for themselves and/or other like-minded, superiority-complex theists, which segues nicely into my last point.

            I find the suggestion that “I’ll pray for you” to be one of the most smug and condescending comments that Christians can make. I have every right to be offended by it. It smacks of, “I have the truth, your position is invalid, and rather than engage with you about our disagreement, I will dismissively submit your ineptitude to my higher power so that you might one day see the light as I have.”

            If you don’t see how underhandedly dismissive and offensive this flippant disregard is, you aren’t nearly the Smarter Atheist you claim to be.

            P.S. You get both barrels from me because you purportedly are an atheist and I feel no social pressure to lob up softballs for you. Deal with it.

          • Andy Forge

            First off I have read a lot of the discussion that has transpired here between you an many other people, and while this took place a time ago, I felt compelled to… how do you say, make my own view point in this conversation. I am not even half as old as most of the participants, in fact I am probably considered still taking steps into the world in a manner of speaking. But through out my twenty two years of life, I have not been a stranger to belief, if it be Atheism or Christianity. An if there has been one constant in debates between these two choices of belief it is that, there is almost always different people going neck to neck trying to, putting it plainly, prove that one is superior to the other. Please don’t get me wrong having said that, I do not believe that is that is going on here, at least not in some cases anyways.

            My life has been dark, one of those lives that everyday is just another day where you try to find meaning in a seemingly meaningless world. I have spent most of my life trying just to simply find something to believe in, and when it comes to religion, in the end I found it was the only thing I could believe in. Again having said this don’t get me wrong, I am not saying that the only salvation is in the words of the bible, or submitting to a higher power, but my point is tied in heavily with my statement above. This is in the end merely my opinion, it is not a fact nor is it meant to be an answer to finding peace between those that believe and those that don’t.

            But in my experience of becoming religious, as a Christian none the less, is that when Christ lived, he was sinless man, he did not judge nor condemn those who did sin. As it was said any who came to him, regardless of their sin were forgiven. He helped all, and he did not base his kindness on belief, or personal opinion, he did it because he believed (in my opinion) that we all come from walks of life, some are better then others, some are worse, and that regardless of the path that lay behind us that we were all equal. That we all make mistakes and we all deserved forgiveness.

            Through my life I have done things I am not proud of, and no I am not telling you this for sympathy, but merely to express that my mistakes do not make me a bad person, very much like your beliefs do not make you a bad person. Many people call themselves children of god, lambs if this is what term you coin to use, but many of the so called believers do not (again in my opinion) know the true meaning behind Christ dieing for us and what his sacrifice was suppose to inspire. An we all take our own meaning in the end, but when it comes to religion for me, I believe that we are suppose to live our lives very much like Christ did. Not being perfect, or never doing anything wrong that is impossible, but by waking up each day and forgiving not getting revenge, accepting others for who they are not hating them because you don’t see what they see, respecting others and their beliefs with an open mind, not trying to push your beliefs on them in hopes that they will see what you see.

            I am not on my knee’s every night praying nor am I in church every Sunday singing and rejoicing. But just because others do these things or don’t, does not mean their choices in life are wrong, it merely makes us human, humans who have the free will to live our lives the way we deem best for us. I believe that the message in Christ was not to condemn people for not believing or converting people, but for us to open our minds, our eye’s, and our hearts to all rearguards of their religion, their background, their heritage, and so on,. What was meant to (in my opinion) bring us together in a lot of ways tore us apart through many means in which at this point I honestly do not wish to state in this.

            Point is that in the end all of us God fearing or not, need to be able to respect each other, believe in each other, and live with each other peacefully instead of violently based on what we believe. Maybe I am nieve in some ways, but we should all have the ability to live our lives and believe whatever we want to believe without others looking down on us because we don’t see what they see.

          • Mark Burns

            Hi Andy,

            > First off I have read a lot of the discussion that has transpired here between you an many other people…

            First off for me, thank you. I appreciate you taking the time to read and consider what I have to say. You are obviously a thoughtful person and will probably mature into an even more thoughtful adult as you transition into manhood.

            You said A LOT of things that I found interesting, thought-provoking, and worth replying to. But this post will be far too long if I reply to all of it, so I chose a couple of main themes to talk with you about for the purposes of brevity (not one of my strong points).

            First, will you consider what the difference is between atheism and secularism? If this isn’t something that has occurred to you before, let me make a suggestion and get your opinion: someone who is only a secularist is someone who is simply operating without the influence of God or religion. It is a non-issue, perhaps given little or no consideration in the secularist’s life. Contrast that to where I am, an atheist. Far from having never considered it, I have been immersed in religion, and I’ve put in a lot of time thinking about God and religion both before and after deconverting. It is the antithesis of a non-issue. I care very much about believing true things, and have poured over the issues of theism and religion a great deal. I would propose to you that this is a marked difference between secularism and atheism.

            If, prior to converting to Christianity, you were more of the secularist than the atheist, you perhaps have more to learn about atheism as you mature. I would encourage you to continue to learn about both your religion and give time to others’ criticism of your religion so that you can weigh them one against the other and make up your own mind.

            (As a side note on that subject, Pew Research has shown that Jews and Atheists are the two most knowledgeable demographics on religion. I encourage both Christians and non-Christians to know the Bible well. The more you learn about it, the more likely you are to discover the fallacies for yourself.)

            > Point is that in the end all of us God fearing or not, need to be able to respect each other, believe in each other, and live with each other peacefully…

            I couldn’t agree more. In this way, you are wise beyond your years, sir. This is a hallmark of living in a pluralistic society. Everyone has the right to their own beliefs and should be respected. The part where atheists and secular humanists diverge is when this manifests in the public square. Real life examples:

            (1) The attempts to incorporate intelligent design into public education, the stance against gay marriage and LGBT rights, (2) a fire chief in New York who thinks he has the right to post a sign outside the firehouse expressing his devotion to Christ, (3) public school coaches who hold a prayer with their players prior to a football game, and (4) nativity scenes erected on the grounds of city hall in Texas.

            None of these are examples of people merely expressing their personal beliefs. Every single example demonstrates an imposition of a person’s beliefs into taxpayer-funded civic life. These are the things that atheists, libertarians, and secular humanists oppose. It isn’t religion, it is the attempts to impose religion into a pluralistic society.

            When we live in a society where people stop trying to make their religion into all of our laws, we can have the society of mutual respect you describe. But, as long as large groups of people attempt to legislate their religious beliefs into common law, the tension will remain.

            Your thoughts on these two subjects would be greatly appreciated.

          • jOHN C

            THIS,GUY IS SOME SELF APPOINTED INTELLECT WHO IS TRYING TO GET A RISE OUT OF PEOPLE AND HE IS GETTING THE JOB DONE. HE IS YOUNG, AND HIS STUPIDITY IS SHOWING. HE TALKS TALKS AND TALKS, BUT SAYS NOTHING. HE IS THE FLAVOR OF THE MONTH, A YEAR FROM NOW NOBODY WILL CARE.

          • Mark Burns

            I don’t type in all caps, and I can punctuate my sentences. Let’s start with that.

          • maya

            Ok, so I’m doing an analysis of this song for school, and when I went to see what other people thought the message was and found this comment string, I sat here for 15 minutes reading it. To sum it up: I think you’re really cool. Thank you for your amazing comments. I can’t even find the right words. Thank you.

          • brandon

            No you are the reason… dumbass

          • Kleur Creative

            9 out of 10 times when a Christian says I will pray for you, it’s not a compliment. If they are doing so because you are Atheist, where is that something to accept and feel good about? You are not very smart are you?

          • peggy fuchs

            I always pray to God for people, that is what Christians do, we share our petitions to God, I have never ever had anyone offended by my prayer for them, why should praying to a most loving God ever be taken in a bad way. I have even had so called atheists allow me to pray and later said it was strange how things took place after my prayer. Christians who love God love to pray for others, why is this so horrible. ? Are atheists scared that if they are prayed for God might actually answer the prayer?

          • Brandonman9314@Gmail.com

            Wrong we are only limited by the limits we make here on earth. Why would god give us free will and then limit our understanding so that its guaranteed billions of people would end up choosing other religions… In fact that sounds more like God DOESN’T want but less than half of all people that’s ever lived to actually make it to heaven probably less than a quarter of all people

          • Alicia Clark

            Meetup has created a way to have social interaction and togetherness, without all of the hocus pocus.

          • Tom Allen

            Isn’t that what Christianity did? You adopted pagan ritual and incorporated it into your theology in order to gain acceptance. Christmas in December, the cult of Mary, even the Easter Bunny all originate in pagan customs.

          • Mark Burns

            Sure. Christianity has very little if anything that is “original content”. Most of it is borrowed from other sources. We don’t need to make the same mistakes as atheists. We can have community without resorting to emulation of these antiquated belief systems.

          • Alan

            I am an Atheist, and I have no need for ritual or transcendence. As for connection, I have plenty.

          • Alicia Clark

            It’s called meetup. Problem solved.

          • Atheist1

            Love it!
            I’m atheist and don’t claim to hate your god or religious people. Just thought I’d back a brother up. Btw, this popped up in my Facebook feed and I wanted to check out the silliness

          • Mark Burns

            Thanks! Theists have it so much easier when they can set up straw men about what they want us to believe rather than ask us what we actually believe, right?

          • james

            I am far from Catholic but I don’t think it is very manly of you to troll websites and look for things you can attack or name call to make yourself some how feel superior than those you throw stones at

          • Mark Burns

            How am I trolling? Did I miss the “Catholics/Theists Only!” sign at the entrance to the tree house for club meeting? Name one “attack or name call” I’ve made against another person in this discussion, and we can talk it out. If you’re right, I will concede to your point. But I don’t think you’re going to have an easy time finding where I have cone this, because it isn’t how I treat people. You, however, have called me a troll, simply for having a dissenting opinion from others. Apparently for you, a troll is any person who disagrees with you and has the nerve actually write it.

          • Mark Burns

            How am I trolling? Did I miss the “Catholics and Theists Only!” sign at the entrance to the tree house for club meeting? Name one “attack or name call” I’ve made against another person in this discussion, and we can talk it out. If you’re right, I will concede to your point. But I don’t think you’re going to have an easy time finding where I have done this, because it isn’t how I treat people. You, however, have called me a troll, simply for having a dissenting opinion from others. Apparently for you, a troll is any person who disagrees with you and has the nerve actually write it.

            (Editorial note: Just in case I’m right, that is not what it means to be a troll. From Wikipedia: A troll is is a person who sows discord on the Internet by starting arguments or upsetting people, by posting inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community (such as a newsgroup, forum, chat room, or blog) with the deliberate intent of provoking readers into an emotional response or of otherwise disrupting normal on-topic discussion. Oftentimes, a troll is writing vitriol that he or she doesn’t even really believe for the sole purpose of inciting discord. This is far from civil and polite disagreement.)

            And you don’t know how I feel, or what motivates me to express my opinions. I have never said that I am or wish to be superior to anyone else. So, what you are doing here is called a “straw man” which is what we were just discussing earlier in this thread. It’s also somewhat ad hominem as you are attempting to invalidate my positions by questioning my motives (i.e. trolling so that I can feel superior and throw stones at others…none of which I’ve done.)

          • metimoteo

            I like you. You’re a reasoned person. I’m sure I don’t agree with all you have to write, but you’re not a troll.

          • Mark Burns

            Thank you for saying so. I am happy to have people disagree with me. But we should focus on the content of the disagreement, not the person we are disagreeing with. I think I would like you for that reason alone. Thanks for your comment and I hope others follow both of our examples 🙂

          • Crotes75 .

            When people begin loosing an argument or have nothing substantial to back their point up with, they always start attacking the person. Now attacking a person, isn’t very Christian of them is it?

          • Mark Burns

            I agree with your first point entirely. But after all, on the second point, Christians are people too. I would say that when anyone starts losing an argument, the tendency is to go to personal and emotional arguments/attacks rather than focusing on the issue. I don’t expect them to be less human just because they are Christians and supposedly held to a higher standard. In fact, I see it as an opportunity to build rapport and show how we are all in the same humanist boat together. We all screw up, and it is only through open dialogue and healthy communication that we are able to build and grow together. Your comment reminded me of this quote:

            “First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they fight you, then you win.”

            Mahatma Gandhi

          • Michael David Sugg

            I am definitely picking up what you are laying down….keep it up we need more folks like you.

          • Michael David Sugg

            Well, you didn’t study me for I have a 140 I.Q. and I know there is a God and He exists in me in the form of the Holy Spirit plus as my momma always told me, never dicuss something like the Bible unless they have read it from cover to cover….it’s just could form and you would find that the Word would not return void. In Jesus’ name Amen.

          • Mark Burns

            Michael, the study doesn’t work on an individual, case-by-case basis. I also have a high IQ, and did when I was a Christian as well. I am not saying that smart people are atheists and dumb people are Christians. It is a broad and general trend, not an individual study. So please don’t take offense. It wasn’t meant personally.

          • Michael David Sugg

            Roger that.

          • Mark Burns

            Here is an image of the data. As you can see, it isn’t exactly correlative, but far more of the highly religious states are at the lowest end of the IQ spectrum and vice versa.

            Thanks for being so understanding and not taking personal offense. You are clearly an intelligent person.

          • ronson

            I read the bible cover to cover. I have a few questions. Do you believe that Adam was 900 years old? Do you believe the world is 10000 years old? Do you believe that the world was flooded entirely apart from an ark? If the answer to any of these is yes, then your IQ test needs a retest.

          • Michael David Sugg

            You are the April fool. Your lack of understanding is your problem…not mine.

          • peggy fuchs

            Well I do believe Adam aged well, and my IQ is fine, or else I would not be doing postgraduate studies at University. And are you saying that people with a low IQ are worthless. I work with people with disabilities whom many people might consider of low IQ but God loves them just as much as any so-called person boasting on here of their IQ levels, that goes for Mark Burns as well,

            why are you any more important than anyone else because of an IQ, pretty shallow by all means, you criticise on here Christians then judge people by their IQs highly disrespectful to others with so called ‘low IQ’s’. I dare you would not say this to the parents of children with down-syndrome or other intellectual or physical disabilties. Since when does IQ make a person superior? And you Mark Burns are running down Christians for so called acting superior. Loving their God does not mean they are acting superior, it shows their loyalty to God. Why is that so horrible? just not as horrible of course as you judging people by their IQ’s just deplorable

          • Mark Burns

            Hi Peggy. I apologize sincerely for missing your questions to me. Since you replied to ronson, I wasn’t notified of your post. I just stumbled across it now. Please reply directly to me if you want to ask me questions.

            > And are you saying that people with a low IQ are worthless[?] (as any so-called person boasting on here of their IQ levels, that goes for Mark Burns as well…)

            I’ve never said that anyone is worthless, so I’m not sure why you specified me. On the subject of people’s IQ, I have said the following earlier in this thread:

            “You may or may not have read previously, but I wrote earlier in this thread that I don’t feel intellectually superior to theists…In fact, I went out of my way to point out that I was a believer for far longer than I was a non-believer. I wasn’t dumb before, and I didn’t get smarter afterward. I don’t feel superior to Christians whatsoever and want to go on record saying so.

            I hope this finally clears it up. I don’t think that atheists are smart and theists are stupid. Have we got that straight now?”

            > And you Mark Burns are running down Christians for so called acting superior[?]

            I’m not. I am against Christianity, not Christians. If you have a specific example of what you mean, that would help me address your question.

            > …just not as horrible of course as you judging people by their IQ’s just deplorable.

            The post that correlates IQ and religion is a general trend, not a commentary on individuals. I do not judge people, but it is true that the more highly religious the state in the US, the more likely it is to have a lower AVERAGE IQ. Since you are engaged in post-doctorate study, you should recognize that as an observation with no associated judgment.

          • peggy fuchs

            Hello Mark and thank- you for your polite response. as to ‘I do not judge people, but it is true that the more highly religious the
            state in the US, the more likely it is to have a lower AVERAGE IQ.
            Since you are engaged in post-doctorate study, you should recognize that
            as an observation with no associated judgment.’ I think this depends on what religious group you are referring too. There are fundamentalists, the poor, the wealthy, the smart, the not so smart etc in different Church groups. There are Catholics, Born-again Christians, Seventh-Day Adventists etc all professing to know Jesus Christ. So which is the smartest in these groups? Also is this IQ ,referring to what specifically? Example could be someone could be a brilliant accountant, and would have a high IQ in that regard, but may fail on IQ relating to scientific methods and so forth. People generally have specific knowledge on what their level of interest is.
            I love God with all my heart, and my postgraduate studies in Theology is not an easy game. First I did an Associate Degree in Applied Social Science (counselling).Then I did a one year Criminal Justice certificate. I did a Bachelor of Arts and majored in Sociology, History and Politics. Theology studies at Postgraduate level is nowadays not so much what people think is for ‘dummies’, it now involves human rights, studies in sociology, cultural studies and religious studies and archaeological research, it involves counselling and being aware of people’s needs, it involves scientific studies in the proof of Jesus, it involves historical studies of Jerusalem, Palestine, gods that people worshipped, Rome and it’s torture of Christians, politics in Rome, it involves studies on Early Church Fathers, and so forth. I was bought up in a family that were very poor, and I have done this all on my own, and I still breed beautiful Arabian horses. So I don’t think by being a Christian I am dumber than anyone else!!!!
            I’m not too sure of the situation in the USA if that is where you are from. I live in Australia now, but otherwise all my family is German. I am glad you are not against Christians. If someone truly has God in their heart you will see it in the way they live. God has given me a peace that has passed anything this world has ever given me. When a person truly experiences this from God, then you know God is real and goes beyond just a belief. That is why I love God so much, and why I so much would love others to know that love and peace too, I think people would treat each other much more kindly, there would not be all these wars, and hatred would be gone as there would be so much more tolerance to one another. The world can’t give people peace, it is too troublesome,
            after that rant I hope I make sense, thanks for listening too lol.

          • Mark Burns

            > I think this depends on what religious group you are referring too.

            It was generic; simply a percentage of people whose belief in God is “highly important” (or answered 5/5 on the rating scale).

            > Also is this IQ ,referring to what specifically?

            I didn’t administer the IQ test, so I don’t really know anything specifically about it.

            > Example could be someone could be a brilliant accountant, and would have a high IQ in that regard, but may fail on IQ relating to scientific methods and so forth.

            IQ tests don’t measure for specific vocations or applications. They are general aptitude tests that measure a person’s overall intelligence capabilities, or Intelligence Quotients.

            > So I don’t think by being a Christian I am dumber than anyone else!!!!

            I think I’ve mentioned this, but just in case I haven’t: The study measured many people’s IQs from a cross-section of each state in its entirety and came up with an average. There are many individuals who have high IQs and are Christian or any other demographic. The study does not conclude that “Christians (or any other specific group) are dumb.” The conclusion is that atheists are smarter than theists ON AVERAGE. There are plenty of dumb atheists too, so the study does not reflect well or poorly on individuals. It just shows a general trend. And I am in the US, where the study was conducted. I don’t have data from other countries at hand.

          • f

            I’m fine with people believing in what they want and expressing it but not when they use it to negatively affect others from expressing themselves like what’s happening in Indiana.

          • peggy fuchs

            Yes, I also know there is a God, that is the difference ‘belief and knowing’, knowing makes God that so much more awesome. I know God is real is different then a belief. I just truly wish all people would come to know God’s wonderful grace and mercy. God does not need Christians to defend His word, His Word will not return void.

          • Mark Burns

            I would really like to hear in more detail what you say the difference is between knowing and believing. To me, knowing something means that there is some evidence to demonstrate that it is true, and believing is more like ‘an educated guess’. For example, I believe that there is no god, but I don’t know it to be true. (Since it is, by definition, impossible to know anything that is supernatural, it is therefore impossible to know either way if God exists.)

            I suspect that you simply believe very strongly in God, but that you don’t have any evidence by which you can know it to be true.

          • Grandpaeagle

            Unbelief is not an intellectual problem it is a moral problem, “the fool hath said in his HEART there is no God” Psalm 14:1. Athiest’s tend to feel superior to Christians because they feel more intellectual than believers. Your statiscal analysis of religion doesn’t prove who’s right and who’s wrong. This is simply a covering for their own unwillingness to examine their own heart in honesty. If it was simply a matter of facts then why can’t atheits be honest about the the mathematical impossibility of Evolution.

          • Mark Burns

            Hi Grandpaeagle, and thanks for your comment. I have a couple thoughts to share:

            “Unbelief is not an intellectual problem it is a moral problem…”

            My lack of belief hasn’t affected my morality whatsoever. I strive to be, and believe I am, more moral as a secular humanist than I ever was as a believer. If you wish to say otherwise, I’d like to know what evidence or reasons have brought you to this conclusion. Are there more atheists per capita in prison than there are in the general population, for example? Before you bother to look that one up, I can tell you that there are far, far less atheists per capita in prison than in society at large. So, on what basis do you claim that unbelief is tied to a lack of morals? If it is only an opinion, please say so. Because that which can be asserted without evidence can also be dismissed without evidence (even though I just gave some evidence to the contrary for you to consider).

            You may or may not have read previously, but I wrote earlier in this thread that I don’t feel intellectually superior to theists (or Christians, as you specified). In fact, I went out of my way to point out that I was a believer for far longer than I was a non-believer. I wasn’t dumb before, and I didn’t get smarter afterward. I don’t feel superior to Christians whatsoever and want to go on record saying so.

            I am not setting out to “prove who is right and wrong”. It is that sort of dogmatic thought process that I am glad to have escaped. There is room in the middle for the wise on both sides of the issue to have uncertainty, questions, and doubt. My favorite thing about my current world view is that I have the freedom and ability to adjust what I believe when new evidence presents itself. It is okay to question, to doubt, to learn new things and grow from them.

            “This is simply a covering for their own unwillingness to examine their own heart in honesty.” I have examined myself and my religious beliefs for the vast majority of my life. It wasn’t until recently when I found the courage (not the intelligence) to honestly confront the things I believed and stopped glossing over difficult questions with platitudes such as, “Well, God works in mysterious ways…” To say that my reasons for not believing in your God come from a lack of sincere introspection is to presume a lot about a perfect stranger. You’d be wiser to ask more questions and make less blind assertions about people whom you don’t know.

            As far as evolution goes, I say that there is room for disagreement on the details. There is simply too much evidence available to outright deny that it happened, but that doesn’t mean that we have all the details correct. There is still more to learn, and I am happy that scientists and the Scientific Method are not locked into a dogma of believing a rigid and unchangeable doctrine. When new evidence presents itself, reasonable people comport their beliefs to the evidence rather than seek evidence to support what they already believe. I wish I saw more examples of religion doing this.

            “The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.”
            — Bertrand Russell

          • Mark Burns

            Sorry to be long winded, but I recently heard a story that relates to your evolution claim that I wanted to share.

            Bill Nye was regaling an audience with a story from his childhood. Scientists had said that, according to the laws of aerodynamics, bees are not capable of flight. Nye responded, “I spent some time watching bees after I heard that, and I realized that the problem is not with the bees. They can fly just fine. The problem is with the theory.”

            Evolution flies just fine.

          • Anonymous

            Hey I am Catholic and I know this has nothing to do with your comment, but I am happy for you. I may believe in God, but that doesn’t mean that you have to. I respect you decision and although I may not agree with you, I am glad that you sticking up for what you believe in. As long as you are happy and have a good life, then what’s wrong with not believing in God? Sometimes I feel like I am more mature and open minded than most people, and I am only a teenager.

          • Mark Burns

            I’m not surprised that you are an open-minded teenager, and I’m happy for you. Many young people are okay with others disagreeing with them and not taking it personally. Mutual respect…it’s a hallmark of a pluralistic society, and it makes me optimistic for the future of our country. We don’t have to agree with one another, but we have to live together and find a way to make it work, right?

            Thanks for your comment. I genuinely appreciated it.

          • sofianataliee

            Hello Mark Burns, I have been reading many of your posts and would like to say that I admire your boldness and your expression of opinions. I am enjoying your replies – thank you for sharing your points of view. I understand where you are coming from, though personally I am neither a theist nor an atheist; I consider myself agnostic, so I constantly have curiosity in this topic.
            Anyways, you wrote that you were a believer for many years, then you became an atheist as you are now. I made an account here to ask, as I have been wondering, what made you start to question the existence of God after many years of having been a member of a Christian church? And what finally pushed you to the edge that made you absolutely consider yourself an atheist? I’m assuming this took time (months or maybe years, not an overnight realization) but correct me if I am wrong! Thank you for your time 🙂

          • Mark Burns

            Sofia, I have written a lengthy reply to you, but Taylor Marshall’s blog will not post it without approval. It isn’t him, it’s an auto-response, and I know that no pending comments are being approved from previous experience. If you friend me on FB (just ad a forward slash and mark.burns to the URL) I will message you my response. Hope to hear from you!

          • Mark Burns

            What an incredibly flattering comment, Sofia! Thank, you, truly. You started my morning off with a smile 🙂

            Let me start with a very common misconception: Many people believe that atheism and theism are on polar opposites of a belief spectrum, and agnosticism is somewhere in the “not sure”/gray area in between those two.

            This isn’t actually quite how it works. There are two separate but somewhat related scales: On one scale, atheism and theism represents what a person believes, and on the other scale, agnosticism and gnosticism represent what one thinks can be known/is knowable.

            One can simultaneously fall anywhere on both of these spectrums. For example, if you believe that there probably is a higher power outside of the natural order, but you don’t think it is possible to know this with certainty, you would be an agnostic theist. I am an agnostic atheist because I don’t think there is any way to know for sure what lies outside of the natural order (agnostic), but I have not yet seen any compelling evidence to believe that there is a higher power in control of our Universe (atheist).

            Being atheist does not mean to make a strident and rigid stance that “there is no God”. Most atheists are far more likely to say something like, “I am not yet convinced that there is a God, but I am open to evidence that might convince me one way or another.” With atheism, it is enough to simply return to a neutral position where one simply says that there isn’t yet enough compelling evidence to reach a conclusion. Atheists are humble in that, by and large, they don’t assert to know something without having enough reason to reach the conclusion.

            It is the subtle, but yet very important difference between saying, “There is no God”, and “I do not believe there is a God.” Atheists are very often the latter of the two.

          • Guest

            The second half of my response won’t post. Friend me on FB and we can continue the conversation.

          • Mark Burns

            I cannot get the rest of my comment to post. You’ll just have to find me on FB for the conclusion. Sorry for the cliff hanger, but it’s the website’s fault.

          • sofianataliee

            No problem! Instead of Facebook, do you think you can email me at sofias9309@gmail.com?

          • Rachel

            There is a far greater mathematical possibility (and evidence) for evolution than creationism. The idea that a being spontaneously popped out of nowhere, with the infinite power to create worlds. But life slowly evolving over billions of years (despite physical evidence of such) is impossible? There are many Christians out there who believe God created the universe and evolution followed on.

          • Kalj

            Sounds like you guys have discovered Google too

          • aaron

            Actually this is completely false as hominem means against the man it’s an attack against the person in an attempt to discredit their arguement in which case calling the bible storybook or Christians sheep is ad hominem as you are attempting to disprove the arguement by discrediting the source how ever ad hominem circumstantial is when you attack someone based on their circumstances saying they would make an agruement because they are aligned a certain way “of course he would deny having an affair he’s married” thus arguement by ad hominem attempts to disprove his denial by saying he would deny it whether it was true or not due to being married however tu quoqe means you also and attempts to discredit someone by saying that they are in the same circumstance as someone else eg calling them a hypocrite please attempt to avoid butchering logical principles in an attempt to sound educated

          • Susan Carskaddon

            Good answer!

          • Sean N.

            Consider the following:

            Understanding reality requires Knowledge.
            Knowledge comes from Truth.
            Without Truth, there can be no Knowledge.
            How do you recognize what is and isn’t true? Through evidence-based reasoning; that same wonderful faculty that keeps you from walking out blindly into traffic and expecting to be fine.

            Now look at the belief in a god. There is NO proof for such a being, otherwise this wouldn’t be up for debate – everyone would just agree. The religiously minded don’t use knowledge OR evidence-based reasoning; they use Faith.
            Faith is Belief without Knowledge.

            But how can you Believe something without Knowing it to be True and thus legitimately reflecting reality? You can’t. Faith is incompatible with Reason, and therefore Knowledge and ultimately Truth. It is an inherently dishonest position that makes claims towards knowledge, but never truthfully.

          • Bershawn300

            Wow. I can tell you are a philosopher.

            So riddle me this, philosopher:

            1. Evidence-based reasoning presupposes a knowable, intelligible world that follows set patterns and laws. (Its not as if the sun shows up at random times on random days.)

            You can use ‘evidence based reasoning’ only because the world is an orderly place making ‘evidence -based-reasoning’ possible.

            2. An intelligible, orderly world begs the question, how? or by Whom? How does the world become knowable or ‘evident’ if the universe is not a priori orderly and knowable? One could also ask the question: why isn’t the universe more random? Why are there any patterns at all? The orderliness of the universe – or the fact that you or I can use ‘evidence based reasoning’ at all — and that it works — needs to be taken into account.

            3. Using ‘evidence-based-reasoning’, theists come to the conclusion therefore that there is a God.

            4. Consider: does anything that you know in this world just ‘materialize’ in an orderly way out of nothing?

            Does a pile of dirty laundry all of a sudden manifest as a neat, clean, folded set? No.

            Well, yes. It does..at the hand of a person. A Person makes the laundry neat, clean, and orderly.

            Theists use that same evidence-based-reasoning – an orderly universe – as a foundation for the belief that a Designer is at the helm of the Universe, *making* the Universe knowable and orderly.

            5. Clearly you and I run in different circles. Because every theist I know uses this kind of ‘evidence-based’ reasoning.

            6. But you are correct as far as philosophical proofs go. There is no bulletproof, philosophical “proof” of God’s existence and nothing that will persuade a non-theist. For theists, however the empirical evidence of Creation and its orderliness (natural law) is enough.

            8. As a parting thought meanwhile, consider: there is no ultimate bulletproof philosophical “proof” THAT YOU EXIST either.

            In fact, my responding to any more posts like this will be predicated on your empirical and/or philosophical proof that you exist. And that you are not a figment of my imagination. And on you taking a basic class in philosophy.

            Cheers!

          • Sean N.

            1) Your first “point” here doesn’t mean anything. Yes, things happen predictably because the primary rule of reality is cause an effect. This is a fact. There are also universal constants – things that remain consistent regardless of subjective perception or outside influences. By acknowledging this you are acknowledging the naturalistic world view, not discrediting it. LOL!

            Additionally, evidence-based reasoning actually works when it comes to forming predictive models. There has never been an occurance of a “prophesy” or “revealed knowledge” that has EVER happened on a specific date, time and place with any specific details (and why would anyone peddling woo ever be specific? It didn’t work out very well for that senile apocalypse peddler a few years ago, did it?).

            2) Does it beg the question? You do realize that “begging the question” is itself a fallacy. You are seeing “patterns” or “designs” where there is no evidence of it – things in the universe behave in relationship to one another based around, for the most part, well understood, physical reasons. We might not fully grasp how say, gravity works, but we can calculate both it’s range and relative strength. Your cute attempt at pushing the already debunked “watch maker” argument is a sham.

            The universe is EXTREMELY random, and getting even MORE random – I take it you’re not aware of the phenomena of Dark Energy and Entropy? The universe is bleeding out energy as it expands into the void – how and why is just a matter of time to determine. You honestly believe that your tiny, brief existence in the universe on a planet, which, if you hadn’t figured out from the weather is pretty damn random in it’s own right, is an indication of some grander pattern? Wow. Again – Entropy disproves your position – the universe is not perfectly ordered, nor is it being maintained, in fact, it is slowly falling apart.

            Lastly, the human brain does one thing very well – making predictive models to better enable it to interact with the environment. Humans see patterns because that’s what the brain does – it helps them to organize their lives and activities to further their chances of surviving.

            3) Theists come to the conclusion there is a god because a 6,000 year old collection of fables by an illiterate group of inbreeding, desert-dwelling goat herders told them so. Which isn’t to exclude the thousands of other cultures, religions and gods that have “existed” at one point or another only to disappear. Fun Fact: If every christian, jew and muslim disppeared off the face of the earth tomorrow, then the abrahamic god would be “dead”. If the texts were “lost”? Then the religion would vanish utterly. We know about the greek, egyptian, roman and mayan gods – but does anyone in the modern age SERIOUSLY worship them? No, that’s laughable. But back track a few thousand years and they were absolutely, incontrovertibly real. How is YOUR belief in your god any different from theirs? Honestly, it’s 2015, the whole “the ground is shaking, god must be mad” thing is getting a little ridiculous.

            4) You’re really beating that whole “orderly” thing to death, which is funny, considering that we’ve already covered entropy and that your precious sense of order can be sundered in an instant. Consider a thunderstorm that provokes a massive wildfire that destroys tens of thousands of kilometers of ancient forest, utterly devastating an ecosystem and resulting in mass die offs of local animals (assuming they didn’t die in the inferno). That was certainly a very good demonstration of your perfectly ordered world, wasn’t it?

            Oh, the reverse entropy argument, what with the dirty laundry argument. You do realize that things TEND to get more random and that the universe, as physics demonstrates, started at a point of extreme randomness, the universe exploded into existence (likely out of a quantum state, only viable during said extreme random period when the existing laws of our universe are non-existent), and has been degrading ever since back towards that state of randomness?

            You seem to be confused about what “evidence based reasoning” means. What you mean to say is “theists look at the universe, see a bunch of stuff they can’t answer, so they say ‘god did it'”. You have a little problem there champ – which god? Why is it is just one god? Even if you could demonstrate that the universe needed a god, which you can’t (which in and of itself is pretty damning since, again, a universe without a god would be INDISTINGUISHABLE from our current one, and if god was absolutely necessary, such a conception should be impossible!).

            And, I’m sorry but, did you really just cite ancient Mesopotamian’s as having ANYTHING of value to add to the present conversation about the universe. Yeah, no, they don’t – those people thought diseases were caused by malicious spirits, among a whole host of other ASSUMPTIONS based out of IGNORANCE, which is exactly the kind of argument you’re making. “We don’t know, so therefore it must be god!” Not. Hardly.

            6) Bzzzzz. And you were doing sooo well. There is no “natural law”, just like there is no “objective morality”. Those arguments have been long since put to bed. Don’t believe me? Go look up some popular apologetic’s websites – they SPECIFICALLY will tell you which antique arguments shouldn’t be made because they relied on a profound ignorance of how the physical world actually works and just goes to further the image of theists as being a-scientific ignoramuses.

            7) Annnnnd you just argued for Solipsism, which instantly defeats your point. First of all – solipsism instantly results in the loss of the debate because the position is so heinous irrational, and secondly because it also applies to your own position. How do I know I exist? Why, evidence-based reasoning! Let me ask you – how do you know YOU exist? Were you present for your own birth? No? Well, there’s artifacts documenting it, aside from yourself, right? And your parents! But, were you there for your parents births? No? But, you know they exist, because you exist because of them and so on and so forth. So, you rely on evidence based-reasoning in order to acknowledge your own existence as a subconscious act. And again, you also don’t walk out in front of a speeding car because your evidence-based reasoning ability informs you that doing so will likely result in either extreme injury or death. So, how is it that you rely on evidence-based reasoning SO heavily for some things, but you’re willing to just believe what you’re told and have “faith”, despite that fact that every claim ever made by any religion about the world has been both wrong and ultimately deleterious for humanity?

            Lastly, you never bothered to address my little quandary about the incompatibility of Faith and Truth because of the lack of knowledge involved in the former, which leads me to believe that cognitive dissonance inducing analogy frightens you, badly. I love arguing with theists; it’s like debating a five year old. Heh.

          • Bershawn300

            Yea. Great job. You won.

          • Waxil Davidson

            He obliterated you outright.

          • will

            The inbreeding goat herders comment, which seems to be a favorite for people who like to insult a christian for believing in what he does, is a remarkable comment. Have you read the Bible? Have you talked to a goat herder, or an inbred for that matter? I wouldn’t say that intelligence is a quality among them. Yet, some of the language and poetry dictated in the Bible is beautiful, elegant, and well written. Not likely written by illiterate goat herders.

          • Shabadoo

            WOW. I feel like my IQ has diminished from reading your rant. Now, I am just a simple man with simple needs but, the way I see it, the atheist expends and awful lot of time and energy arguing their point to the point of name calling and nearly threatening. Demanding that someone who has had what they believe to be a life changing experience to deny it simply because they say so. Because they are so much wiser than the rest. And no matter where or how you came across this discussion, you inserted yourself into the conversation simply because you wanted to prove how stupid a Christian is compared to you enlightened ones. When the fact is, and unfortunately as do some “Christians”, you’re forcing yourself and your opinion and your beliefs on someone else who, more than likely, didn’t ask for it. You are a bully. Bullies don’t frighten me in the least. As a matter of fact, I’ve never seen anyone talk down to someone in this manner face to face. It’s always over some type of social media or when you’re sure you can hide behind a monitor. The fact is, if we Christians are wrong, we’ve lost nothing, hurt no one and hopefully treated people with love and respect. But what if you are wrong? I know you will not even stop to concider this. But, if you do… If you are really serious about knowing a theist POV, try checking out anything by Ravi Zacharias. He is an amazingly brilliant man.

          • Sean N.

            You IQ diminished because it’s imploding under the weight of reasoning ability and knowledge you cannot grasp, nor have any desire to, because your current belief structure justifies your world view. Which is weak and pathetic – any position, philosophical or otherwise should be able to stand on it’s own merits, based on evidence and reflective of reality without having to rely on assumptions or unsupported superstitions.

            Atheism fights against Theism because Theism thrives off of ignorance and fear. No one would buy into the Theistic BS for one second if they weren’t indoctrinated with a fear of eternal damnation for failing to yield their critical thinking ability and will. I’ve seen children bullied and cajoled in EVERY faith for asking basic questions about their “righteous” punishment. If you think that’s acceptable then frankly you’re a sick monster.

            I don’t want anyone to deny anything on my say so; I want them to validate their claims. If they had a private, subjective experience, then that’s just ducky! But you cannot, nor will you be allowed, to use that as a basis by which to impose your beliefs on others. No one should have to share in your superstition just to validate you. If you lot didn’t actively proselytize and try to make the world a worse place by holding up the bloody Dark Ages like they were the height of human civilization then we wouldn’t have to keep giving you a blood nose.

            I don’t care to read any literature from anyone. Are you aware that Ravi could be lying? I could go out and pen a “moving” book marketed to YOUR specific faith dimension, get it edited, polished, published and people would lap it up, regardless of whether or not I truly believed ANYTHING. You think that a “true” believer can tell the difference? How about all those faithful who’ve been cheated by cult personalities and televangelists over the years? You who has never victimized thousands of people and stolen countless sums of money? Atheists. We don’t want your money. Go buy some books on physics, science, math, logic, history and learn something of actual value instead of how to play pretend for an hour every Sunday and give 10% of your earnings to some showman on a stage who tells you how naughty you’ve been.

          • Shabadoo

            I rest my case…

          • Sean N.

            *reclines and sips some brandy* That you do my dear boy, that you do. Now run along; the adults have work to do.

          • Mark Burns

            Hahaha! You lost your case.

          • PTA mom

            Wow, you really are a very angry learned man. You are too long winded in your rants and way too contemptuous to be chastising people for being bullies and instilling fear in others. That’s a lot of DARK ENERGY coming off your keyboard and it keeps getting more RANDOM the more you type, you might as well just put it in caps lock at this point, looks to me like your head might have it’s own BIG BANG any moment now.

          • Sean N.

            Shhhhh… no superstitious mumbo jumbo please. It’s silly for adults to babble. There is no anger, there is only righteous disdain for charlatans manipulating the meek and vulnerable. The spread of ignorance is a disease. Which is itself sadly funny, because the original meaning of “sin” was “too miss the mark” i.e. to fail to understand, and what is ignorance but a lack of knowledge and a failure to understand? But put another dollar in the box brothers and sisters! Salvation is just a phone call away!

          • Michael David Sugg

            Hey, you just explained Paschal’s wager in which the french mathematician mathematically proved the existence of a God

          • Michael David Sugg

            So you take everything you just said in faith…ahhh ha.

          • Sean N.

            No, faith is believing something without knowing it to be true, in other words, having no proof. Children believe in things like Santa Claus, but only because of the elaborate lies their parents tell them. But they never actually see the magical fat man actually putting gifts under their tree (unless they’re from some rich family, in which case they do that degenerate “elf on the shelf” crap… which winds up just being abuse of the “help” if you ask me).

            The second it’s actually investigated (I mean come on, kids have smart phones and internet access today, you think they’d google it and find out how fake it is, but no, they WANT to believe, just like anyone who has ever clung desperately to a religion or spiritual belief). Why would I want to take something away from people that brings them comfort? Because others unjustly benefit off their blind obedience and actively make the world a worse place to preserve their power. And frankly, if you’ve got a good, strong pair of legs, you need to get up and use them. No point groveling on your knees (or face if you’re a muslim), when hands at work accomplish infinitely more than those clasped in prayer.

            The bottom line is this: You either choose to believe in something you have no proof of, that is contradicted by observable reality in some cases, by logic in others, and by its own source material in yet others, or, you focus on what you can know and you go from there.

          • Mark Burns

            You really glossed over “a knowable, intelligible world that follows set patterns and laws” and said as though it were presumed to only exist by and intelligent creator. The laws of the universe are constant, and dictate exactly the patterns and intelligibility that we see. But you have not established that those laws must of been created or designed. As Sean said in his reply, recognizing the order of the Universe is not the same as determining that it has been designed that way. So you really need to back up and make that connection before you can move forward with the rest of your suppositions.

          • I_am_a_Gladiator/Scandalista

            Yet scientists claim that all this order in the world came from a random “big bang”

          • Mark Burns

            I don’t think that there is order in the world or the universe, for that matter. 99% of all life on Earth is extinct. I find the world to be chaotic and highly inhospitable.

          • Michael David Sugg

            Nice opinion…..but there’s the rub it is only your unsubstantiated opinion because you left out the concept of wisdom which is waaaaaay different then knowledge (Gnosticisim). That can get ya in trouble real fast because I have a high I.Q. but that didn’t save me from myself…just sayin. And on a further note there is knowledge, wisdom, then the biggy Absolute truth.

          • Sean N.

            Wisdom based on nothing is worth nothing. Superstition is garbage. For reference see: The Dark Ages. As for Absolute Truth, that depends on how it is defined. I define it as based on reality, using universal constants to set a standard and go from there. Oh, and unabashed honesty. There’s always that. To quote a the character Ansem from Kingdom Hearts: One who knows nothing, can understand nothing (hey, it was a good quote). Knowledge precedes understanding (or, I suppose ‘wisdom’).

            I’ll give the ancient Eastern philosophers some measure of credit – they figured out early on that there is no value in speculating and fixating on what you cannot know, so instead, we should focus on what we can know. Not to mention, once something has been proven to be fake (like many of the biblical writings and their arbitrary ‘lessons’ as supposedly handed down from on high) why anyone would continue to defend or cling to it I cannot comprehend. You think they’d drop it like a venomous snake (quite the fitting metaphor, eh?).

          • Raymond Denton

            You all seem really bitter. It would seem that your disbelief in God or your “Hope” in Him has not helped you. You just seem to want to be right. Why not do what we all can agree on and love and honor one another. Stop arguing and move one. Don’t waste so much time you don’t have much of it

          • Sean N.

            That’s hand waving. Stop it. No one is making an argument against loving anyone. The issue is you have non-believers one one side who want to be left alone, and believers on the other who DEMAND that everyone and everything align with their particular belief structure (cause unless everyone agrees with them I guess they feel silly? Odd that “faith” seems to require SO MUCH external validation…). No one is bitter either and arguing that life is too short is just more hand waving.

            Modern history has been dominated with the atrocities sanctioned and motivated by religion. Religion and faith have been and always will be the principle enemy of science and reason. If the religious would be consigned to gathering quietly in their places of worship and stop insisting on being given special treatment and recognition (4,200 religions on this planet with 41,000 sects of christianity… so, not happening) then the non-religious wouldn’t have to keep going to “war” with them. Stop trying to pass laws and argue for why your (the religious of the world) should have their beliefs upheld, especially over the wishes of those who don’t share those beliefs and the problem goes away.

            Consider this: There is NO DIFFERENCE between Christians who demand that marriage equality be banned because of their religious convictions and Muslims who set people on fire for violating Sharia law. Both are arbitrary, puritanical, backwards perceptions on human behavior codified into an ancient code of morality adopted by a religion. The law should always reflect the will of the people and preserve the dignity and happiness of humanity, not the inscrutable, contradictory and utterly arbitrary hearsay pontifications of deity (or deities) that no one has any proof exists in the first place.

          • Michael David Sugg

            Please reference the dangers of Gnosticism….its never worked out for those who idolize it.

          • Sean N.

            The dangers are: it’s made up. You can’t acquire knowledge out of thin air, only through empirical testing and observation and rigorous retesting. And even then in some cases you’re only working with a relative or general premise, but it’s still better than completely unfounded speculation.

            I think you might be using that word incorrectly/for your own purposes though. Gnosticism is a Pre-Judaic (well, that’s one school of thought, the one I adhere to at any rate) mystical tradition that really took off when Christianity became popular (Jewish tradition was very tightly bound and unorthodox beliefs would result in exile, which, given their desert dwelling status, was basically the same as death. Gnosticism purports to have the same kind of basis for it’s “knowledge” as those who take it on “faith” – divine revelation. Gnosticism is just considerably more “hands on” and mystical (and arguably more entertaining).

          • Waxil Davidson

            They will only turn when something awful happens to them that cannot be explained by anything other than, there must not be a God. This is why atheism is so rare, because of a lack of imagination among the indoctrinated, well that, plus irrational fear.

            What most refuse to understand is the human sub-conscious, which, when conditioned by society over many years, can be quite the trickster. Human beings naturally fill-in gaps of knowledge, so the lazy fill it in with “God” and scientists seek the actual truth by employing mental discipline to their research.

          • Mark Burns

            In summary, Jesus and the Catholic Church loves you. Now, GTFO until you agree with us.

          • Robin Witham

            Great answer.

          • bajakat

            I’m just here to find out about the song why are you saying people can’t be here I’m just interested in the music

          • jzh jzh

            You are so full of hate and you divulge hate in your reply. If you’re going to be holy then behave like it. Otherwise you are contradicting your self, your beliefs, and the teachings of Jesus Christ.

          • javacado

            Just curious, is this a place for open conversation or just a hangout for like minded people to all agree with each other?

          • Michael

            I can’t speak for someone else, but I came here because of the topic of the post. I’m interested in the discussion. That was not an Ad Hominem attack…it was a literal correction of gfs’s characterization (which is itself a strawman argument)

          • G

            Please note that those truly following Christian faith do NOT and should not judge others, so please bare this in mind. True Christians Are humble and non judgemental

          • Odd Jørgensen

            So like god they are fictional?

          • G

            On the birth of a first child, nature, creation, love – there are NO scientific facts only assumptions as science changes over time. As human beings we cannot explain everything. EG science cannot explain love.
            In life if you are looking to find the worst in people you can. Most Christians are far from perfect and can only try to live up to whats right – after all we are only human. If you go to the poorests areas in the world and meet poor people you will see how generous, humble and non judgemental they are. You will quickly see how materialism destroys whats most important. God is truth, materialism and its benefits are fictional. Your understanding of creation is fictional as you have no answers but human assumptions. Instead of judging all Christians maybe take a step back, be less judgemental, be more charitable, kind and forgiving. Its only in helping each other that we find true contentment in life – we are all on the same journey, lets make the journey as easy as possible for each other as its a short one.

          • Kiki

            Please, jump off a bridge and show us how our assumption of gravity is working these days. Science absolutely explains love. Anything else?

          • Austin Thompson

            Gravity is a law. Not an assumption.

          • Mark Burns

            Actually, it’s neither. It is a theory just like evolution. Newton discovered laws that support the theory of gravity.

          • Austin Thompson

            MIT course 8.01[1]
            Newton’s law of universal gravitation states that any two bodies in the universe attract each other with a force that is directly proportional to the product of their masses and inversely proportional to the square of the distance between the two bodies. (Separately it was shown that large spherically symmetrical masses attract and are attracted as if all their mass were concentrated at their centers.) This is a general physical law derived from empirical observations by what Isaac Newton called induction.[2]

          • Mark Burns

            The law tells us what happens. The theory discusses why it happens. Here is an excerpt from an article on The Happy Scientist[dot]com:

            “We can use Newton’s Law of Universal Gravitation to calculate how strong the gravitational pull is between the Earth and the object you dropped, which would let us calculate its acceleration as it falls, how long it will take to hit the ground, how fast it would be going at impact, how much energy it will take to pick it up again, etc.

            While the law lets us calculate quite a bit about what happens, notice that it does not tell us anything about why it happens. That is what theories are for. In the language of science, the word “theory” is used to describe an explanation of why and how things happen. For gravity, we use Einstein’s Theory of General Relativity to explain why things fall.”

          • Austin Thompson

            I agree with you on that, but gravity itself is a law but the popular question like why it happens and how is when assumptions or theories are established. we all know that gravity exists and if it didnt, well we wouldnt be walking around much less breathing. Thats what im trying to tell the man that was so compelled to state something that was rude. Him being rude to another person triggered my smart remark.

          • susan

            Finally, an educated voice in the wilderness!”

          • Mark Burns

            Thanks Susan! I genuinely appreciate that.

          • Brittany Eileen Johnson

            I never understood evolution… If humans evolved from primates why are there still primates when every other creature that evolved to something else disappeared or “evolved”.. Why is it that they still exist?

          • Mark Burns

            P.S. For extra credit, look up the embryonic stages that humans go through while developing in the mother’s womb. In one of the early phases, one embryonic phase looks exactly the same as fish embryos, and, at one point, we are covered with hair just like monkeys. We shed it off long before being born, of course, but it’s there for all of us. Our DNA contains the same instructions for making features found in a lot of other mammals. We become different as we develop because some genes are activated and others are left dormant.

            You can also research Chromosome 3 in humans. We used to have 48 chromosomes (24 pairs) just like the great apes, but–somewhere in our history, two of the chromosomes fused end-to-end with one another, so we now only have 23 pairs of chromosomes. Now that we’ve mapped the human genome (just ten years ago or so), we can see where they fused together, and also see how precisely similar they are to the same chromosomes in the apes. So modern technology is really helping us see exactly how closely related we are to the monkeys even though we didn’t evolve from them as people sometimes think.

          • Michelle Lebel

            Conceu ismans did not evolve from primates. Humans share a common ancestor with modern apes which existed 5 to 8 million years ago. That species split into 2 different lineages, one of which evolved into apes and the other into humans. You are never going to understand evolution if you can’t even be bothered to learn the basics. If you truly want to have an understanding of evolution and the research that it’s based on, read some books about it. Any credible scholarly literature on evolution will never claim humans evolved from primates. That is a common misconception about evolution.

          • Mark Burns

            You know, you were right in everything you said, and I completely agree with you on the facts. Can I just suggest that your tone sounds a bit condescending? Her question seemed honest and sincere to me. Maybe lob up a softball and acknowledge that she is just like we both were at one time, ignorant of the facts of evolution. Just because she doesn’t know the answers now is not a reason to berate her with “you can’t even be bothered to learn the basics.” Just try to imagine how you’d feel if a post-doctorate in astrophysics made a similar comment to you when you had genuinely sought her out to learn more about a subject you were still relatively naive about.

          • Stephanie Morgan

            Please explain to me if we evolved from evaluation why did it stop with man? why didn’t it keep going? Also i don’t understand how evaluation would KNOW that it needed to make a women for the man so they could reproduce.

          • Mark Burns

            Good questions, Stephanie.

            Evolution did not stop with man. When one understands evolution, we fully expect that it is ongoing…today….right now!

            Humans are very egocentric in how we see the world. We tend to imagine ourselves standing on top of a pyramid–the food chain–with the rest of the animal and plant kingdom beneath our feet. We are the smartest species on the planet, but every other species is equally well-adapted (evolved) to exist in their environment. A monkey could say that it were the best evolved animal in the world because no other animal is as good at swinging and climbing in trees. When you stop looking at the tree of life in this top-down approach, but rather as different branches, you disabuse yourself of the idea that we are the pinnacle of evolution and it has stopped with us. Life and evolution will continue on and adapt life to Earth’s environment long after we are dead and gone.

            As for the transition away from asexual reproduction: evolution relies on two factors: (1) mutation, and (2) natural selection. Mutation is random, while natural selection is not (which is why evolution is not simply a “random” process…only part of it is.) The reason we have two sexes for reproduction is because this allows for more variation in the genes and therefore better chances for mutations. Most mutations are bad and do not get propagated through the gene pool. However, when you get more variation by having both male and female genes blending together with each offspring, the chances increase for the rare positive mutation that helps a species improve and adapt to the environment.

            I realize that that is somewhat heavy of a conversation, and I hope I explained it in a way that can be understood. I’d be happy to answer more follow-up questions if you have them. Thanks for your interest, Stephanie!

          • Mark Burns

            Your question inspired me to learn a little more about evolution “knowing” it needed to make women (aka two sexes, or sexual reproduction). In addition to having genetic variation, there is also something called DNA repair. This is where having two separate sets of DNA (mom’s and dad’s) combine can fix errors in the process. If there is a defect from one parent’s DNA, the other parent’s DNA can help fix the problem. I can’t post a link but you should go to wikipedia and add the suffix wiki/Sexual_reproduction to learn more about it. It’s very interesting, I think. Hope this helps, and thanks for motivating me to buff up on some of the details of evolution. It’s good for both of us 🙂

          • Mark Burns

            Brittany, I can’t seem to send a reply without “waiting to be approved by the moderator”. I’ll see if I can answer your question in a private message.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            // we are all on the same journey, lets make the journey as easy as possible for each other as its a short one.//
            I agree, and to waste that precious time on myths and fables is a foible.

          • Waxil Davidson

            Love is chemical: a subjective cocktail of serotonin, oxytocin and dopamine mostly, wrong again.

          • Bob

            According to relativism, everything is fictional.

          • Anonymous

            No Christinan is perfect except Jesus. Every one judges its just a matter till you notice you have.

          • Brandon Cummings

            By saying that you are judging Christians for judging. God judges people. Everyone is judgmental wether you like it or not. When you come to a conclusion about someone that is a judgment you are making. So why are you so judgmental judgmental of those who judge?

          • Mark Burns

            Brandon, I get you. Judgment can be a vicious cycle. I may be an atheist, but I try to find truth wherever I can. And, on this particular subject I try to continue to employ the advice in the first part of the book of St. Matthew, Chapter 7. I encourage as many people as possible to do so as well.

          • Beenie

            Too bad they can’t spell…

          • Waxil Davidson

            Bear….(e_e)

          • Guest

            Aren’t you judging Christians by referring to the Holy Bible as a ‘story book’? The real storybooks are the urban legends derived from untrustworthy blog posts that claim Christianity has Pagan origins.

          • Mark Burns

            I admit that it sounds unflattering. But it is a book with stories in it. So you can’t blame him for his own opinion on the subject. And by the way, the pagan origins of some of the practices in Christianity are well documented as pagan in origin. But it doesn’t mean that the entire religion is based on paganism.

          • Tea Bagged Ya

            Hello Mark, please forgive my screen name. I really would like to have a conversation with you. I tried numerous avenues and going against my gut instinct to avoid Facebook at all costs, I created an account on Facebook to learn that there are numerous Mark Burns on Facebook. I would prefer to delete the Facebook account and have a discussion in another format, maybe email? Thank you and hope to hear back from you soon. Brandon

          • Mark Burns

            My preference is to have a conversation here, so that others might possibly learn from differing viewpoints. If privacy is of that much importance to you, you can provide me with your e-mail address and I’ll contact you via e-mail.

          • Tea Bagged Ya

            The reason for wanting to speak with you via email is that my questions are kinda off topic. The original topic was about song lyrics and what I would like to talk to you about is Atheism. I hope you understand. Thanks for responding. Brandon – wbfemail@gmail.com

          • Robin Witham

            We don’t judge. That is where you are wrong. If it’s a sin, it’s a sin. God does the judging!

          • Kiki

            We all judge people man, come on. You can’t call all the Christians in the world ignorant for believing that Jesus sacrificed is LIFE for us out of love….and story book characters? Sure Adam and Eve, maybe. But Jesus himself was a real human being. Whether you believe his teachings or not is up to you, but he was a real person. The second testament is almost completely about his life and miracles…if you read the second testament, maybe you’ll see why so many people love him.

          • bek

            No atheist says “I hate God”, there’s a difference between not believing in God and being a devil worshipper. You’re misusing the word atheist.

          • atheist

            atheists do not hate god. worshippers of satan do.

          • Bershawn300

            That’s cute. Meanwhile Jesus said anyone who was not with Him was, by default, against Him.

          • spontaneous chick

            Tho I am only 12 I hope I can be like you I am a Christian and I believe like my dad has taught me and he than you for what you say I look up to People like you my father and God I think we need more people like you in this world instead of all the people who chose to be bad just to make a point that in there point of view god isn’t real I hope one day everyone can understand that Christians walk with God for love peace and freedom not for hate I’m not sure if this all is bad what I’m saying but I’m just a kid but thank you

          • Odd Jørgensen

            And I hope by the age of 13 you will learn to use comma, punctuation and get a grip on grammar.

          • spontaneous chick

            I know how to use Grammar and punctuation I just didn’t feel the need I feel you only stated this cause you had something against what I said I didn’t mean no hate in what I said and you tried to make me out to be a bad person cause I spelled something wrong or so I don’t care I was just sharing something I hope you got the true meaning of what I said and if anyway I offended you I’m sorry I just wanted you to know and I’m sure by age 13 I will know the true meaning of life and why you someone idk can hate on my spelling I will assure you that I am not dum I’m just trying to live my life also by explaining my love for people so thank and I will get on my spelling if you realy care and I don’t take this in a bad way just in a way you were trying to teach me so thank u and I know what you said was sarcasm but realy thank u

          • Odd Jørgensen

            You`re welcome lol, and for future use, these are on me ………,,,,,,,,,, feel free to use at your convenience 🙂

          • spontaneous chick

            OK that’s kind of funny my dad laughed but seriously I don’t care about punctuation, grammar,or anything just read what I said put some thought to it

          • JUSTINE MEE

            Sweetheart you believe anything your beautiful heart desires! You are decades more mature than that loser attacking your grammar! Sad that anyone feels the need to attack a child!

            Despite what scum like they believe, (and would like to stop you from doing) you have the right to believe anything you want! You also can express it however you desire! Grammar be as damned as a self righteous troll that goes after little kids!

            Consider this a lesson honey! You have just been introduced to liberalism and one of its mentally disturbed minions. Yet you stuck to your guns and fought well. Never let them tamper your passion and your faith! You are a great kid! Bless you kiddo!

          • spontaneous chick

            I thank you for your opinion you sound like a great person however I do not know proper punctuation ..lol I watch CNN I fear for the world but the best way I can express my feelings is to be kind to people and hope and prey that others will feel the same I think that religion is very important unfortunately it’s came to my conclusion that religion has started all wars and will end all wars I’m afraid for my little sisters and newborn brother p.s my father trains us after work everyday with tools that only hurt people accuracy and hand to hand. I feel I can do Jesus work with my mind I will never hurt anyone please prey for me my thoughts are with you

          • CommunismIsWhatJesusPracticed

            You shouldn’t watch CNN. Big money businesses own mainstream media and they only show what they want you to see AKA propaganda, just like the Nazi’s use. look up Vice news or one of the non profit media outlets. CNN will brainwash you into believing what the powerful want you to believe before you know it. God Bless

          • spontaneous chick

            That’s not all I’m trying to say but can’t you see what the world is coming to hate killing, lying ,stealing,rape,money it’s all evil The best thing we can do is prey it’s not just on CNN it’s everywhere I can see it in people theyes bad things happening everyone knows we don’t know what will happen but the government is hiding things they have very little that can tell us it just hurts to know how many people are dying everyday cause of hate and how people don’t care I do I really do fear for this world cause it’s hard to believe that people do these thingsgod d is going to save all the people who believe I’m not bashing the atheists or anything else it’s just there are bad people in this world that don’t care and I fear that they will never stop they arnt willing to believe d they just do things as they please I pr ay for every one that I meet and ones I haven’t met god bless all

          • CommunismIsWhatJesusPracticed

            Do you not think that the almighty God is acting petty by neglecting his creations which choose not to follow him based predominantly on the evidence against him like the injustices and the evils in the world. Is it not a hypocracy to neglect his children which he created in his image and are therefore in themselves a part of God? is it not a hypocracy that he would give life only to demand it be spent on your knees thanking him for it. Are his behaviours in the old testament not jealous and capricous?

            “The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most
            unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty,
            unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic
            cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal,
            filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously
            malevolent bully.”- Richard Dawkins.

            is it not true that religion has yet to contribute to the zeitgeist. Is it not a hypocracy that Christians choose to follow only the rules they like? for example condeming homosexuality, which is a very natural thing and can be seen in many places in the animal kingdom and is in fact not a choice but how they were created, but they choose to eat non Kosher food like pork? and if we are all made in God’s image then is God not himself gay by definition? Has religion not been the cause of the most bloodshed ever? I just think the whole “Love your neighbour,” thing is completely non existent. Mass Islamic hate exists in Christianity and how can someone call themselves a Christian when they are full of hate? they can’t but many, many do. Evil is in the world, but it is in the manupilation of the faithful as much as anything else. blind faith is ignorant and the fact that next to no Christians have read he bible is absurd because they believe in something they have no in depth understanding of. Organised religion is wrong. Religion should be practiced in the home, along with all belief systems. Is it not absurd that creationist don’t believe in Dinosaurs? Even though carbon dating and paleontological studies have not only proven that the world is hundreds of times older than creationist believe, but also has helped explain bridges in the evolution theory? The Church had a man put on house arrest for life for exposing that the world goes around the sun and therefore (this being only one example) have hindered the advancement of man kind? When people attribute there successes to God, do they take away from the accomplishments that they have made on their own? would the Christian lord not allow a non believer, like Gandhi for example, who have helped hundreds of millions, into heaven? and if he can make an exception must he not make an exception for all others who have done good? there are a lot of answers and progress has never come without questioning everything. if everyone were a blind follower then we wouldnt have Medical Care (i live in ireland where almost everyone is entitled to Medical Care (even though they’re cutting back recently)). If we all had blind faith we would just pray for our friends and family to get better, but would they? no they wouldn’t. religion not only hinders progress but it makes people apathetic and complaincent, puppet like, just like the government want them. You’re young enough to open your eyes and really look at the world, so i hope you do
            God bless

          • dianiline

            God does not neglect *anyone*, although many people neglect Him. In Old Testament times, God behaved toward His people in ways they would understand, so that they would behave in ways that benefited them. You cannot judge God and should not attempt to; He is God, and where you think you understand Him, you are wrong.

            We must all follow God’s rules, inasmuch as we understand them, but you are not to assume that you know anything about the salvation of anyone else based upon what you know of their behavior and what you know about the rules.

            Religion is the most powerful reason for not being apathetic and complacent. We will have to answer to God one day for our failure to care and to act to better our society. If it makes you apathetic, then you’re not paying attention.

          • Bob the builder

            God only hoped that the rules that he put out would be followed but look you guys questioning honestly could u imagine this world if everyone listened it would be amazing no worries at all you could run around as late as u wanted in anywhere god gave you free will god didn’t create evil we made it

          • Mark Burns

            I hope the day never comes that we universally follow the morality of the Bible. I, for one, am against the murder of children and genocide (Exodus 12:29-30, 1 Samuel 15, respectively), as well as the reinstatement of the institution of slavery (Leviticus 25). God both created and endorsed these actions. Homosexuality is denounced as being “unnatural” while there are thousands of documented species on Earth that engage in homosexuality. You know what is not practiced as “natural” by any other species? Lifelong celibacy as is done by the Catholic priesthood and nuns. Let’s not even address directly the crimes against children committed by these “people of the cloth”, whose deeds are too gut-wrenching to overtly specify.

            We can do better on our own, Bob.

          • CommunismIsWhatJesusPracticed

            Do you not think that the almighty God is acting petty by neglecting
            his creations which choose not to follow him based predominantly on the
            evidence against him like the injustices and the evils in the world. Is
            it not a hypocracy to neglect his children which he created in his image
            and are therefore in themselves a part of God? is it not a hypocracy
            that he would give life only to demand it be spent on your knees
            thanking him for it. Are his behaviours in the old testament not jealous
            and capricous?

            “The God of the Old Testament is arguably the most
            unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty,
            unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic
            cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal,
            filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously
            malevolent bully.”- Richard Dawkins.

            is
            it not true that religion has yet to contribute to the zeitgeist. Is it
            not a hypocracy that Christians choose to follow only the rules they
            like? for example condeming homosexuality, which is a very natural thing
            and can be seen in many places in the animal kingdom and is in fact not
            a choice but how they were created, but they choose to eat non Kosher
            food like pork? and if we are all made in God’s image then is God not
            himself gay by definition? Has religion not been the cause of the most
            bloodshed ever? I just think the whole “Love your neighbour,” thing is
            completely non existent. Mass Islamic hate exists in Christianity and
            how can someone call themselves a Christian when they are full of hate?
            they can’t but many, many do. Evil is in the world, but it is in the
            manupilation of the faithful as much as anything else. blind faith is
            ignorant and the fact that next to no Christians have read he bible is
            absurd because they believe in something they have no in depth
            understanding of. Organised religion is wrong. Religion should be
            practiced in the home, along with all belief systems. Is it not absurd
            that creationist don’t believe in Dinosaurs? Even though carbon dating
            and paleontological studies have not only proven that the world is
            hundreds of times older than creationist believe, but also has helped
            explain bridges in the evolution theory? The Church had a man put on
            house arrest for life for exposing that the world goes around the sun
            and therefore (this being only one example) have hindered the
            advancement of man kind? When people attribute there successes to God,
            do they take away from the accomplishments that they have made on their
            own? would the Christian lord not allow a non believer, like Gandhi for
            example, who have helped hundreds of millions, into heaven? and if he
            can make an exception must he not make an exception for all others who
            have done good? there are a lot of answers and progress has never come
            without questioning everything. if everyone were a blind follower then
            we wouldnt have Medical Care (i live in ireland where almost everyone is
            entitled to Medical Care (even though they’re cutting back recently)).
            If we all had blind faith we would just pray for our friends and family
            to get better, but would they? no they wouldn’t. religion not only
            hinders progress but it makes people apathetic and complaincent, puppet
            like, just like the government want them. You’re young enough to open
            your eyes and really look at the world, so i hope you do
            God bless

          • MaggieTheCat

            Bad things have always been present unfortunately. I think most can be associated with mental illness and power and money. There are bad people in this world, and they all claim different religions or no religion. As well as there are a lot of good people in this world, that also claim different religions or no religion.

          • dianiline

            Communism is not what Jesus practiced. Depending upon the providence of God is what Jesus practiced. The early Church practiced a form of Communism, holding all possessions in common. This is also somewhat like the economy of every normal healthy family: Each gives according to his ability, and takes according to his needs. However, the “taking” is usually regulated to some degree by the primary givers. Communism, in any form, can only work in a small community of people who are deeply committed to each other. It is hopeless on a large scale.

          • MaggieTheCat

            Despite what scum like they believe, (and would like to stop you from doing) you have the right to believe anything you want! — as long as it’s Christian based. Anything else will be bashed lol.

          • Bershawn300

            So adorable, bashing children’s grammar. How proud you must be of yourself.

          • JUSTINE MEE

            What an ahole! No prouder a parent they must have, to have raised an immature loser that attacks children! Why are all liberals and atheists so fired up about something they don’t believe in? Lmao

          • CommunismIsWhatJesusPracticed

            How can you call someone immature and a loser (the most 5 year old thing you can call someone) in the same sentence? #Assinine

          • JUSTINE MEE

            Coming from someone with a screen name calling Jews “Communists” I wouldst take anything from your insanity with a bucket of salt lmao!

          • MaggieTheCat

            Probably because what they don’t believe in tries to dictate their lives….

          • Steve H

            It’s a shame that a 12 year old talks of peace love and freedom, and after a (somewhat harsh) critique of her grammar, has to witness others use words like ahole, loser and troll. Have we forgotten what it is to be Christian since our childhood?

          • spontaneous chick

            I know thank you for all you people who stuck for me but he is right don’t get mad at someone who is not mature I appreciate all of you but remember some people in this world arnt worth your time like the one correcting my grammar I thank you all please keep peace in your heart cause I know that you guys are truly beautiful in the inside I understand I’m not mad I just want you guys to know that if someone of hate wants to get the best of you remember god has all of you

          • theburningfire

            In seriousness though, you seem to have a humble heart and thirst for knowledge and a lot to contribute. You will find it it easier to communicate and be heard if you at least add some periods in there to separate your sentences. Reading blocks of text that look like the speaker isn’t stopping to take a breath can give a guy a headache. 🙂 That’s not an attack or insult, just hopefully a bit of helpful advice to help your voice be heard.

          • spontaneous chick

            I know thanks lol it’s just kinda weird writing on a tablet I honestly don’t pay attention just type fast idk I’m just bored and yeah but thanks I’ll try more besides on what I just wrote lol sorry that guy made it seem like I didn’t know what I was doing but I’m an intelligent reader and writer I’m not yoused to this on a tablet sorry for your headache lol have a nice night

          • dianiline

            Girl. You seem to have good thoughts and a good heart, but for Christ’s sake learn how to use the language. He is the Word. God is a God of order, not of chaos. The Word is unintelligible without grammar. You need to pay attention to what you are writing; being bored is no excuse. “Prey” means to hunt and kill, as my cats prey on the mice and birds. You want to ask people to “pray” for you, that is, to speak to God or the saints and ask their intercession for you. Please. It is Satan who wishes you to be careless with words; it is the same as being careless with the Word. Please ask your Dad to help you with this. If he can’t , then ask for a good grammar book or course, or look for one at the library. You have good things to say; learn to say them clearly and with force. God bless you!

          • MaggieTheCat

            OMG get off her back. She’s 13. She’s still learning. Her bad grammar is because of Satan? Are you for real? Learn to say them with force?? Ummm no. I think her having a sincere heart and soul is working just fine for her. She doesn’t need to force anything upon anyone. I can just see Jesus jumping online here pointing out everyone’s grammar mistakes lol. Oh wait – what if he came online but his English wasn’t that great, cause ya’ know he didn’t speak it. Would you give him a lecture on how he needs to learn the language properly? SpontaneousChick – please please ignore these people. The older you get, the more school you are in, the more online conversation you partake in – you’ll get it. Don’t worry about it. You communicate efficiently. You spelled pray wrong – but guess what, we all knew what you were talking about. There was no need to point it out in a taunting way.

          • ZociallyConscious

            She SAYS she’s 13. But she has a very mature outlook and has successfully hijacked more than half the thread with very on point and very articulate commentary (despite the lack of grammar or punctuation, which incidentally is exactly how I would write if I wanted to sound 13) – but either way, kudos to you S Chick. 13 or not, well played.

          • CommunismIsWhatJesusPracticed

            The only person who has practiced Christianity in their response to this. Thank you for that, they can learn from you

          • Christine

            Your comments to a 12 year old are disgusting and only make you seem petty and pathetic.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            You trying to belittle the 12 year old by insinuating he needs your protection is disgusting. Maybe you failed to see that he was a good sport and saw the humor in it, or maybe not…Bless your little heart.

          • Beenie

            Remember – you were born an atheist. It took brainwashing to make you believe in the sky fairy. Do some reading and use you own head.

          • lilly brown

            You should read some yourself he’s not a sky fairy he sent his son here to prove that he is real. Had no brainwashing I have my own beliefs. Do you know the history the truth is nobody really know exactly what happen but he made a book so ywill believe and do good.He will come here someday and if you want to mock him so be it,but I will have no part of it

          • Lilly Brown

            Lilly Brown is me spontaneous chick just saying

          • Odd Jørgensen

            Why do you hate Zeus and Odin?

          • Eric Witt

            I thought that was George Bush.

          • Mark Burns

            And meanwhile Mark says that anyone who is not with him is not with him. Who cares what he says. That doesn’t make it true.

          • Bershawn300

            You are entitled to your belief. However, realize that you are asking people to accept what YOU say as true. Of the two choices – whose view is the truth –my bet is on Jesus. I don’t fully trust my own track record either, fwiw.

          • Mark Burns

            At least with me, you have a direct source quote from a living, breathing person. I have no reason to believe Jesus said anything the Bible claims he said, or that it is any more inspired than any other prominent historical figure. I don’t say that Biblical texts are uninspiring, just that the Bible is no more valuable of a source than any other writing can potentially inspire us.

          • Far

            “That’s cute. Meanwhile Jesus said anyone who was not with Him was, by default, against Him.”

            Matt 12:30 *You take that out of context.*
            That is in one verse talking about honest and Truthful following of his teachings. That there are those who will try to distort Jesus teachings and twit them to their own purposes, like
            In another, Luke 9:49-50, when the Apostles tell Him about trying to stop a non-Apostle healing in His name, Jesus says those who are not against Him are for Him.

            The Truth of what Jesus means can be seen in the world today. Atheists claim they want to help people, but try to stop Christians helping people.

          • Bershawn300

            We are of the same opinion, I think? The Matthew verse IS about whosoever is *with* Jesus being *for* Jesus. But, by default, this also demonstrates that those who are *without* Him are also *against* Him. There is no middle ground — ‘crown Him or kill Him’ are our only options.

          • Gandolfication

            First, I’m not sure what my comments or anything I’ve commented on has to do with atheism. You’ll need to explain this, and why and how you think I have ‘fallen for the false teachings of atheists.’ I have little desire to wonder how you may have fallen for the ‘false teachings of the Catholic church.’

            But on atheism (and I have at times been one), merely lacking a belief in god does not necessitate hating a god. It can, however nevertheless coexist with a sense of angst at the seeming meaninglessness of the universe and life, given the type of creatures we are, with an intellect, emotions, and even moral sensibility.

            What I think makes MORE sense, is a sense of injustice at THE WAY that a creator-deity appears to e and to allow things to be in this world.

          • Bershawn300

            Dear Sweet Person who goes by name Gandolfication and claims to not be Christian,

            Please graciously allow me to point out the following:

            1. Gandolf is a creature from LOTR. Written by JRR Tolkein. Who was a Christian.

            2. You are on a Catholic-Christian website.

            I thought maybe you have stumbled onto this website thinking it was the Friendly Atheist or something. Maybe you thought it was Lawrence Krauss’ site? Either way, your presence and comments here seem a bit unorthodox.

            Unless beneath all your huffing and puffing you really ARE a Christian or secretly want to be!

            Yes I think that’s it! 🙂

            Blessings.

          • Hm

            Gandalf* is a character* in the Lord of the Rings series.

          • Bershawn300

            That’s exactly what I said. 🙂 The original poster spelled it “Gandolf” though, so I spelled it as such. My first point says “Gandolf is a creature from LOTR. LOTR is short for “Lord of the Rings”.

          • Eaton Beavers

            I don’t hate what I don’t believe. I beleive in facts, truth and science. I challenge all of you to read “The God Delusion”. It will make your faith stronger, or make you realize you wake up.

          • Austin Thompson

            I’m not here to argue but I’m here to discuss. When you say you believe in facts, truth and science have you not reflected on the history of earth? At one time people walked around thinking that the earth was the center of the universe, but sooner or later a well known man with the name of Galileo came and discovered that fire ball of gases you call a sun was actually the center of the galaxy. I’ve told this story to show you what people thought was “true, fact, and science” were proven wrong. In this day and age we live in today, everyone is entitled to an opinion or a constructed belief that may or may not have a impact on the lifestyle you live. I respect your beliefs and your right to that, but I wanted to try to enlighten you on the subject of what humans have yet to discover on this earth and especially in this galaxy and so forth including a creator of some sort . In my eyes itit’ss God, in yours it may be different. If you read all of this thank you for your time. I mean no offense with my statement(s) just a discussion of “truth, fact, and science”

          • Sophie Jayne Barrie

            Who that has ever called themselves an atheist has said they hate God? In fact it’s the religious that claim atheists hate God- we would tell you the same thing you spelled out here: we can’t hate something that has no existence

          • Capitano

            God bless u

          • Sad forgod

            Most people that hate God don’t call themselves anything, here’s the breakdown. Atheists: say there is not a God only science, they hate people like the author of these hate posts. Agnostic: accept they don’t know either way. Satanist: most don’t hate God, they live almost by the Hamurabi code (opposite) Christians (supposed) to turn the other cheek, they are eye for eye that kind of thing. People tend to hate God because people use Him to convince the world that person is a sin and God hates them, people like these (and republicans)

          • Joe

            Just remember man that the people who practice devil worship used to and in some cases still do sacrifice infants, have mass lesbian, gay, by, orgies, not so they can experience happiness but it’s to given to them by the devil so as to spit in the face if Jesus. Once a deceiver always a deceiver.

          • ledmikew

            That’s terrible! Where are these massive lesbian orgies exactly? So I can avoid them.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            I would like to know as well where these orgies take place, purely for research purposes of course…

          • jimmy nobody

            There are atheists and there are anti-theists. Anti-theists will generally say ‘
            ‘ How can I hate something that doesn’t exists’. But apparently it is something they give a lot of thought to. Bill Maher is an anti theist. He does not just say ‘believe in a god if you like, but I don’t’. He needs to preach atheism. People like him have made it a religion.
            So yes there is a sect of atheism that it would be accurate to say they hate God. Or at the very least the idea of God.

          • Bargalhandle

            So, I’m an atheist. I’ve got _nothing_ against people who a religious. My mom’s a devout Catholic, and I love her. Very much – and I love her faith, it helps her and she finds comfort in it. That’s wonderful. Also, i agree with you, that it’s ridiculous to hate something you don’t believe exists, and I don’t “hate” God. Heck, I don’t know that I hate anything (maybe NECCO wafers – there’s nothing to love there, really). All that said, while there are some loudmouths out there who seem bent on attacking Christianity, and claim to speak for “atheists”, I don’t get that, either. This isn’t some organized movement, to me – I don’t join atheist groups, not even on Facebook. I just… don’t really worry about it. I like science, facts, and data, and I follow them to their logical conclusion, which seems to point to the idea that supernatural things, like God, unicorns, etc etc are great fun for the movies, but that’s that. Again: just my personal belief. I don’t preach against belief, and respect (while not fully understanding, but I don’t need to always have all the answers) that some people believe in the supernatural. I hope this helps you, to know that most atheists I know really don’t care what you believe, as long as you respect the rights of those who don’t agree with you.

          • The first will be last.

            The lord will visit you tonight and ask you to be a witness. Reply after this happens and tell me your experience.

          • Stanleyrama

            The lord did visit me last night. I smoked a joint with him and kissed him on the mouth. Thank you for leading me to him.

          • Dave

            Well said

          • unGodly

            why do those who follow a religion come off as if they have all the answers, your bible was written by a man not a God. What you believe comes from man not a God, and your arrogance well that’s just the fault of you and your church.

          • Me

            Obviously you have never read the Bible (this should be capitalized) because God (should be capitalized also), gave the knowledge to the men of God to write the Bible, which he guided them throughout the writing of, and the 10 Commandments are also in the Bible, which god himself, with his finger, wrote on the stone tables on Mount Sinai and then gave to Moses, and if you do not believe me then I will even put in the scripture from the Bible. From the King James Version Bible; Exodus chapter 31, verse 18; And he gave unto Moses, when he has made an end of communing with him upon Mount Sinai, two tables of testimony, tables of stone, written with the finger of God. And we who do believe in God and do have a religion are not all bad, some will shove the word of God in your face and then be very rude about the way the try to get you to join their church, not all Christians are like that, and religion doesn’t necessarily define what type of person you are, it is simply the title of the church you go to and their beliefs hat you uphold in your walk with Christ. Please before you say bad things about religion and those who actually read the bible and follow Christ, bother to enter a church door.

          • Sisteralice

            Amen!

          • Sadforgod

            This is actually only half true. Yes God provided Moses with the word for the ten commandments, but the Old and New Testaments are stories passed down to teach us of God. The Old is the stories from the old tribes as to earths beginnings; and the New is the teachings of Christ as written by Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John. God himself did not partake in these writings, and yes, it is a valid question as to whether through the times and translations if the Word has been compromised by mans sin. to this day we are still finding scriptures such as Lilith. Who are we to deny her as truth or fiction. Our job is to love all and live life the best we can as God is our conscience and is different for everyone, you can feel it when you sin can’t you (guilt), gays say they don’t feel their love is a sin so perhaps for them it is not…. Food for thought

          • Odd Jørgensen

            None of the gospels were written by the names attributed to them.

          • Bershawn300

            Thank you. You are an authority on… what? One should believe you…why??

          • Odd Jørgensen

            Acts 4:13 states John and Peter could neither read nor write

          • Bershawn300

            Actually it doesn’t. I guess you get points for effort. But what it actually says is that Peter and John were ‘unschooled, ordinary men.’

          • Bershawn300

            You are misreading that Scripture using a personal interpretation.

            Meanwhile, back in actual documented history, the Mishna, (which contains actual rabbinical commentary on Scripture at the time of Christ) describes the educational process for Jews during Jesus’ time:

            1. Jewish children began studying Scripture at five (Beth Sefer).

            2. Students would put it into practice at thirteen. (Beth Midrash)

            3. At twenty, students pursued a vocation.

            4. At thirty, students could become teachers/rabbis themselves (Talmidim).

            ‘Unschooled’ does not mean ‘can’t read or write’. It means Peter and John did not go on to the final stages of formal Jewish education – the Talmidim – to themselves become rabbis. The men questioning Peter and John in the Acts 4 passage were rabbis and could not understand the divinely-given wisdom and actions of Peter and John since they had not been through Talmidim.

            Being Jews though, Peter and John obviously had basic training in Scripture, reading, and writing since it was part of basic Jewish culture at the time.

            Nice try.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            And with a 3% literacy rate, that means only the elite urban jew would know how to string a sentence together on paper(or vellum or whatever they used, papyrus?)

          • Bershawn300

            Actually it doesn’t. What it actually says is that Peter and John were ‘unschooled, ordinary men.’

            You read Scripture using a personal interpretation rather than reliable sources and credible history.

            Back in documented history, the Mishna, (which contains actual rabbinical commentary on Scripture at the time of Christ) describes the educational process for Jews during Jesus’ time:

            1. Jewish children began studying Scripture at five (Beth Sefer).

            2. Students would put it into practice at thirteen. (Beth Midrash)

            3. At twenty, students pursued a vocation.

            4. At thirty, students could become teachers/rabbis themselves (Talmidim).

            ‘Unschooled’ does not and did not mean ‘can’t read or write’ (any more than it would mean that today; plenty of people don’t have university education; it doesn’t mean that they can’t read or write). It means Peter and John did not go on to the final formal part of Jewish education – the Talmidim – to themselves become rabbis. The men questioning Peter and John in the Acts 4 passage were rabbis and could not understand the divinely-given wisdom and actions of Peter and John since they had not been through Talmidim.

            Being Jews though, Peter and John obviously had basic training in Scripture, reading, and writing. It was part of basic Jewish culture at the time.

            Any basic Jewish history book will show this.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            In Roman Palestine the situation was even bleaker. The most thorough examination of literacy in Palestine is by a professor of Jewish studies at the University of London, Catherine Hezser, who shows that in the days of Jesus probably only 3 percent of Jews in Palestine were literate. Once again, these would be the people who could read and maybe write their names and copy words. Far fewer could compose sentences, paragraphs, chapters, and books. And once again, these would have been the urban elites.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            There is a reason it is known as “The gospel according to”…

          • Bershawn300

            There is a real lack of knowledge, understanding and scholarship in your comments. You provide no sources. Do you believe yourself to be self-authenticating?

            I suppose you expect people to chuck their brains out the door to accept your drivel. Meanwhile…there is real history and solid information.

          • George

            god bless you for telling the true meaning of this song but my question is why would someone write this song im guessing it was hoziers realigion

          • Hi, I’m Bob.

            Hozier did have a religious background. He was raised a Quaker. His dad went to a christian school. He went to a Catholic school, but actually, he never said he was atheist. This quote: “I still wouldn’t define myself as an atheist – it’s too absolute. But I don’t have any faith. I think faith is an absurd thing but I’m OK with that. There are no answers because the universe never asked a question in the first place.”

            I’m not defending him or his song. Personally, I find it very offensive. I think its rude to say something like that about someone else’s beliefs, but you all have made this a bigger deal than it is. Its not about how horrible atheists are or how unintelligent Christians are. I’m sure there are horrible Christians and atheists (I’ve met both) and there are unintelligent Christians and atheists too (I’ve met a lot of both). You can’t categorize entire groups under one label. If you try to, you’ll just end up looking like an idiot.

          • theburningfire

            That was an absolute statement about a claim that is, at best, uncertain. If you want to say that “many scholars doubt that the gospels were written by the names attributed to them,” you’ll have some accuracy (though many also believe that they were written precisely by the names attributed to them). But if you’re going to make a statement, please aim to be as truthful and educated as possible.

          • jimbobmaria

            Sexual orientation does not necessarily mean you love someone. Sexual orientation means you are sexually attracted to them. Affectional orientation is what you would consider love. Just because someone says they do not feel guilty, does not mean they aren’t. Also, sexual orientation is not a sin. Acting on it is.

          • Sadforgod

            And to those who don’t believe, they do not capitalize God; they view him as we do the pagan gods. Sadly, people like you are the ones that create that hostility with your ritcheous hate. For the atheists in the crowd, believe me, God will have his say to all of us. Those who are using Him as an excuse for hate and pain will have their judgment same as the rest of us as no sin outweighs another.

          • Me

            I do not want to be rude to you because I am a Christian and believe that love should be shown to everyone even those I do not know, but I do not create such “hostility with my righteous hate” (which you did spell wrong). I do not hate anyone nor will I ever because I will always hold fast to God, the one who has been so kind and loving toward me, who created me, who wants me to be loving and kind toward everyone I meet, even on the internet. Do not get me wrong, I have sinned, and so has everyone else, whether they want to admit it or not. I do not hate these people such as gay or lesbian people, I simply hate the sins they commit according to the Bible, (For example Sodom and Gomorrah, God destroyed this city because of the homosexuality being shown there) and I will show the same love to all of these people, even if they are not gay or lesbian, I will show the same amount of Godly love toward them that I would a fellow Christian. There are those Christians out in the world that do show a “righteous hate” toward those who choose different lifestyles than the Bible says we should choose. Now please if I point out one thing to you in this writing PLEASE LISTEN!!!!!!! I DO NOT HATE HOMOSEXUALS, I LOVE THEM EQUALLY TO THOSE WHO ARE CHRISTIANS, I DO SIMPLY HATE THE SIN THEY COMMIT, AND I PRAY EVERY NIGHT THAT ALL OF THOSE WHO DO NOT FOLLOW GOD REALIZE WHAT THEY DO.

          • Alex

            Well said ^

          • Gandolfication

            But why do you need to even HATE their ‘sin’?
            I do not spend any moments of my life HATING your many sins such as lying, selfish behavior, pride or so many others.

            It just doesn’t help anything or do anything for me.

            When Christians say they hate the sin but not the sinner (and I know because I used to be one who said this), they really mean that they are justified in feeling superior and condemning behavior which really can’t be separated from the person. It also gives them a reason to not ever feel an inclination toward connecting with people in full humanistic love, broadening their horizons, etc.

            it is insular and minimizes the importance of other ‘sins’ which are actually damaging to our relationships, and instead focuses on something that has historically been considered ‘yucky’ and strange and that we don’t want to have to really think about as a part of human experience.

            I really think that if the Jesus of the Bible were real and were around today, LGBT people would almost certainly be included among the downtrodden that he tended to and preached about befriending.

            Also, you don’t have to yell in caps.

          • Bershawn300

            Dear Sweet Person who goes by name Gandolfication and claims to not be Christian,

            Please graciously allow me to point out the following:

            1. Gandolf is a creature from LOTR. Written by JRR Tolkein. Who was a Christian.

            2. You are on a Catholic-Christian website.

            I thought maybe you have stumbled onto this website thinking it was the Friendly Atheist or something. Maybe you thought it was Lawrence Krauss’ site? Either way, your presence and comments here seem a bit unorthodox.

            Unless beneath all your huffing and puffing you really ARE a Christian or secretly want to be! I think that’s it! 🙂

            Blessings.

          • ZociallyConscious

            Ok, God did not destroy Sodom because of homosexual behavior. The sins of Sodom were their lack of charity and Christian hospitality, and their hostility against strangers.
            In ancient Jewish literature, such as the Ethics of the Fathers and
            the Talmud, there are many references to Sodom. The phrase “middat Sdom” was used. It may be
            translated as “the way the people of Sodom thought”. It meant a lack of
            charity and hospitality towards others; ignoring the needs of the poor, etc. In the Middle
            East, a person’s survival could depend upon the charity of strangers. To help strangers
            was a solemn religious duty of paramount importance. See Leviticus 19:33-34 and Matthew 25:35, 38 and
            43.
            Also:
            Jeremiah 23:14:”…among the prophets of Jerusalem I have seen something
            horrible: They commit adultery and live a lie. They strengthen the hands of evildoers, so
            that no one turns from his wickedness. They are all like Sodom to me; the people of
            Jerusalem are like Gomorrah.”
            Ezekeiel 16:49-50:”Now this was the sin of your sister
            Sodom: She and her daughters were arrogant, overfed and unconcerned;
            they did not help the poor and needy. They were haughty and did
            detestable things before me. Therefore I did away with them as you
            have seen.”
            Isaiah 1; The entire first chapter is an utter condemnation of Judah. They are
            repeatedly compared with Sodom and Gomorrah in their evildoing and depravity. Throughout
            the chapter, the Prophet lists many sins of the people: rebelling against God, lacking in
            knowledge, deserting the Lord, idolatry, engaging in meaningless religious ritual, being
            unjust and oppressive to others, being insensitive to the needs of widows and orphans,
            committing murder, accepting bribes, etc. There is no reference to homosexuality
            or to any other sexual activities at all.
            If you, as a Christian, are going to hate the sins of homosexuals, then at least so the scholarly research to be able to accurately condemn what you claim to hate
            and HATE is not a Christian value for ANY reason.

          • Gandolfication

            Me, I can’t tell if you’re being satirical or literal (one of the foibles of Biblical literalism I guess).

            The 10 Commandments were laws given to the Jews. And I wonder Me, do you think that governments should stone people for picking up sticks in violation of the commandment to keep the Sabbath holy, as is recounted in Numbers 15:32-36? God directly commanded Moses that this man–who was picking up sicks presumably to build a fire (since this was the reason they picked up sticks in the wilderness)–should be put to death.

            All hail the justice in the 10 Commandments!

          • me

            Well as you may know since you were once a “Christian”, which I do not understand that if you were once a true Christian how you could no longer be one, and have read the Bible I assume, you know that there are two sections of the Bible, the Old testament and the New testament, the Old testament, while its rules and directions should still be followed, where for much simpler times, our country is evolving in ways that countries did not in the Old testament so the New testament comes into hand and gives us more guidelines for our lives in a new society, this is shown in the Bible book Revelation, where it prepares everyone and gives them an insight to what times will be like when Satan takes his reign over the earth. And whenever the Rapture takes place and all of the Christians are gone, even we will have to tell every sin and curse word we have every thought or said, all of those who do not accept Christ as their Savior will have to do this as well, everyone will, whenever they die. And i was not yelling when I was in all caps i was simply making something I said noticeable so that people did not get the wrong ideal as of what I was saying in that paragraph. And since I am a Christian and I accepted Jesus Christ as my savior and I am saved, you do not have to pick away at all of the little sins I do because I try not do them because I know better, and if I do commit a sin I immediately as God to forgive me for that and when he does, he forgets about it. If you do not believe that Jesus Christ is real you will have a hard time holding to that statement whenever you meet him. I will be praying for your salvation and that you accept Christ as your savior! Have a nice day!!!

          • Gandolfication

            Thanks Me.

            Yes, I minored in Bible and Theology and memorized chapters and almost whole books of the bible – mostly wasted time, but I do understand the Old and New testament.

            You’ve said:

            ” the Old testament, while its rules and directions should still be followed, where for much simpler times, our country is evolving in ways that countries did not in the Old testament so the New testament comes into hand and gives us more guidelines for our lives in a new society…[and then go on about Revelation].”

            So, just to recap: “the Old testament, while its rules and directions should still be followed.” Including the sanctioned stonings and killings for myriad trivial offenses. Okay.

            But it was for ‘much simpler times.’ A true oddity for an omniscient god who stands and sees outside of time. You’d expect a timeless god making just laws concerning objective right and wrong in all places and at all times to…um…make laws that were actually just in all times and places.

            So now, the New Testament “comes into hand and gives us more guidelines for our lives in a new society.”

            I have no idea how you imagine you reconcile those, but a lot of us just understand that the Bible doesn’t have to be taken as something infallible or even something that was meant to be taken literally, laden with manifold poetic, representational and figurative language and morality fables as it is.

            Just curious, do you really believe that multiple of every species of animal on earth traveled to a boat and fit abroad for a month and had enough food but didn’t eat each other and that’s how our animals are still with us?

            Btw, if Christ’s reported words in the New Testament are authoritative, their plain meaning disagree with you: “Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.” Matt. 5:17.

          • Bershawn300

            Still…sigh.

          • Gandolfication

            thanks.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            On the internet, on a computer grandfathered by a gay atheist(Alan Turing)

          • me

            There is truly only one thing I can say to you…You will believe what I am saying whenever you die, and have to kneel before Jesus Christ, and tell every sin you committed and confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, and yes, if God said it happened, then I believe that the Ark was real and that God changed the nature of the animals to get along until the flood was over. I simply will continue to pray for you and your salvation… Have a Great day!!!

          • Gandolfication

            Thanks Me, amazing. The certitude of your conviction for a particular sect’s version of something at a particular point in time, which you cannot possibly have any way of knowing, is sad.

            I wish you the best.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            Well, you can make all sorts of silly claims about what will happen after we die, but you have absolutely no way of knowing if any of it is true. Believing obviously crazy bronzeage superstition “just in case” is a rather silly undertaking, don`t you think?

          • me

            I do not know what will happen after the rapture takes place or when it will take place, but God does and I believe God. and No, I do not think that what I said is silly I truly believe in it and I know these things are true and will happen because God said them and what God says will happen. I will also be praying for your true salvation, I pray you have a great day!!
            -me

          • Gandolfication

            The way that you stop being a Christian by the way, is really simple, you just kind of grow up and realize that it is a book of fantastical stories you have no possibly way to validate, and you just let that go. You can still hold to a belief in god (in fact a better higher power), and spirituality, and all of the good principles and values, but beneficently it allows you to let go of the odious ones without having to try to reconcile the irreconcilable. It’s kind of nice.

          • Bershawn300

            Oh my Gandolf.

          • Gandolfication

            I know, right?

          • Bershawn300

            Still Christian. Still a website. Still a Christian website.

          • me

            What do you mean, I know that this is a Christian website were you meaning something derogatory against me or was it meant against another person?

          • Odd Jørgensen

            God, could choose to ban shellfish or slavery, went with shellfish…

          • Bershawn300

            You’re still on a Christian site.

          • Gandolfication

            thanks again. You’re kind of a broken record, huh.

          • Bershawn300

            Just a Catholic on a Catholic website trying to point out the obvious. 🙂 I still can’t figure out what you’re doing here. A word does come to mind though- “praps it likes riddles, does it?” – its grimy and smelly and rhymes with ‘bowl’. (Unless, as I said, you’ve secretly come to re-convert.) Blessings.

          • Gandolfication

            Bershawn300,

            I’ve never understood religion and Christianity’s us-and-them mentality, separating ‘others’ from the rest of humanity. I see no utility or good in this kind of division and artifice. We’re all human beings.

            The site was discussing a popular song and the moral, philosophical and spiritual problems, on the open internet. Maybe you can better explain if there is an actual reason that for your suggestion that non-Catholics shouldn’t be commenting.

          • ZociallyConscious

            Actually, it’s kind of the same attraction that makes people slow down at car accidents – you know you can’t fix it, you know there’s nothing you can do, you know you’re not involved, but you just. cannot. stop. looking.

          • ledmikew

            Why did God plagiarize the flood from the Epic of Gilgamesh? Maybe study the history of your religion before dedicating your life to something?

          • Bershawn300

            Yes, um. Could you kindly site your source for that fun bit of trivia? And while searching for said source, bear in mind that the Sumerian account could be said to ADD validity to the Old Testament account, not detract from it. In much the same way as a German report regarding September 11 and a Botswanian report on Sept. 11 would actually affirm that such an event REALLY DID HAPPEN. The only difference is the cultural vantage point. It is important not to parrot things one picks up from pseudo-historians.

          • Leviticus

            Leviticus 24:16 says: “Whoever utters the name of the Lord must be put to death. The whole community must stone him, whether alien or native. If he utters the name, he must be put to death.”

          • me

            Well it actually says that whoever BLASPHEMES the name of God shall be stone… you should read the whole verse or chapter before you cut and paste things, two very different things between what you and I said

          • ZociallyConscious

            Actually, that’s one of over 50 translations, from the Hebrew
            טז וְנֹקֵב שֵׁם-יְהוָה מוֹת יוּמָת, רָגוֹם יִרְגְּמוּ-בוֹ כָּל-הָעֵדָה: כַּגֵּר, כָּאֶזְרָח–בְּנָקְבוֹ-שֵׁם, יוּמָת
            or the Greek
            ὀνομάζων δὲ τὸ ὄνομα κυρίου θανάτῳ θανατούσθω
            λίθοις λιθοβολείτω αὐτὸν πᾶσα συναγωγὴ Ισραηλ ἐάν τε προσήλυτος ἐάν τε
            αὐτόχθων ἐν τῷ ὀνομάσαι αὐτὸν τὸ ὄνομα κυρίου τελευτάτω

            They’re actually BOTH correct, depending on your translation of nakav, meaning not only to curse, or blaspheme, but also to express, or distinguish by name. Hence the Jews, at a very early period, understood this law as
            prohibiting them from uttering the name Jehovah, on any other than
            sacred occasions. The Septuagint, which was made at least 250 years
            before Christ, renders it [Onomazon de to onoma Kyriou, thanato
            thanatoustho] “Whosoever nameth the name of the Lord, let him die;” from
            which we see that the Jews at this time were accustomed to pronounce adonay, or Lord, instead of Jehovah; for in place of it the Septuagint always put [Lo Kyrios.]

            Of course, the book of Leviticus, the third book of the Pentateuch (the Torah), is meant to address the Tribe of Aaron, the descendents of the priests of Israel. Leviticus 6-8 specifically addresses the priests, while 1-7 and 11-27 are instructions for Moses to give to the Israelites during the Exodus – it’s the living and faith instructions for the Israelite tribe of Aaron – how to act to the Tabernacle and how to behave around the sanctuary, emphasizing moral, religious and legal practices.

            Why anyone justifies current Christian behavior and action by Levitucus always confuses me – unless they are trying to live their lives as good Jews?

          • Odd Jørgensen

            Then why is the bible so full of blatant falsehoods? Did god not know that the moon has no light of its own? Did he not know that stars were REALLY big and very far away, and not some little light that could fall to earth? And bats laying eggs? I mean, come on now, that is just stupid.

          • me

            Read the Bible and go to Church, you will find out.
            -I will pray for you also to come to salvation.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            And I guess someone will have to think for you.

          • me

            What does that even mean?

          • Odd Jørgensen

            I`m sure someone will understand it for you…

          • Kat

            You really think that humans making sure to capitalize bible or god is a part of God’s master plan?

          • someonesgrandma

            Christians do not “follow a religion”…they follow Truth. Jesus is Truth…He even said so. YOUR belief that the “Bible was written by a man not a God” is partially true. The Bible WAS written by men…UNDER THE INSPIRATION OF GOD. They were nothing more than his secretary…his typist…his hands and feet as HIS WORDS slipped onto the paper. You saying something different has no power to change that. There is no arrogance in this statement…certainly not as much arrogance as you share in your post of your perfect knowledge of truth. GOD has all the answers…GOD’S WORD has all the answers…the church is nothing more than those who have chosen to accept the love the God of the Universe…the God Who created them…the God Who created all (including you)! Someday you WILL KNOW the Truth…and hopefully the Truth will set you free before the consequences of your lack of faith doom you to an eternity WITHOUT GOD. You’ve never lived with God! He’s here whether you like it or not, whether you believe it or not. And He loves you. The fact that you’re even talking about Him reveals that He’s at work to convince You He’s real. Praying that you “un” will disappear before you face the God you deny!

          • Rick

            Shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up shut up

          • Bershawn300

            Well. This pretty much adequately sums up the atheist argument. Well-played Rick.

          • Rick

            I’m not athiest 🙁 so, um, I don’t know where to go from here. I hate the bleeding heart Christians who tell everyone all this, just as much as I hate the athiests saying religion is stupid.

          • GGirl

            Ok, This is SO weird. I was looking for the lyrics for this song and I stumbled into this. I’m catholic but really, REALLY?!

            Ok, Guys… God’s inspiration… The bible? Really? I mean, well, the original book, maybe, but the bible has been changed and tampered by the Church to their convenience for AGES. There’s historical proof everywhere, you just need to look for it. That’s why so many things contradict themselves in the bible.

            The truth is the highest religion there is. Which means, some stuff some religions hold on as being the truth should be questioned. Not because God is lying or doesn’t exist, but because as humans we always end up twisting everything.

            Religions as a whole have killed, tortured and enslaved more people than wars and the new religion that surfaces calls the latter one, stupid, backwards or WHATEVER. Judaism was a good and proper religion, from the roots of that religion came Christianity, first being all Catholic, later going through a reform and becoming protestant. A much needed reform considering they were selling pardons to enter heaven.

            But truth be told… Religions have a purpose and they do that well, but we can’t try to shut off people who don’t believe or question what we accept as an absolute truth. Where would we be without these people. Remember that some 500 years ago, scientists were considered witches and autopsying a human body could get you killed. Thank GOD someone questioned the church’s authority and did their own research.

            Thank you to all of you who question and don’t go by the book. ANY BOOK. I believe in God, but like the Confucius said “If it can be explained… it’s not the TAO” That’s what God is, all and everything, the impossible, all that can’t be fathomed by the human brain.

          • me

            AMEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

          • Ryan

            Seriously?, YOU have no facts to prove that “GOD” created the universe and us. Yet their is scientific proof of the big bang and evolution. Like many others I will believe in the facts that are in front of me and not some book that was written ages ago by “SOMEONE”. You don’t know who write it neither do I but what I do know is you find comfort in your religion which is fine but don’t say “GOD” created everything if you have no proof. Just to let you know your favorite “BOOK” isn’t proof it’s just another book on a shelf. Also if “GOD” is real why is he letting us destroy what he created?

          • me

            Maybe you should read “THAT BOOK” and then you would figure out who wrote it, and who actually created the Universe. I’ll give you a spoiler, God did.

          • thruth

            I have my reservations on religion, but it’s also annoying to hear someone refer to the Big Bang THEORY and the THEORY of evolution as hard scientific facts. You may want to look up the word Theory.

          • Hm

            A scientific theory is a well-substantiated explanation of some aspect of the natural world that is acquired through the scientific method and repeatedly tested and confirmed through observation and experimentation.

          • ZociallyConscious

            You may want to look up the scientific definition of the concept of “theory” before you use that old and tired argument of the uneducated – please argue with intelligent and educated statements if you’re going to yell in caps and attempt to be condescending. It’s embarrassing for you.
            In short:

            A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next step—known as a theory—in the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon.

            When used in non-scientific context, the word “theory” implies that something is unproven or speculative. As used in science, however, a theory is an explanation or model based on observation, experimentation, and reasoning, especially one that has been tested and confirmed as a general principle helping to explain and predict natural phenomena.

            Any scientific theory must be based on a careful and rational examination of the facts. In the scientific method, there is a clear distinction between facts, which can be observed and/or measured, and theories, which are scientists’ explanations and interpretations of the facts. Scientists can have various interpretations of the outcomes of experiments and observations, but the facts, which are the cornerstone of the scientific method, do not change.

            Please don’t be condescending with information you are not informed on.

          • Sadforgod

            Again, read the above response. There is no “truth” or “absolute” as it would make FAITH unnecessary. There would be no point to life if God made it undeniable, that is the test we all must take, and it is not your job to judge those who test differently. The hate you spit in the face of questions is regretable and unfortunate. They are entitled to believe, just as much as you. I myself know there is a God and He is wonderful and loving, but I cannot force someone else to. He will reveal himself to all of us in HIS way but only through faith, not “truth”

          • Odd Jørgensen

            the bible says bats lay eggs.

          • someonesgrandma

            If you can direct me to the passage that says “bats lay eggs” I’d be happy to talk with you. If you are referencing Leviticus writings where bats are listed as birds, you might want to note that God does not use man’s animal kingdom classifications that would not be written by MEN for hundreds/thousands more years. A little petty to think that the One True living God, YHWH, would need to lower Himself to man’s level so that humans who want a small God would be appeased.

          • Odd Jørgensen

            Living god? Who gave birth to this “one true god”™ of yours?

          • ZociallyConscious

            If you want to engage people in an actual intellectual debate, then don’t be insulting or condescending. They don’t get to, you don’t get to.

          • ZociallyConscious

            If all the books and words of the Bible are inspired by and dictated by God equally, and man’s part was no more than transcriptionist, then why do some of the accounts of the same occurrences differ from book to book??
            And why have some books of the Bible been banned, or refuted, or disallowed?

          • Jo

            That’s a double standard you’ve got there, you say Christians think they know everything and then you mock them by saying everything they believe comes from man not god. So what I gather is you know everything, all of the history of the universe and it’s content because to know that the bible was not inspired by God is to admit that you where right there as it was written. Read the bible, study the history, it’s not as far fetched as you might think

          • Rusty

            Strawman much? atheists don’t say they hate god. they just don’t believe that any gods exist.

          • Ben

            Who says atheists hate god? They just don’t believe he’s real, not that they hate him

          • the devil 666

            who taught you that one you’re grandma .

          • David J

            Athiests do not hate any gods. Athiests by definition just do not believe in any gods.
            So therefore you are incorrect.

          • No

            Actually atheists don’t hate God, they hate religious extremists.

          • javaha

            no atheist hates god, that’s stupid, they just simply don’t believe in his existance, read up before you type up.

          • Human

            Totally wrong my friend, they don’t hate it, they deny his existence.

          • Mark Burns

            You clearly don’t know many atheists. They don’t say that they hate God.

          • GGirl

            I have really enjoyed the discussion Atheists make. I was raised and born catholic but I enjoy the discussion of people who question. Do you really not believe in a higher power or you just disagree with the anthropomorphic God that religions portray?

          • Mark Burns

            Thanks GGirl! So nice just to have a conversation with someone so open-minded. It’s uncommon and a breath of fresh air.
            For me, it isn’t just about no grandpa with the white beard in the sky. I genuinely don’t believe in any forces outside of nature, anthropomorphic or not. I generally think that most serious atheists feel the same way, but I only speak for myself.

          • GGirl

            Yeah, I hear you. Have you ever seen the movie “What the Bleep Do We Know” ? I saw that movie and started to believe that Scientists were far more spiritual than we thought them to be, just because they don’t believe God has boundaries. Yeah, the Grandpa God who forgives you because you believe in him… he seems no better than a Human, so it couldn’t be God. I’ve studied world cultures and to be quite honest all religions tell the same stories in their own way using their own symbolism. However, how the stories repeat themselves in every culture no matter how far apart they are it’s baffling. Either, they’re all right, all wrong, or some are lying when saying they’re the only one’s that hold the whole truth. It sounds more like a light was shined in humanity for a while, it gave people hope and then went corrupt. Then someone else came did the same thing and the cycle repeated itself. We do kind of need religion to do their work and shine a light. However my friend, for you… You need more, and to not be scared to ask for more and demand more is admirable. Good luck in your quest. There is no higher religion than the truth.

          • Mark Burns

            Hi GGirl, and thanks for your thoughtful and kind-spirited message. I’m not used to people being so pleasant in internet comments.

            To answer your question, I don’t only disbelieve in the grey bearded daddy in the sky. I genuinely believe that there are no forces outside of nature influencing the Universe. At least not in any purposeful or benevolent way.

          • GGirl

            I do believe there’s a purpose, but nothing we can understand at this level of evolution. But ask, question, lead the way! People who ask will get answers and like once someone told when I was having all these questions… Questions are the best way to show you care and have interest.

          • danebrain

            Atheists don’t hate God they just don’t believe in God. In fact all the athiests agnostics or nonbelievers I’ve met don’t hate God or Christians at all. And certainly aren’t trying to teach anything to anyone else. Atheism is an opinion hence if I don’t believe in God I really could care less about who does. Your life is not my place to have an opinion. Hypocritical? Not really and false teachings? Hahaha

          • Kelsey

            I am an Atheist, and I disagree with Atheists who say they hate god. Its a double negative. You are correct but only a few Atheists are like that.

          • And remember they don’t hate “God”, they hate the people that teaches wrong things, and “imaginary living people”. So get your things straight.

          • brenn

            Athiests do not hate god? Never generalize a group of people, because there are crazy people in every religion. If I assumed every Christian was the same, you all would have a problem. You will never accept any other belief because that is how you were raised. If God was real, I believe he would want me to use my brain and learn and expand my universe, not blindly follow him. It is arrogant and deluded to believe that right here, on earth, isn’t enough. Since the beginning of man people sought religion for comfort so they could pretend to know the answers. It is no different today.

          • MaggieTheCat

            No atheist says they hate God. They don’t believe in a God. What most hate, I can only assume, are the Christians who try to dictate their beliefs on others.

          • Love All

            ‘Hating god’ is not a part of being Atheist. Humans hate. Ideas do not. There may be Atheists who are disrespectful of other ways of thinking, just as there are Christians who are disrespectful in the same ways. Spread love!

          • My2Cents

            Teachings of “Atheists”? Seriously, we aren’t nearly organised enough to have teachings. Organizing atheists can be compared to herding invisible sheep. Those “Atheists” that try to teach you are little more than bitter children throwing stones. Atheism is a personal choice. It’s not something you are converted to nor are there lessons on how to be a proper atheist. We don’t go around with boards proclaiming our choice, it’s just how we live our lives. We choose not to rely on a higher power to forgive us after we do wrong, we learn from it and live with the consequences.

            More to the point though: No, we do not hate your god. In fact, this is the first time I have even thought on this topic in months.
            It is your choice to believe. So don’t be defensive about it, live it and be a better person for it. Defending religious choice is when things turn nasty.
            I hope you have an awesome day further.

          • Sean N.

            Atheists don’t say they hate god. That’s a straw man and a very bad one. Atheists state that they don’t believe in a god, based on a lack of evidence (and the absence of a convincing philosophical argument).

            The fact that there are natural explanations for everything, that you can conceive of a universe without a god (which would look identical to this one), that religious texts are chock full of contradictions, that hundreds, if not thousands of other religions have all died and faded away, and that you can’t actually define a god without it becoming self-contradictory – you have a bit of a problem.

            Atheists don’t hate something they don’t believe in. That’s like saying you hate santa claus for not bringing you a toy car when you don’t believe santa claus exists (well, not the best analogy since we know he’s fictitious, but the point is still valid).

            What Atheists hate are religious institutions that preach ignorance and hate and take advantage of people. Atheists hate religious zealots who use their unfounded beliefs to harm others and feel justified in doing so.

          • Amays47

            Atheism is a lack of belief in any God.. Atheist do not hate God, because God does not exist. You can not hate something that does not exist. You can hate, how ever, being indoctrinated as a child, told you were born broken. I choose to fully love my life as a good person for the sake of being good person. Not for the promise of another life or the threat of eternal punishment …

          • Amber Vaughan

            Atheists don’t hate God, they simply don’t believe in any god or any religion at all for that matter.

          • Michelle Lebel

            What atheist says they hate God??? Atheists don’t believe a God exists, so no true atheist would say they hate God (something that does not exist as far as they are concerned), unless of course they don’t actually understand the concept of atheism, in which case they’re not really an atheist.

            An atheist may dislike or even hate RELIGION. I am sure you must understand the difference between religion and God though; they are far from synonymous.

            Perhaps you’ve heard an atheist say they dislike organized religion and you were confused and interpreted that as them saying they dislike God. Either that or you have met people who claim to be atheists yet don’t actually understand the concept.

          • Jack

            Atheists don’t hate God. That’s what you think, but you’re wrong. Non-belief isn’t hate. It’s simply the decision not to live for something else, but to live for yourself, your family and friends, your community, and humanity. The atheists I know are some of the most thoughtful, loving, and “Chistian” people I know (in regards to their daily actions). I’m not sure, but it may have to do with the fact that they feel they have one chance at life so they better do it right.

          • Naomi Navarrete

            I have never heard an Atheist say that they hate God, I do not hate God. Perhaps if you talked too a true Atheist, your opinions would not be so wrong and narrow about us.

          • Edward Woelke

            Have you ever talked to an atheist??? Evidently not. I’ve never met an atheist who hates God. Do you hate Poseidon? Or do you merely dismiss the claim that he exists? Boom. You are an atheist.

          • Loricate

            They don’t hate god. They hate how people hide behind god to justify their hate. And how a lot Christians are the most hateful people there are. And also, you can say you hate vampires and unicorns, that doesn’t mean you think they’re real.

          • carrie

            That’s where you’re wrong, atheists do not hate God as God does not exist in our eyes and therefore there is nothing to hate. Some, however, may say they ‘hate’ religion and its teachings.

          • Ran D Dale

            Do Not hate the Deity. Hate the deity seeker. Atheists truly could not care less about who you believe in. They are just tired of you telling them who to believe in. If you are FIRM in your faith. Someone else’s non-belief shouldn’t bother you in the slightest.

          • Amelia

            We don’t hate God which in that way means we aren’t hypocrytical we hate the teachings of so called God. We don’t believe in the ways of ‘God’ and therefore hate religion not ‘god’

          • Crotes75 .

            I don’t hate God, I dislike his followers, they sit in judgement and the most hypercritical people I have ever met.

          • Corey Scott

            What atheist ever said he or she hates God? Every atheist I know holds God in about the same regard as unicorns or the tooth fairy. I won’t deny that some (though far fewer than I was led to believe in church) are misguided, angry and perhaps even hateful, but if they harbor any ill will, it’s directed at the followers of the God in whom they don’t believe, not in God himself.

          • Bullshit detector

            That’s bullshit, atheists do not “hate god” because we can’t hate what is not there.

          • Skin

            Think you miss the point…..

          • jmk

            Nice strawman…and made entirely of baloney, too!! News flash – atheists don’t say they “hate” gods any more than they say they “hate” Lord Voldemort…because both are equally fictional.

            Atheism is just non-belief in any gods. Not hate of gods, not spite for gods…non-belief.

          • Tio

            ridiculous. Atheists don’t hate. They are against superstition and religious indoctrination.

          • Tcm

            I as an atheist do not hate any god that other believe in because I myself do not believe in any gods. You sound ignorant for generalizing atheists by saying “they” and continue to give characteristics of what “they” are and do. Imo that shows nothing but how people are taught to believe complete nonsense. I as an atheist, want nothing more than to coexist with others regardless of their faith or lack of. I myself as an atheist, has many friends of many different religions and non religious beliefs. I get along with them all just fine. I respect them and they respect me.

          • Rachel

            You actually make the atheist point in your argument. Atheists do not believe in God/s or deities. They do not hate him because you cannot hate that which does not exist. You will find that if they hate anything it is religion.

          • Dr. Correction

            At no point ever do atheists as a whole say they “hate God”. You’re confusing it with the hatred of Religion, which is a frequently-acknowledged belief of atheists. Atheists hate religion because of the evils it encourages. They do not hate or love “God”, because as you pointed out, atheists don’t believe one exists. They, instead, hate religion and/or the idea of a God.

          • Alan

            As an Atheist or Agnostic if you choose, I don’t hate god, nor do any of the Atheists I know, and I know many. We simply don’t believe in the metaphysical, or any such superstition.

            “Of all the hundreds or thousands of god’s currently worshipped, you choose to reject all but one. I simply reject one more than you do.”

          • Ally

            We don’t hate God, we just don’t trust our own beliefs. We ask for certainty not domination from humans as flawed and sinful as ourselves, no matter what book they preach.

          • Christians need jesus

            Atheists don’t believe God so you are being very controversial cause how can we hate something we don’t believe in, no one here hates God, we hate the church and it’s twisted values, it’s pathetic how you try to push your religion down people’s throats. Your religion is one of dozens, so please stop

          • Anonymous

            Atheists don’t hate God, they don’t hate Christians, hate isn’t in their definition. While there may be some overlap between atheists that don’t like Christians, it is not necessary to be an atheist. You’re right that hating god and not believing in god are contradictory: that’s because one of those beliefs aren’t held by atheists, it’s imposed on atheists by other people. You don’t have to agree with atheists, but if you truly believe in Jesus’ non-judgmental and non-hatred filled teachers, you shouldn’t hate atheists either. You can disagree without hating a person.

          • bajakat

            there are no atheists who say they hate God you can’t hate something that doesn’t exist. please if you’re going to comment get it right

          • Atheists

            I’ve never said I hate God, just that I don’t believe a god exists. God has made some people much better than they would have been if they didn’t believe in a god, but belief in God has shaped our society to the way it is today, so I can’t say I hate God. I don’t want to change the past, nor can I.

          • Voice Of Reason

            I have never heard an atheist say “I hate God”. Are you a complete twit or are you from westboro baptist? Satanists hate God. If you believe in the devil, you believe in God. Athiests do not believe in a higher power. Either you’re a complete idiot, or the “atheists” you talked to were not atheists.

          • Christina

            Atheists don’t hate God. That is something Christians tell their children to scare them away from the “boogeyman.” Atheists simply do not believe in theism.

          • Dan Pope

            Atheists don’t “hate” God. They don’t believe he exists. (That simple)

            It can be difficult to understand, especially if you’ve been raised your entire live to believe in God.

            I choose to believe in a more scientific approach. Being brainwashed that there is a man in the sky that created all just isn’t very likely.

          • Ryan

            We don’t hate god we think the bible is a fiction and we hate that people believe it and follow it blindly

            Besides atheists don’t have teachings we want to be able to think for ourselves

          • Corey

            That’s the most narrowminded & stupidest opinion I think I’ve ever heard.
            I’m an atheist and don’t ‘hate God’, I don’t believe in it. Big difference. The ‘hate’ is more so directed at your ‘type’ of ignoramus. 🙂

          • Comic BookGuy

            Atheists do not “hate” god because they don’t believe in god. That isn’t an example of hypocrisy either. Go back to reading your childrens’ books.

          • absolved

            Atheists do not hate God. Atheist means without a god.

          • Brooke Heenan

            I don’t hate god, and I don’t know any atheist that does to be honest. I think they hate the IDEA of him and the fact so many people devote their time to something that they don’t even think exists.

          • Cody

            I dont think atheists hate god, they just don;t believe there is a god:/ those two things are not the same

          • Caitlin Jackson

            We cannot hate someone who isn’t real

          • Rachel Booker

            I have never once heard an atheist say s/he hates god. I’ve heard evangelical christians say atheists hate god, but never an atheist. What a bizarre comment. And, though “biastly” isn’t a word, if it were, the rules of the English language dictate it should be spelled biasedly.

          • Michelle

            omg which is why literally why you will never hear an atheist say they “hate God.” If they did hate anything, it would be organized religion.

          • SataNataS

            Nobody has a problem with a god that doesn’t exist. Most atheists hate proselytizing, and religious influence in politics. Get over yourself.

          • cosmicstresshead

            No-one is so stupid as to say they hate something that doesn’t exist. Did this seem like it made sense when you typed it? Many atheists I’ve met may have a disdain for organised religion and the evil things some people do in its name, but to say that they hate God? I assure you that this is not a prevalent view in the atheist community.

          • Rachelle

            We, Athiest and Agnostics, don’t hate your God. We just don’t believe in him/her.

          • Anon

            That is a facile, stick man, argument.
            First of all it is a huge generalisation to say that atheists hate God.
            Secondly, even if they did, you could hate the man made idea of God without believing he exists.

          • Robin Hillyer-Miles

            Atheists don’t hate any of the Gods of any of the religions. Where did you learn that? In fact, most atheists read about the different belief systems and some even study them, it’s interesting to see how they share some of the same myths and fables.

          • total kaos dana n kev 4 ever

            athiests don’t believe there is a god (or a devil) they do hate the idea of people worshipping a god (or a devil) because its a waste of time and energy. usually because they feel god has failed them in their greatest time of need or have never had a need for god. they are in need of love and understanding more than you can give them with your judgement and attitude. please don’t fall for your belief that you are above anyone. we are all created in his image.

          • javacado

            You obviously are misinformed. Atheists don’t believe in God – ergo they can’t hate something that they don’t think exists.

          • Michael

            I do not know any atheists who say that….rather it is Christians who say it about atheists as if they could read what is in another person’s mind.

          • Rosie WIlliamson

            Athiests don’t say they hate god, they say they don’t believe there is a god

          • LostMySouthernGraces

            LOL!! Good luck finding an atheist who hates God. They don’t hate something that they believe doesn’t exist.

          • Lola617

            I know a lot of atheists and I’ve never heard any of them say they “hate God”. So your circular theory is completely off base. Besides if there is a god why do you need to defend him? He’s god, all powerful, all knowing, and omnipresent, I think if he felt like he needed to be defended he is very capable of doing it himself. And FYI atheists aren’t being hit by lightening all over the world. Also the song is about (hold on to your bibles) a homosexual relationship.

          • athiests don’t hate god- they merely don’t believe in him, or any religion.

          • Mark Burns

            I agree. These aren’t college theses we are writing…the meaning an intent is far more important than the spelling and grammatical errors. That being said, people do get more respect when they are well spoken.

          • Susan Carskaddon

            B4 you knock what we’re trying to tell you – Do your homework !

          • Mike Clout

            Looking forward to it

          • Gandolfication

            It’ll be hard for him to follow up this song, which is a tour de force

          • Damn. Now if I ever become a recording artist, I know what to name my debut album. Or albom, I suppose. 😉

        • KPage

          It is disgusting that you call yourself a Christian/Catholic and have the nerve to call others disgusting. Hypocrisy much? 1 of many reasons I left the Catholic church.

          • Tati Bugatti

            Exactly

          • Veronika

            Every group on earth has hypocrites. It’s very foolish to leave because of OTHERS’ hypocrisy. That’s the dumbest reason I’ve heard for leaving yet.

          • Beatrice

            I agree. I’m catholic, but nobody in my church is against homosexualism. We actually support everyone that is having any kind of issues with sexuality. And I like the song and respect the artist. By the way, my parents have already been criticized for being catholic with people saying that they are homophobic. That’s just stupid. They always say that prejudice actually goes against all the catholic ideals.

          • goldushapple

            What are the others? I’m always amused by the “1 of many reasons I left the Church … ” types.

            *And this is the ONLY post you have in your history. Telling.

        • Sagforgod

          This is exactly what I was talking about. You clearly have hate in your heart and you are using the Word as a backdrop. I will pray for you, you will have a very large sin to answer for. You speak of false teachings but perhaps we should recognize the true wolf in the flock. Toe, only lucifer would be happy for what you posted. Homosexuality is between the sinner and God, your judgment is a waste of words. We are to love love and since none of us know for sure we are to cherish what they feel as love for God is love.

          • Sadforgad

            To clarify when I said “between the sinner and God” I am not claiming homosexuality is a sin, I am stating that we are all sinners, therefore it is a generalization that EVERYONES judgment is between the sinner and God.

        • Freedom of Religion

          If you watch further, the point of the video is to condemn the violence against homosexual people prevalent in the world today. It specifically refers to riots and successful protests in Russia that revoked freedom of speech and forbade public advocacy for the rights of homosexual people. Hotzier has come out to say that the intent of the song was not to condemn all religion, but rather to speak out agains institutions that impede the rights of others. You may be opposed to homosexual behavior due to the writings of the bible, or the social prejudices of our society today. Regardless using the bible to justify physical abuse of another human being simply because they do not adhere to the rules of your god is (in my opinion), wrong and disgusting. I can’t speak much to the teachings of the bible as I haven’t personally read the entire thing, but I imagine the same can be said for many of the people who preach the small excerpts about homosexuality and conveniently ignore sections that condemn working on Sundays or gluttony. I am happy support people worshiping whatever they chose so long as they do not try to belittle the rights of others. If homosexual acts gross you out: skip to the end, that is what should be repulsive to you, and that is what this song is condemning, and I feel certain (though, again, I haven’t read much) the bible and many other religions preach that unprovoked violence is immoral.

        • Dane

          Actually just letting everyone commenting here know that I’m an atheist and I love everyone equally. But it seems like the majority of you try to pick out every little thing about us atheists to find new reasons to hate us. I don’t hate “God” because I don’t believe he’s real. I also don’t hate Christians, I just don’t agree with them. What I’m not very fond of is how most Christians target us atheists as “devil worshipers” or some sort of horrible people. We aren’t. We just have different viewpoints. Love all, don’t hate!

        • Siobhan Elizabeth

          LOL That’s not a joint, it’s just a hand rolled tobacco cigarette. I know because I’ve known people who have smoked both. I’m no prude, not claiming to be saintly re: marijuana. Strong odors trigger my migraines, and pot has a very strong smell. Found out the hard way that even second hand pot smoke makes me sick. However, I did see how people hold a joint and it’s different than a tobacco cigarette. My friend who rolled her own tobacco cigarettes did so because they are cheaper than packs of smokes. So people do still smoke hand rolled ones. And I bet it’s even more common outside the US, again because it’s less expensive than pre-rolled branded smokes…..

        • Siobhan Elizabeth

          And how sad that you are more disturbed by a tender kiss between two people who love each other (in no way was there anything close to pornography in this video) than the violence at the end. In Russia, they have had a huge increase in violence against gay people, and it’s so accepted that they do record these acts of violence. There is no fear of criminal charges. Do you condone beating and murder of gay people?

        • Hans

          why would your god create create homosexuals if he considers them evil and disgusting, i’m not even gay but the violence in the bible and the homophobia expressed by christians is the reason i left your religion

        • Harry

          Oh don’t worry, there was no perversion in the video, only two men in love sharing a kiss 🙂

        • TimM

          Why is it perversion may I ask, if per say that being homosexual is a biological ordeal than this is not perversion. Perversion means the alteration of something from its original course. So how is being gay perversion. Also why is it disgusting, you see people kissing in films and regardless of gender this is kissing so why isn’t that disgusting. To be frank your Homophobic attitude is simply rude.

        • I forgot my old guest name

          The message of the music video becomes clearer if you continue watching. It isn’t “everyone should be gay”, it’s that “gay people are being hunted down and murdered (the setting is in Russia), and that is wrong”. I guess I can understand why you wouldn’t bother finishing the video if you believe that homosexuality is sinful, but it’s unadvised to criticize something that you don’t finish.

        • Mark Burns

          There are thousands of species in the animal kingdom where homosexuality is practiced. You know it is not practiced? Anywhere? Celibacy, in the way that the priesthood of the Catholic Church and the nuns practice. Now do you want to talk about what is unnatural? Really?

        • Jack

          I liked the song when it first camp out. But it is almost mocking Jesus. That has turned Me and by far a lot of people away.

        • rjkeyes8

          Calm down doc. It’s this kind of thinking that turns or youth, straight, gay, whatever of to the Lord. Unnatural sins? Tell me which sin is any greater to God….that’s what I thought. ..

        • lovegod

          OMG I know love between two people who have no choice in the matter is SO perverse. It’s almost like they asked to be hated by you. The only thing that is satanic is the way you christian slaves treat people who are different than you. I wish we could all be as straight and awesome as you so we could all fit in one tiny square box and worship some bullshit christ figure.

        • Christians need jesus

          You clearly need psychological help if you have problems with who someone else goes to bed with, please “stay in yo lane”

      • Matthew O’brien

        If you watched the video you may have written a completely different interpretation. Because you were way off on this one.

        • cwaltz

          LOL, kinda makes you wonder if there interpretation of other things might also be off. Then again, people see what they want to see. I’ve seen people use the Bible to justify namecalling and espouse hatred towards lifestyles they don’t agree with and totally gloss past that “judge not lest ye be judged” stuff.

      • Sisteralice

        I couldn’t continue to listen to the song.

      • Paulo

        “Psst…I heard he murders kittens.”

      • Sir, with all due respect, Christ was all inclusive – that is what made him so different than EVERYONE else. He judged no one, and threw not a pebble in the direction of any man or woman. It’s difficult for me to understand why a man like yourself, who is obviously full of noble and good intentions and has thorough knowledge of Christ’s words and deeds as they are portrayed in the Holy Bible, would preach for the world to set up boundaries between human beings, between neighbors, between nations, between brothers. Why is it so difficult for so many people to SEE and HEAR the true message of Jesus? I have never understood why men stand on pulpits and ask people to be divisive and exclusive. Please sir, I would very much like to hear your side…truly, genuinely. I’m open and willing to listen and understand if you are open and willing to help me understand.

        Thank You,
        Rula

      • Naomi Navarrete

        Yes, it does. someone throat is slit because he loves the wrong person according too God.

        • goldushapple

          And I’m suppose to be all “The horror!”?

      • jmk

        If you consider a plea for tolerance and against hate “worse.”

        And judging from the comments here…you do.

      • Marie

        The music video adresses gay discrimination in Russia.

      • Sarah Coogan

        You’re ridiculous. The video shows two men who LOVE each other and are attacked because of it. It makes me sick.

    • Nathan Walters

      Well, someone completely missed the message of the video…

    • CW

      The music video has nothing to do with the lyrics. It is attacking Christianity for the teachings on homosexuality. Obviously this guy did not think this through very well. The lyrics and movie are telling two completely different stories…. and if you are going to complain about the treatment of gays, why are you attacking Christians? What about the Muslims who kill gays? And I did not see the bad guys wearing turbans, which would be much more accurate. Why attack Christianity instead of Islam? We could save lives by attacking ISIS and Sharia Law as vigorously as we attack Christianity.

      But here is what really bothers me: all of the idiots who turn a blind eye to the meaning of the song! People who call themselves “Christians” like this song. Wake up people! It deeply disturbs me to see supposedly Christian people humming along to this song.

      1 Peter 5:8 Stay alert! Watch out for your great enemy, the devil. He prowls around like a roaring lion, looking for someone to devour.

      • hm

        There is a lot of hate towards Islam. I don’t believe preaching hate against a group of people is very christian of you. This song is obviously targeted at Western countries, who speak English O.o The major religion in these countries is Christianity, therefore this is the major influence in these countries and what people relate to. I haven’t heard of America spending millions of dollars to drop bombs on christians. I personally think that this song is great, because is faith really thats strong if you can’t questions it and still come back to it?

        • CW

          Apathetic attitudes like yours are facilitating the deaths of thousands of people, murdered by ISIS and radical Muslims. The video shows people abusing and possibly killing a guy man. Radical Muslims do this regularly, not Christians. If the singer really cared about anti-gay crime, he would have targeted radical lslam. The singer’s condemnation of Christianity is misdirected and missing the bigger issue entirely. Even though we are in the West, we can help fight against the ideology of radical Islam and ISIS by simply speaking out against it.

          “I don’t believe preaching hate against a group of people is very christian of you” You must be joking. I am trying to speak out against evil like the murderous radical Muslims and ISIS. The Bible repeatedly warns about evil and tells everyone to speak out for what is right.

    • I must be a christian

      I know, it’s amazing.

    • Wayne Gross Jr

      Yeah, I have checked out the music video and I absolutely love it. FYI, I was baptized and raised Catholic. Now, 21 years later, I still attend church regularly, go to Newman Club Meetings, and volunteer as much as possible. I do mission trips every year, and I try to help people as much as possible. And guess what, I’m gay, and I’m proud of it. My religion guides me, by being a good person, and to be accepting of everyone, including myself. That being said, its a song with a good music video. It’s all apart of pop culture, but it isn’t teaching people to go against God.

      • GGirl

        Totally!
        I’m a catholic but I’m not a fanatic. You rock.

    • Nicole-marie Vasquez

      I’m confused. He says himself that he is not attacking faith yet you say what he says in his song is blasphemous. I think he is voicing his opinion on relationships being judged in some societies. I am Catholic myself, go to church every Sunday, sing in the Choir (I have even been a cantor), but there is always going to be disagreements on how certain things may be interpreted. I believe in a forgiving, loving, and wise God that has made everyone and everything for a reason. All he asks of us is to love eachother and love him. I think that includes ALL people no matter what religion, race, or sexual preference. Hearing this song I hear a struggle someone has internally with the pure love he has for his partner, his other half, and the criticism he may gat at his church. Just a a piece of advice for anyone who would like to go to church, synagogue, or temple, just know that the root belief and religion may be the same but the people in the building are what make it those things. So you may need to “shop around” so to speak for the right one of those for you. Before finding my church I went to several different churches first and as soon as I walked through the door I felt the tent ion in the air. I did not feel welcomed into the congregation. You should go to worship in a place you feel safe, loved, appreciated, and happy!

    • sm

      The song isn’t even about any of this stuff I’m sorry but did anyone hear hozier say it was about doing blasphemy and loving sin because I didn’t it isn’t even about this it’s about a relationship not literally going to church for all you extremely religious people God wanted us to praise his word and live the life of faith not strike down each other because we think we have the right to, carry on everyone

  • Scott

    I agree completely, And I was very bummed when I researched the lyrics. And the video, don’t even get me started. As an Irishman myself, I am ashamed. A shame such good talent gets twisted to sell more records.

    • Dani

      Homophobic, religious scum.

    • martimus

      And such a good Christian Irishman you are. Ashamed? Bummed? Listen to you casting down judgement (let he who is without sin cast the first stone) as if you are above and better and more blessed and closer to Him (Judge not, lest ye be judged, for all fall short of the glory of God –even you mister high and mighty Irishman). Jesus died for our sins and we are all sinners. You are a sinner, and you sit there telling another sinner how ashamed you are of him, and all sins are of equal disdain to God, no more than the other, and we are all so imperfect in His eyes and he still loves us…How dare you sit there and think that you are actually loved more than any gay man or woman or song artist on this earth. How dare you. May God forgive you for your hateful and judgemental, cruel spirit. That’s satan.

      • jimmy nobody

        Jesus said ‘he who is without sin cast the first stone’. But he certainly acknowledged that she sinned. In fact he told her to stop.
        We all sin. It’s another thing to advertise and promote it.

        • cwaltz

          He also said Judge not lest ye be judged. I sure hope you’re perfect in His eyes. If not perhaps you should focus on the beam in your own eye before discussing the splinter in someone else’s eye.

          • jimmy nobody

            I’m not judging anyone. I said that Jesus never said it was OK to sin. He said to stop. I’m not telling anyone they have to stop. That’s not my place. But I can hope someone stops because that is what is best for them.

    • Gen

      I have a gay family member. I just want to say that I am glad that he
      was not born to a homophobic family or he would be living an impossibly
      miserable life. I sincerely hope that no one within your community is a
      gay person who is living in misery because of your beliefs.
      And please don’t have children…because if they turn out gay, you would not be a fit parent.

  • zoltan

    I noticed this too – I first heard the song in the movie “Django Unchained” (don’t watch it if you haven’t already, it’s awful) and thought the wailing chorus was quite beautiful. Then I heard some of the lyrics the other day and realized it was yet another “man worshipping woman” song that is so common these days. Why are these songs popular, of men groveling like dogs (as this song takes quite literally)? This is the first time I’ve seen all of the lyrics and it truly is horrible.

    • Gandolfication

      Said by someone never passionately in love no doubt.

      • zoltan

        I’m very much in love with my husband and would sacrifice for his good (love is the willing of the good of the one loved). But I certainly wouldn’t grovel and I would never mistake passion for love. Christ’s love (and passion) was all about suffering, not groveling.

        • Gandolfication

          That’s great. But your experience and view of love is not necessarily its totality. Love can be expressed in many ways, not only in sacrifice.

          I see no reason why if people want to include things like passion, worship, pain, and even groveling, and certainly you haven’t made any reasoned argument against these things.

          Oddly enough you seem to define Christ’s purportedly supreme model for love as including passion and being, at its essence about suffering.

          I am very glad that most of us are nowhere close to limiting love to mere suffering. I do think that wanting the best for another and acting unselfishly to give or sacrifice for that is the essence of love (essentially acting upon empathy); I just don’t think Christianity has any monopoly or special claim on this, originated it, or possess the right, power or authority to define what does and does not constitute legitimate love.

          • zoltan

            You’re the one who acted all holier than thou by assuming I’ve never been in love because I criticized the grovelling nature of the song lyrics. I don’t find anything you say useful (or approaching anywhere near a reasoned argument).

          • Gandolfication

            Zoltan,

            I’m not holier than thou just because I think people should have the right to express love to another human being freely as they wish. If you don’t find anything I’m saying reasoned, then you explain why you’re arguing with me.

            I did not of course literally assume that you’ve never been in love. You are the one who wrote: “it was yet another “man worshipping woman” song that is so common these days. Why are these songs popular, of men groveling like dogs (as this song takes quite literally)? This is the first time I’ve seen all of the lyrics and it truly is horrible.” and I responded a bit satirically, and I’ll continue to question what is implicitly an extremely narrow conception of what love is permitted to entail.

            First, the song does not suggesting there is anything literal about dogs groveling. It is a word picture, a metaphor in fact. No one really thinks the guy has somehow transformed himself literally into a dog.

            As far as groveling and worship, even these may not be meant literally, but let’s assume they are – many, many people understand this kind of feeling and behavior when they are madly in love. That you do not, is fine (even if it may seem sad to some), but is not a reason that makes it wrong when others do.

            And fortunately when it comes to people judging reasoned arguments, Catholics and others that believe in superstitions like multiple animals from every species on earth fitting on a boat, and the myriad number of rank evils attributed to a loving god in your doctrine, are not the standard I would ever seek.

          • GGirl

            Specially after Christianity is the religion that has killed and tortured more people in the name of God. Think about the Crusades, Inquisition and what not. Yeah, tolerance hasn’t been a great part of being Christian. We really should try to listen to opinions without religious fanaticism.

  • mike b

    pretty sure when he is talking about what’s in her stable, it isn’t a reference to Christ in the stable

    • Ugh

      • goldushapple

        You really need to research your articles. Your analysis is fine, but what mike b. said – it ain’t about Christ in the stable. You’re giving Hozier way too much credit for that line.

    • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

      Thank you! Yet the anti Catholic jerk who wrote this anti Catholic piece used that line to somehow blame the Catholic church for Hozier’s blasphemous song!

  • stephen

    He said this in an interview “about an organization undermining some very natural part of humanity”
    So Im confused about the woman? It seems to highlight more of a defense of homosexuality

    • zurvan

      It’s a critique of the notion of original sin and the element of religion that demonizes romantic love.

      • zoltan

        Which element of religion demonizes romantic love?

        • zurvan

          The puritanical one.

    • khdnssa

      He is gay, and is talking about homosexualty

    • anon0246

      The music video isn’t about a woman, it is about two men and the violent homophobia that they are victims to.

  • Jo

    It seems Hozier likened ‘taking someone to church’ to committing homosexual acts. Spot on with the conclusion. When I first heard it, I was driving and it stuck with me how musically well done it was. Of course, coming home to listen to the lyrics and see the video…I was sorely disappointed with the imagery and values it conveys.

    • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

      Well, homosexu@l couples involve a “femenine”/she role assumed by the introverted/least aggressive or alpha member of the couple.

      That’s what makes homogeneous lifestyle contradictory to me. If you’re a man and aren’t attracted to women, why appoint a fen role to your partner? Its nothing more that an evil unnatural attraction to same genitalia.

      • zurvan

        Some gay relationships do, but in my experience most don’t. Keep in mind it isn’t solely about whom you want to sleep with, but about whom you fall in love with. To that extent, isn’t all romantic attraction mysterious and complicated? There’s rarely all that much accounting for taste no matter one’s orientation.

        • goldushapple

          In my experience, same-sex relationship are the opposite of yours. (I’ll take my experiences over yours, thank you.) There tends to be a more masculine partner and a more feminine partner — one of the parties will be more Alpha.

          • zurvan

            I’m talking about reality. Frankly, if you think that most gay partners fall into traditional heterosexual norms, then you don’t know all that many gay couples. The notion that they must fall into some parody of a heterosexual relationship is, on its face, absurd. If we were attracted to the opposite gender, we would partner with the opposite gender.
            Do you think you can explain taste? You can explain why some people prefer a nice chest, or red hair, or a well-toned butt, or a rubenesque figure, or a sveldt one? You can explain why some people are attracted to completely opposite things? Attraction is strange, and beyond our current understanding. Attraction to gender is merely one of many examples of that.

          • zurvan

            Then I must bluntly state that you either don’t know very many LGBT couples or only notice the ones who fall into this stereotype.

          • goldushapple

            Or that my experiences run opposite of yours.

            It’s okay “we’re all special snowflakes.”

      • eva

        homosexual. gay. straight. bisexual. asexual. transsexual. pansexual. lesbian. write them. dont censure it.

      • Zoë

        That is grossly stereotypical. Not every gay relationship has a “feminine” one and a “masculine” one. In fact, I don’t think even MOST gay relationships involve “one of each.”

        With that logic the same could be applyed to a heterosexual relationship in which, say, the woman is more masculine than most would consider “normal” (like being on sports teams, chopping wood, wearing boy cloths, whatever you consider to be “men’s stuff”). Does that make the man any less heterosexual because hes in love with a masculine woman?

        No. That’s a rediculous way to look at love.

        • cwaltz

          It’s actually kind of ridiculous that love and gender be considered binary when you think about it. So if a guy is nurturing that isn’t “masculine” and if a girl is aggressive then she isn’t “feminine?” It makes absolutely no sense to put genders in boxes that way.

      • disqus_NoSo43QZSh

        Hozier isn’t gay I don’t believe. Fact check on that. It’s about how he was raised Catholic and raised to believe homosexuality is wrong, but due to the fact homosexuality is something a human is born with, he can do nothing to change it. Hence “take me to church, I’ll worship” and the first person references in the song to being “sick” and needing to be “cured.” It’s about inner turmoil and how religion can drive humans to beat, rape and kill eachotehr. No good comes of religion. In the words of John Lennon:

        Imagine there’s no countries
        It isn’t hard to do
        Nothing to kill or die for
        And no religion too
        Imagine all the people
        Living life in peace…

        • Gandolfication

          Wow, nice. That is kind of the view I have – I actually have no idea what his specific intent was with the lyrics of the song, if it even is overly specific but I mean in general.

          Their are analogues that seem to be just part of life experience whether one talks about them in terms of Biblical ‘sin’ or just the law that life will include pain and turmoil and then death – and this is what most good art is about.

        • GGirl

          I wouldn’t quite say that nothing good comes from religions. And to be quite honest in their deepest purest essence they teach love and compassion. I don’t particularly like the way some people expect you to believe without questioning, loving your kind but not the rest who are different and think different. If you listen to the stories of all religions they all have the same stories. Hindus have a story a lot like the Moses one, the great flood was told in all of them including the Po pol Vuh (Mayan), we are more alike than different. But there will always be people who will want MORE, or will want something different. They will seek the greatness of higher power in science, the way the series COSMOS made us more humble. Classic Philosophers like Plato, Plotinuns, Porfirius. And great minds and souls like Pythagoras, Confucius and Lao Tse, they lived the wonderful life of the permanent question, to be free to ask and live a permanent spiritual adventure. However, from the looks of this page, it’s far and away from religion, since the people here won’t allow the benefit of a doubt.

        • goldushapple

          >>No good comes of religion

          Stop being a dumba__.

      • anon0246

        Homosexaulity and heterosexaulity are natural

        • Gandolfication

          but some are more equal than others.

        • goldushapple

          Since there’s no gay gene homosexuality isn’t ‘natural.’ Heck, cancer is natural yet there’s campaigns to “cure” it. Wait … Now that’s ironic.

  • Anna Albert Harter

    I’d been enjoying this song for weeks, but literally just the other day I actually listened to what he was saying-I turned it off right away. I’m so glad you broke the lyrics down, I’m going to have my 13 year old read this blog post, because he always turns the volume up in the car, innocently thinking the guy is talking about something good! This song is literally everywhere, and no wonder, because it’s so stinkin’ catchy! Keep up the good work Dr. Taylor-and stay salty!!

    • Yes, Stay salty!!!

      • Matthew O’brien

        Have you figured out how far off the mark you were in your interpretation yet?

        • goldushapple

          He’s not, at least when it comes to the lyrics. The lyrics are about a girl – the sexual temptations she offers her potential lover. The video is about two homosexuals.

      • Truth

        You do understand that the song isn’t about a woman.. at all… ever. It is about a guy being forced into putting away the fact that he is a gay man. The video then shows him and his boyfriend deciding to stop interacting with each other to hide that they are gay so that they aren’t targeted by their church, and then the church kills his boyfriend in angry-mob fashion.

        If anyone can see the lyrics and understand what is going on, and think that the gay man is in the wrong, you are out of your mind. Killing a person because of their sexual orientation is outright stupid, and I guarantee that you are not following your religion correctly if you think that it is ok.

        • goldushapple

          The lyrics are about a girl – the sexual temptations she offers her potential lover. The video is about two homosexuals. So the song IS about a woman, but the video is about homosexuals; combined they are pro-sexuality in either a hetero or homosexual relationship.

    • Ariestotle

      Please do not take away a song your child enjoys purely because of a narrow minded, hipocritical, utterly ridiculous notion that the expression of completely normal human emotions through music will somehow corrupt him or allow Satan into his life. Musical talent is gifted by God. If your child enjoys the song and it makes him happy, why should the meaning even matter? That song pleasing your child is part of His plan for him. You deprive your child of that innocent joy that becomes so much harder to find the older you get, and you’ve done more damage than any artist or demon could do. An extreme statement, I know, but it’s thoughts like yours and people like you that upset people everywhere, including members of the same faith like myself.
      Another thing: music, just like any other work of art, is created, given a title and then released to the world. People come into contact with it one way or another and have their own interpretation of the piece. Yes, the artist can always explain the ideas and meaning that they put into it initially, but that’s just their interpretation of their art, which is honestly just as valid as anyone else’s interpretation. Whatever art means to you is exactly what it was supposed to mean. That’s the beauty of art and of music. If your child is filled with joy at the relaxing and soulful sound of Hozier’s work, then that’s the only thing that matters.
      “But!” You say in what has to be almost the same annoying voice as the woman who was trying to convince young people that Monster energy drinks are the beverage of the devil (that’s a debate for a different time and place), “if everyone’s interperetation is as valid as anyone else’s, then it’s perfectly justifiable for me to take Satan’s hands off of my child’s Christian ears and turn off that evil music!” No. It’s alright for you to hear the song, dislike what you hear, and then consider whether it’s worth ruining something for your child with your own pointless, “self-righteous” reasons and having your child live in as much fear of people being free with their thoughts as you do.

      If anyone actually took the time to read all of this, I appreciate your attention and your care for the opinions of others. Everything written above isn’t just arguing to argue; it’s to share the opinion of a lifelong Christian who thinks that maybe there’s room for a little more grace and compassion in everyones heart. I did get a bit emotional and even insulting, and for that I apologize, but I have been exposed to too much forced “holy censorship” to not have some kind of emotional response. I look forward to hearing your thoughts and opinions.

      • Anna Albert Harter

        Hi Areistole, I’m going to take your comments about my parenting and or “faith walk” with a grain of salt. I don’t seem to find in my comments that I was going to forbid my son from listening to this song, but instead I stated I was going to have him read the article. It’s hard to judge someone’s parenting from a blog comment, that’s why I’m not going to take it too personally or spend too much time defending my choices of media I expose my kids to. I will however, at the risk of defending myself, say that I am a HUGE fan of all music and all types of music and generally flip back and forth between KLOVE the Alt Rock station in our town, and NPR. (I got Foo Fighters tickets for Christmas) That being said, I am not one of those parents that forbids all secular forms of music or art for that matter-as you suggest. What I was grateful to Dr. Taylor for doing was giving me a discussion topic and for opening the door up for my son and I to have the conversation of “what do you think?” regarding this particular song. No hard feelings.

        • Truth

          But Dr. Taylor interpreted the song completely wrong. Please, do not show your child this blog post, because it is wrong. He misses the mark completely. The song is about a gay couple, no woman or god at all. It’s about a church (a RADICAL church) attacking them for being gay.

          If you honestly want to know what this song is about, I recommend looking up the music video on youtube along with the one with lyrics at the bottom so you can break down what is going on. But, be warned, there is violence in it, as well as 2 males kissing once (short).

          I am all for people believing in religion and following their faith, but acts of violence that is not called for anywhere in their faith, those acts of violence against another human being for just believing in something different… that is horrible and one of the worst crimes I think we can commit as people.

        • Gandolfication

          My parents tried to do this kind of thinking approach to Christianity. The thinking took, this type of Christianity had to go.
          It was just too narrow and inaccurate and unloving a way to look at and live in the world.

      • Dhelia

        You are an inspiration. I could not agree more. If more people were a little more excepting like you more people might believe in Gods message. Thank you for proving tht you don’t have to hide under a rock, away from the world to be a good christian.

    • Gandolfication

      I think Stay Salty is the working title of his third album.
      It had to be said.

  • janelle

    Men are so mixed up today. They left real masculinity long ago and we have the prototype now. Sad. Bring our real men back, we need them to be strong for our families.

    • With Troops of Saint George we are trying to form true men for our families and our priesthood.

    • Gandolfication

      There has always Ben homosexuality and also ‘worshiping’ beauty and love.

      So its sad to figuratively worship a person you know for sure is real and present with you, but totally great to literally worship an invisible spacegod while making it blasphemous to fully exault in actually human love – please count me blasphemous then.

      • I’ve been reading many of the comments here, and Gandolfication you have taken a good deal of time and energy trying to convince the inconvincible. Your reason, logic, and many supportive examples are more than just sound, they are, in my humble opinion, self evident. But as the ancient saying goes (and I paraphrase) “people don’t see the world as it IS, but as they are.”

        Faith is an impenetrable wall built by man out of fear. It’s understandable given the mechanical and conditioned nature of the mind. Without a crutch on which to lean (such as Heaven or Christ), one is forced to face what IS, right here and NOW, and most people are not interested or capable at being alone with themselves. It’s the most difficult of all things to UNDO – the mind’s conditioning; one’s history which he continues to repeat. Faith is a great excuse for putting the responsibility of saving one’s self on another’s shoulders.

        I wasn’t going to comment as I’ve learned the futility of doing so in such forums, but I thought to ask you to ask yourself why you are here. Why are you trying to convince the inconvincible? What good will it do even if you reach one man? The fact is that one is responsible for one’s own consciousness, one’s own state of being. Why? Because no one can be conscious on behalf of another.

        I learned the hard way that my opposition to the faithful and many other mad belief systems in the human world (rather, humanity is mad in general, but when madness is common it’s called sanity, so who can SEE?), it’s really my ego against their ego. Isn’t it Sir?

        Christ was a great man not because he did anything special, but because he UNDID his own history, his own conditioning – he was free of prejudice and judgment which is only possible when one is free from believing in the self – the center of any universe as long as one believes in it. That is why man is greedy. That is why man is envious. That is why man is never satisfied. That is why man is ever suffering, and ever violent. Put Christs words next to Buddha’s, or the Tao or J. Krishnamurti or Socrates or Tolle or a number of other (handful) of people and one can see a distinct Knowledge which they have all realized despite the distance between them in years and geography and despite their different cultures and languages.

        I believe that what Christ tried to teach was something that couldn’t be taught using language, or concepts. Therefore, he, just like others before him, was misunderstood and 2000 years later people still use him as an excuse to hate and kill and torture others. I think he would cry if he saw what man has and continues to do in his name.

        In any case, I digressed. What I want to say is just this – why are you here in this forum? You, like me, don’t belong here friend. 🙂

        • Gandolfication

          Rula, I wanted to mention that you’re the third person in a couple weeks who mentioned and recommended Ekchart Tolle to me. I am normally not much for people who others refer to with titles like ‘spiritual guru’ (for example I find Depak Chopra ridiculous and incoherent). But happily I picked up a free audio book of Mr. Tolle and so far it makes sense and I quite like it. Thanks

          • Hi, I only now realized that I had messages haha Yes, I’m not one to recommend “others” because I believe that the guru is a dangerous entity. However, Eckhart is worth at least a listen…especially in his own voice. If you haven’t ever heard J. Krishnamurti speak either, I would recommend him too. He died in 1986 but Sir, I tell you he never ever took on a single disciple. He never let any person touch him or speak to him in reverence. For sixty years he travelled the world and would get on stage, speak, and simply get up and walk out. On You Tube you will find many of his talks…it’s worth listening to him speak – but reading his book “Freedom from the Known” is worthwhile too…as is reading his very small (published) tape recordings to himself the year before he died at age 91. Many books have recorded what he spoke, including the book, “The Awakening of Intelligence”. Very interesting and worthwhile. Nice to make your acquaintance by the way. 🙂

        • GGirl

          You’re the only sane one I’ve read. You sound like a philosopher, and I mean that as a compliment. However… I understand Gandolification… why not comment, why not try to reach that one person who wants to question and let them know there are more us. There are people who are seeking for people like us. To know there are more of us wanting to look for what unites us and that’s beyond the boundaries of a religion it seems. Today, I found you, and him. I’m glad you guys exist and I’m glad both of you took the time to write. All though I’m catholic I had NO IDEA they were getting this close minded. God bless you for trying.

          • Hello GGirl,
            What a kind response, thank you for writing. I do understand what you’re saying. Maybe someone is struggling with these questions and is standing on the boundary between one side and the other. Maybe that one person will be affected by the words of one person or another in a positive way. I do agree. I’m only asking if he or any of us ever ask ourselves why we are doing what we are doing. Maybe it’s because he wants to bring someone to ‘our side’ – (even then the point is to undo all sides), but maybe if one looks closely, one may find that it’s more a matter of wanting to be “right” or something to that effect. The time and energy he spent is indicative of someone who has gotten a little ‘lost’ in trying to ‘reach’ someone. I’m not questioning his motives for any other reason than that he sounds intelligent and I can relate to what he was doing here…but when I look deep inside myself I can see that it’s more related to satisfying the ego than it is to helping anyone else. Therefore, to look and be honest with one’s self and to save and treasure one’s energy and use it for the endeavor of remaining more conscious, more aware, more alert – more PRESENT, would be a much more transformative and effective ACT…a conscious act. That’s all 🙂 Much appreciate your response, made me smile 🙂

          • GGirl

            I hear you. There are no sides, there’s no point in trying to satisfy our ego. But you and I will agree that the reason there’s pain in the world it’s because of ignorance. What I understood here today is that you can’t discuss anything with an ignorant, and if we’re going to sit here and argue… there’s just no point in doing it. I go to a philosophical organization called New Acropolis and we study all world cultures and what I can tell you is that I love all the sacred books of all religions. They are truly beautiful and all show love and compassion. If we could see them without any judgment we would see that this thing called God doesn’t forsake anyone and never gives up in humanity, neither should we. But if we can’t correct with love, then it’s just criticism. The Chinese say, “If you correct a wise man, he will become wiser, if we correct and ignorant, he will become your enemy”. You take care Rula, stay conscious!

  • Fr.WBS

    Growing up in the Washington D.C. area there was a radio show on Sunday mornings “Sound and Sense” by a local Episcopalian minister which always looked at pop. songs and used them for theological messages. THANK You for this post in that tradition.

    I myself just heard it a few days ago (I am one of those who typically listens to non-pop radio or else CDs or even … gasp… silence) and initially was curious about the repetition of “take me to Church’ and the other clear references to Catholic imagery…. and like you I looked up the lyrics and was saddened…

    To me, the deepest corruption is in the chorus: “Offer me my deathless death Good God, let me give you my life”
    For as the maxim says, the corruption of the best is the worst… and having corrupted the sacarament of Penance this now corrupts the Eucharist – that medicine of immortality. Rather than accepting that he must give up his life to enter eternal life, he would rather hand over his life to his idol-god and receive a deathless death… in the depths of his soul.

    • Excellent thoughts Father, especially about “corruption of the best is the worst.”

      • Matthew O’brien

        Seriously. Your way off the mark on what this song is about.

    • Phat

      Sin is sin God loves homosexuals just as much as he loves the priest. We need to unite & stop allowing satan to separate us. we are all pieces of our Heavenly Father wether straight, homosexual or celibate. Love & peace

      • jillywilt

        Absolutely agreed!!!! We are commanded to love our neighbor as ourselves. That means all of the human race. We can love without living as the people we do not feel have the same beliefs as we do. Being kind to other’s who you do not feel are godly people doesn’t not mean that you are not a Christian. It only means you are doing what Jesus himself would do. He was kind to all mankind. Being kind to a prostitute doesn’t make you a prostitute. It just makes you kind. That doesn’t mean you have to consort with people who do not share your same beliefs. Just be kind to all and show the same love that Christ would show. Just because I do not feel homosexuality is the way God would have me live does not mean that I am any better and that God loves me more. We all come from the same place. We are all cut from God’s cloth, in His image. Just as we are human, so is a priest. We are all flesh and blood, none more deserving than the rest. The only thing that separates us IS hate. Hate is from the Devil himself. He wants distention among the human race. Hate is what makes wars and violence. In turn, we are doing what the devil wants by hating and judging others. He thrives on the hate and distention. Are we doing what the devil wants or what God wants?

    • Gandolfication

      Or maybe he realizes the hear and now with real human love is all that he can know is true and why not fully exault in that?

      Do you actually realize how bizarre it is that an otherwise presumably inteligent person would rely on something with the following quixotic gobbledygook?

      “the corruption of the best is the worst… and having corrupted the sacarament of Penance this now corrupts the Eucharist – that medicine of immortality”

      • zurvan

        “Or maybe he realizes the hear and now with real human love is all that he can know is true and why not fully exault in that?”
        A thousand times this. That is precisely his message.

  • janelle

    Well the man explains his video on youtube,
    Hozier on the story behind ‘Take Me To Church’ – Gigwise Interview
    He says he isn’t blaming the church for the violence against gays but I am not so sure about that. He sure doesn’t like what the church says about it.

    • Gandolfication

      Why should he like it?
      And why should the church not bear responsibility for what it has taught these couple thousand years?

      • zoltan

        The Church does take responsibility for teaching that homosexual acts are evil — it’s still in the Catechism.

        • Gandolfication

          Yes, and the amount of importance we should place on this teaching should be about inversely proportional to the vast number of other medieval, superstitious teachings that science, reason and sanity have fortunately overtaken, many of which the church and the pope have then changed despite being infallible.

          • zoltan

            I find it far more important than some random internet commentator. I’m not sure why you think you’re convincing, I guess you’re just tossing out what you believe into the wind for fun. It is the internet after all.

  • Sandra Lipari

    Caught too like Dr. Marshall … by all music, lyrics. Its a sad song, … love to hear Christopher West’s analysis too. “Tell you my sins and you sharpen your knife…” hurt in confession, or by a confessional experience. This is real. Sad… like the Sacred and profane are so often too close. It hurt as Scott stated to read the actual lyrics from what you’d hoped they might be. Sad, so strong gone so wrong!

    • Sandra. That’s interesting. I hadn’t imagined a bad confession experience. It’s sad because confessing sins is supposed to bring about healing, not more wounds.

      Our Lady of Guadalupe pray for us!

      • Matthew O’brien

        I really think you need to redo this whole blog on the song. Did you even know it’s about homosexual oppression?

    • Gandolfication

      So art is good as long as it conforms to Catholic liturgy and theology. Thank God there dreamt of in your philosophy. is more in heaven and earth than are

  • Karl

    Personally I’m quite liberal when it comes to the arts, but when it concerns something which has blasphemies such as “Take Me to Church” that’s when I don’t condone such things. It is officially my least favorite song ever. I hate it.

    It has me thinking… Since this song has gone so mainstream that people would recognize it, I think this is a reflection of the society we live in. This song has made secular liberalism officially the current societal status quo. And yet people like Hozier say they’re against the status quo. The irony is that once you become the status quo at first you wouldn’t admit to being the status quo.

    • Gandolfication

      Why do you dislike blasphemy?
      Is it just because some others have told you so?

      “Since this song has gone so mainstream that people would recognize it, I think this is a reflection of the society we live in.”

      Um yah.

  • Stephen Lowe

    I agree with you….catchy tune but sacraligious. I am kinda trying to change the words to make it a little appropriate. I think that can be done, but not by me.

    • Gandolfication

      There’s a lot of serious repression going on on this site.

      • Agnostic

        I’ve been reading all of your comments for a few minutes…and good god you’re tearing them a new one! Keep it up lad

  • Rose

    I also liked the song until I listened to some of the lyrics. It is sad that this is what we’ve come to and are up against as parents. Thanks so much for this Dr. Marshall!

  • Nancy

    The music (aside from the lyrics) certainly has modern appeal and gives an allusion of attractiveness. Satan is dredging memories we seemingly can relate to and have empathy for, until we take a closer look at the lyrics. Unfortunately, most do not, so thank you for the heads-up. In watching the composer’s utube analysis and the band’s video (I was afraid to watch until the end, but did), it does bring up an issue that we can never condone in the use of violence to control people. If it is true that these hate groups exist and are committing these atrocities, raising our awareness of this is one benefit we can find in this song.

  • Maria Gabriela Salvarrey Rodri

    I think you’re right and I’d go a little further, I’d say it’s definetly Satanic. It is just perfectly Satans kind of work. He is subtle and subluminal and paints what is abominable as beautiful and pleasant and what is true love as heavy and enslaving he wants you to see things exactly the opposed to the truth. But he makes it lovely and funny. He is moking the sacraments just as they would in a black mass. This is true distilled venom the fact that it’s sweet makes it all the more dangerous. Thank you for bringing it to my attention I didn’t know the song but will share with my son and have a little discusion about it. It’s good to analize things like this with them it makes them more aware and awake to this type of lies from the father of lies.
    Thank you.

  • Gil Pacheco

    I just read your very interesting critique of “Take Me to Church” by Hoizer. This is the first time I have heard of this vocal artist and his song (where have I been:) so I went over to Youtube to hear it for myself. The song lyrics and music video offers two distinct messages in a cleverly wrapped melody delivered by a truly talented vocal recording artist.

    The first message within the lyrics is about a male/female relationship where the male has an absolute and total obsession with his girl friend to the point that his addictive love/lust he holds for her replaces his common sense. He is addicted to her like an alcoholic to booze or a drug addict to crack. In all instances we know that such as addiction is a disaster in the making but certainly the addicted lover of this song can not help himself as his rationality and reality has replaced God with his object love becoming his goddess – an idol to behold and worship above all things.

    This addictive relationship is underlined within a metaphor of the song’s (singer/songwriter included) accompanying theme of his views on Christianity/Catholicism without being direct but rather transparent with the use of lyrical analogies. This type lyrical composition certainly attracts the Judas Priest crowd, however, it is a subliminal underground defamation of the Church which has a subconscious appeal rather than an overt 10,000 watt screaming Slayer concert.

    The second message and metaphor is found within the visual imagery of the music video version of Take Me to Church. The Youtube views are over 43.5 million to date. The music video frames a conservative social and traditional Church view on same-sex relationships as taboo and therefore it must be hidden and cloaked in secrecy. And yet another interpretation of the music video is that the “girl” depiction in the song is not actually a person, male or female, but a substance addiction that will ultimately destroy one’s life and negatively impact family and community relationships..

    Take Me to Church is therefore a metaphor of addictions leading to self-destruction by moral decay, substance abuse and a protest statement of Church views on these issues addressed in the song’s lyrics and visual imagery.

    By all accounts the very catchy musical composition and vocal talent behind the song is award-winning material. Despite it secular popularity, Take Me to Church will not make it for any consideration into one’s hymnals of favorite songs when when its true meaning and intent is recognized as opposing Church doctrine.

    • Gandolfication

      The song isn’t about addiction or substance abuse.

      “The first message within the lyrics is about a male/female relationship where the male has an absolute and total obsession with his girl friend to the point that his addictive love/lust he holds for her replaces his common sense. He is addicted to her like an alcoholic to booze or a drug addict to crack. In all instances we know that such as addiction is a disaster in the making but certainly the addicted lover of this song can not help himself as his rationality and reality has replaced God with his object love becoming his goddess – an idol to behold and worship above all things.”

      Can you explain why love–even to an obsesaive degree–should always be squarely rational but not love of an invisible spacegod placed above flesh and blood human beings?

  • Sean Bailey

    You nailed it in one, being Irish I heard it before it became an international hit, and like you I was mesmerised by the melody, however I felt the need to check out the lyrics and as soon as I did it was abundantly clear what it was about. I find now that when I hear it being played I constantly pray the Hail Mary just to stop the melody from going around in my head. God Bless you Taylor,
    Sean Bailey

    • Gandolfication

      I never knew th Irish were so sheltered.

  • Almario Javier

    It’s an unfortunate overreaction to the sort of thing that passed for Catholicism in Ireland during the Twentieth Century, if my sources are correct. Catholicism then was not perfect, but people have overreacted and brought in license instead.

    • Gandolfication

      Of by “not perfect” you mean horrible, repreasobe, hate filled and killing Protestants then okay.

  • Rooster

    It doesn’t surprise me reading all of the negativity towards this song and it’s author. Instead of celebrating the genius of this song or better yet, ignoring it , you have elected to call it sacreligious and blasphemous. I was raised catholic, attended K-8 elementary school and completed the first four sacraments before electing to discontinue my participation in the church. If Christian embraces all that is universal, the Catholics certainly missed the boat on that. The Catholic Church is repressive, inflexible and archaic. If the song strikes a chord with you, it’s maybe because there’s some truth in it. Just because Hozier has a different opinion about the church than you and elects to sing about it doesn’t make him a bad guy. Embrace his differences so that you may understand him better. If the church is all accepting, why do you have a problem with Hoziers work? Religions that show intolerance are nothing more than cults lead by evil controlling men.

    • Gandolfication

      Why are Catholics so legalistic about everything?
      Its one thing the evangelicals have over the C’s. That and better services and not as much pedophile protecting.

  • NicSanti

    can i still sing it?

    • Gandolfication

      You may.

  • Gill Bennett

    Dr. Marshall delivered a sound message in his Dec. 17 2014
    video titled : 5 Common Mistakes Catholics Make in Defending Catholicism. One of the mistakes he said Catholic make was using the
    straw man argument. A straw man argument is to set up a weak version of the opponent’s
    argument and then rip it down. To avoid
    this mistakes he points out to “understand their beliefs” “don’t create strawmen.” Providing an “analysis” that interprets
    another man’s thoughts, ideas, and intention of their message (see red
    commentary in red) without understanding the artist’s actual intent in each of
    these lines seems contrary to avoiding this mistake. Taking a quote from a magazine and providing
    “so there you have it from Hozier himself” sets up the opponent’s argument to
    rip it down. This is further done under
    the assumption “Take Me to Church by Hozier could only have been written by an
    Irishmen with Catholic root.” Regardless
    if we don’t like what we “perceive” Hozier’s message to be making leaps in
    logic to construe it as sacrilegious and blasphemous doesn’t seem like a
    productive way to defend Catholicism, rather it seems kind of “salty.”

    “Love Your Enemies and
    Bless Those Who Persecute You” Matthew 5:44

    • Regent Major

      I don’t like what he’s saying = equals satanic worship. Bravo!!

      I could write a thesis on the ignorance of this article. Dr Taylor if you did as much research into the person behind the song as you did misinterpreting the true meaning of the song you might have come to different conclusions.

      In fact you are the ignorant mouthpieces which he speaks about in the song. Ironic as this is i am not surprised you feel the need to critique it.

      How do you feel about the message the video portrays?? Highlighting the torturing of kids in russia because they are in the LGBT community. You probably saw it as some kind of gay propaganda to turn people homosexual through song.

    • Kevin Shinmin Cheng

      Exactly what I was thinking. Thank you Gill.

  • rosa perez

    So I believe the woman he’s referring to in the song is Satan, outright makes sense when you look at it that way as well.

    • Gandolfication

      Definitely Beelzebub. Yep.

    • kathrine

      Honestly if you look into hard enough it could be about Obama or Hillary Clinton or Katy Perry. Or even back to God (because who are we to assign gender. Who are we to even make God so human as to have gender but off topic) what’s your point?

  • Dr. Lane Blake

    Y’all get so defensive. It’s funny because it’s so typical. All gods and religions are man-made. You are a pawn. Learn that and be free from religion. Shed the chains and stay salty.

    • Bruce

      What possible value does blank assertion bring to argument?

      • Gandolfication

        As much as that based on superstions passes down from.tribal nomads in the dessert 2,000 years ago without more?

  • Cindy

    I agree. I had not actually taken the time to analyze the lyrics as thoroughly as you have here, but I had also recognized the Catholic things used in this song. I expected it was some crappy message though.

  • BriannaHeldt

    Yep. I too originally liked the song but after hearing the lyrics more closely I switch the channel when it comes on. Yuck!

    • Gandolfication

      Yucky.

  • Anemity

    Well, he does say hes a pagan of the good times. Not sure this means anything but I do know that paganism is very much against god.

    • Stargazer

      You do realize Christianity took most of its belief system from Paganism, right? Pagans are not against God, in fact they embrace many different gods/goddesses with sole purpose of living a life of harmony and equality with fellow man and beast. Christianity bastardized a lot of the Pagan traditions, took their celebrations/ holidays and turned them into their own, and whatever didn’t suit them they propagated as ‘evil’. If you bothered to read anything anywhere at all you would find that Paganism isn’t what the church would want you to believe it.

      • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

        Ah yes ….. the harmonic beauty between man and nature of throwing babies and virgin women into fiery furnaces to please Baal ,Aphrodites ,and other sun and moon “gods” made up by Satan.

        Christianity began in Genesis when GOD commanded a lamb sacrifice to symbolize the future self sacrifice of GOD in the person ofMessiah (Jesus Christ the SON/LIVING WORD OF GOD AND GOD HIMSELF ) whose innocent blood washes our sins.

        After GOD flooded the word, Noah stepped off the Ark to a world where Judeo Christianity had no competition. This was centuries before Babylon,Media,Persia and Media Persia,Egypt and Greece or Rome popped up to oppress the Jewish Israelites .

        • Matthew O’brien

          Just curious. How many innocent people were slain in the name of God? How many culters were nearly wiped off the face of the earth because they were invadded and told they had to believe in your religion or die!

  • O

    Heh love the idea of you happily listening to this song then realising it’s basically mocking you, classic.

  • Eddie

    The music video represents homosexuality an abomination in the eyes of God as something misunderstood and we should accept it. Later his gay lover is chased down by an angery mob. Which would seem to be Christians. That is saying that Christ and God are not good that they preach hate. Which is not the case. Catholics are diffrent from Christians but most people see it all as the same. It makes Christians look bad and that we hate people who don’t belive in what the bible says. That not the case. It’s showing a distorted view. Saying christens are intolerant and he talking about the God he worships as you pointed out. But that God is lucifer. This song is a deception by the great deciver himself. When I told someone what it was really saying they said no it’s a song about being born sick…… Praise God I have the ability to see it. And i thank Jesus for that. I don’t hate anyone I care about everyone and I want to see people in sin become saved by Jesus.
    God bless.

    • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

      I can’t wait to see Hozier’s video version with MUSLIMS IN IRAN.
      OH WAIT! Muslims only kill gays on sight.

      Christians are worse for preaching its abomination and attempting to ” straighten” them.
      That shows the hipocrysy of all “gay activists”.

      • zurvan

        I’m more than happy to speak out against the intolerance of LGBT people for any reason and in any faith.

  • Carl

    I don’t quite know what to say here. The main thing to focus on is getting closer to God. As much of a misnomer that this song is, it is more of a nonsequitor. You’re not offending God with your actions as much as keeping yourself from His blessings. It isn’t a sacrelidge because God isn’t necessarily offended by a song (however misguided). Hozier clearly doesn’t get it, and seems more interested in a type of hedonism, but taking it into a satanic notion is overkill, I think. Personally I wish I could rewrite the song and play it on a christian rock station with potent words about the love of God. I prefer not to attack a person’s position. Simply protect the truth.

    • Gandolfication

      Assuming that you have any proof, evidence or even reason to believe anything you just said….

  • Jo

    You people are so wrapped up in hate that you can’t stop spewing it forth for all to hear! God and Jesus are love! We were born sick we all sin homosexuality being least on a long LONG list! Maybe instead of preaching hate and condemning your fellow brothers and sisters for their sin you should look inside let he who has not sinned cast the first stone! Love is the goddess the church is hypocrisy! He’s saying that we should worship love (God) and stop hurting others and except all as they are as Jesus did and STILL DOES!

    • Gandolfication

      Or maybe sin is only in a person’s head.

  • Jo

    I am gay… I was born this way I thought something was wrong with me but God created me this way it may be sin but he loves me for who and what I am and even when others (the church) can’t and won’t except me God does 🙂 bless you all and I love you!

    • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

      GOD didn’t make you gay. He made you a heterosexual male or female soul. I believe Satanic interfered with you in the womb and made you this way.
      God loves you indeed and is aware of your struggles.
      But I’m sure God doesn’t create gay or sin. He destroyed Sodom and Gamorra for their rampant homosexuality.
      Jesus himself said thou shalt not lay down with man as with a woman for its an abomination.

      • Kevin Shinmin Cheng

        This is actually incorrect. The words heterosexual and homosexual is a modern day American word, not found in the bible in our Hebrew and greek text. Can you please point out where in scripture it said God made people a “heterosexual male or female soul”? I can definitely point out where it says he knit us all in prior to the womb and that we were wonderfully made.

        • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

          If your soul has no predetermined gender , gays can’t say things like “Im a woman trapped in a man’s body.”.

          Likewise, since your soul isn’t meant to have a gender (as you argue) They must behave as the gender of their human bodies determine. Oh wait! that’s ” homophobic”?
          Oh, maybe you are one of those who consider gender a ” social construct”.

          • Gandolfication

            What gender did god make someone born with both male and female attributes and genetalia?

            Oh right, anything you dont like was Satan.

          • cwaltz

            Uh gays don’t say I’m a woman trapped in a mans body, transgender people do. God also made people who are both genders. I guess it must be He has “off” days. Either that or you got it wrong and have no idea what God’s intent is. I’m going with the latter.

        • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

          Can you please help me see where I supposedly quoted scripture and said “homosexual and heterosexual” are words in the bible?

      • Gandolfication

        Satan made you unintelligent in th womb.

    • Gandolfication

      And it isn’t a sin even if you believe in dont and were taught that horrible disservice.

    • cwaltz

      You are exactly as you are meant to be and don’t let anyone else try to convince you otherwise by cherry picking a book that was written thousands of years ago and roughly translated thousands of times. Love is not a sin and God does not want you to walk through this world alone.

  • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

    You are an extremist hypocrite for using Hozier as an excuse to bash Catholicism.
    He compares the baby Jesus (stable reference) with HIS GODDESSES genatalia. ( That looks tasty,that looks plenty.) NOBODY CALL THE HOLY EUCHARIST “TASTYAND PLENTY” ITS A SEXUAL REFERENCE TO HIS “GODDESS “¡
    There’s nothing Catholic about the song! Much less Christian. HOZIER IS MOCKING CHRISTIANITY AND CATHOLICISM! YET YOU GET IN “BED” OR SHOULD I SAY “CHURCH” WIRH HIM TO SHARE YOUR ANTI CATHOLIC PROPAGANDA!
    I CAME HERE TO SEEK COMPANY IN MY OUTRAGE FOR THIS SONG. WHAT A DISAPPOINTMENT! TYPICAL PROTESTANT!

    • cathy h

      let the haterade consume you, sharpen your knife strike the first match, cast the first stone. the shrine is the VAGINA.. the SACRIFICE you EAT is jesus. the high horse is the one you pray he will ride in on to SLAY the rest of gay pagan atheist hindu buddhist muslim JEW vegetarian HUMANITY so he can save HATEFUL WHITE angle saxon head stomping
      chrestians like YOU. the smell of smoke the wailing and gnashing of teeth as your B#STARD son tortures everyone who didnt EAT HIM!! lol no thats not homoerotic AT ALL!!

      • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

        Lol.

      • Gandolfication

        Down with vegetarians.

    • Gandolfication

      GOOD CAPS YELLING!

    • GGirl

      I’m a Hispanic, Catholic, and straight and I don’t see anything horrible in the song except the fact that he does feel left out by the rest of the world because of his/her sexual preference. I never have understood why people feel so threatened by stuff like this. Doesn’t it make you wonder why people are feeling left out, why they feel like a finger is pointed at them? People don’t see how things are but how we are. If you want to see the devil everywhere, you will.

  • AmeRican*51*Luis Arroyo

    “My lover’s the sunlight.”— (BAAL WORSHIP REFERENCE)
    “Get something shiny” — (Eucharist holding Monstrance? Of course he’s not really referring to that!)

    • zurvan

      He is quite explicitly criticizing an element of religion he doesn’t like.

    • Matthew O’brien

      You may be educated AmeRicn 51…….. But your still an idiot. And I hope you know that any hate in your Hart stains your soul.

  • Research people! Gosh, throw stones and ask questions later. Typical.

    Hozier stated, “The song was always about humanity at its most natural, and how that is undermined ceaselessly by religious [organizations] and those who would have us believe they act in its interests. What has been seen growing in Russia is no less than nightmarish,”

    It is about people using the religion as an excuse to HATE. If you actually watched the video the religious people are killing the gay guy.

    • Matthew O’brien

      Thank you for not being a sheep.

  • Óscar Ocampo

    Well The church(religion) is a lié that many pepole worship like dogs to bones,Thats the best part of The song is not only beutifull its also full of wisdom and harshtruths

  • Kat

    The video is about the violence and hatred toward “thy neighbor” being committed by those claiming to do God’s work. It is meant to be a mirror turned on the Christian population. Speaking of mirrors, if you want to see something disgusting, just keep scrolling through the self-appointed judgement I see all throughout the replies

  • mazza aye

    I love this song. So much meaning and so many layers.
    Like the bible, dont just read the words, read between the lines.

    • Gandolfication

      And dont read the bible.

  • Kevin Shinmin Cheng

    TL;DR: It’s not a praise song, I don’t think we should judge it as such. The interpreter from the site, only interpreted what he wanted which is taking it out of context. It’s a sad, sad song about how religion and its righteousness has been used for something it was not intended to do. I think there’s something more to this than good and evil.

    I believe we can identify what is and isn’t of God’s by the fruit they bare (Matthew 12:33-37). 2ndly, Hozier does explain, this isn’t a religious song nor is it an attack on religion. It is about how an institution has used religion to promote something that has caused harm, persecuted, and marginalized a people group. It’s calling into question the arrogance of religious organization in very similar ways I see Jesus calling out the Pharisees. I see this as a secular man, who has some sort of spiritual background calling for dialogue about a hard question, “What are we truly worshipping? What are you teaching us to worship?”

    Also, the author didn’t fully interpret the rest of the lyrics. He interpreted what he wanted to interpret as if this is a “praise song” that needs to be “biblically and hermeneutically accurate”. Again, this is not a praise song, don’t interpret it to the standards of something it was not contextually written for. That’s inductive bible study taboo anyways, and I believe the author would know this very well too. I’m going to finish interpreting verse 2 for you, in context of Russia’s Anti-homosexual Campaign that bore a fruit that impacted people to hate, prosecute, marginalize, and torture people groups who identified with homosexuality and justified it under the righteousness of religious and less what we see that is true to who God is in Christ in Scripture.
    ——
    In verse 2 he says:
    That’s a fine looking high horse (that’s some contempt you seem to have for us)
    What you got in the stable? (reference to the Christ Child “in the stable”) (And you preach about Christ and hoard Him)
    We’ve a lot of starving faithful (We have a lot waiting for a message of hope, but we’re -still- starving and thirsty)
    That looks tasty (It looks so inviting)
    That looks plenty (It seems there’s room for you to understand and share that message with us)
    This is hungry work (but you keep it to yourself like you’re starving you won’t share until we “clean ourselves up”.)
    ——–

    It seems throughout, he kind of says, it seems it’s better if I worshipped my own god/goddess, in my bed like a pagan, because what the good god is now, is a message of fear and hatred.

    So, I’m going to be a bit vigilant here and ask some hard questions we as people of God who represent Christ need to think about: Do we all agree with Russia’s anti-homosexual campaign which impacted people to hate, persecute and torture people, that it is right and pleasing in God’s eyes? Can we say, the fruit that it bore was from God and good and pleasing? Do we believe the message we preach in our response to the “mainstream church” in how we respond to homosexuals has been without sin and Christ-centered? Should we as evangelical judge a song writer’s heart song and cry for what was happening in Russia “evil work” and be blind to some of the issues we as a Christian community remain silent in its address?

    I’m going to have to say, the church hasn’t been flawless in the fruit it’s bore. It’s bore some pretty bad fruit in our church history (Crusade and Inquisition to name a few). I’m going to say, the church is not immune to sinning and leading people astray to believe and see that of which is not Christ. Sometimes, we let them see the god we want versus the God that is full of TRUTH and GRACE. There are times however, the church is some amazing and bears a reflection of Christ like it should. It’s been a back and forth. I like listening to this song, and it’s a sad, sad song about how religion and its righteousness has been used for something it was not intended to do. Do I think it’s secular? Yes. Do I think it’s a praise song? No. Do I think there’s something more to this than good and evil. Yes. What do you think? What should our response be? I’ll let you decide.

  • Kevin Shinmin Cheng

    TL;DR: It’s not a praise song, I don’t think we should judge it as such. The interpreter from the site, only interpreted what he wanted which is taking it out of context. It’s a sad, sad song about how religion and its righteousness has been used for something it was not intended to do. I think there’s something more to this than good and evil.

    I believe we can identify what is and isn’t of God’s by the fruit they bare (Matthew 12:33-37). 2ndly, Hozier does explain, this isn’t a religious song nor is it an attack on religion. (Watch his interview of his song by easily googling in “gigwise hozier on the story behind take me to church”). It is about how an institution has used religion to promote something that has caused harm, persecuted, and marginalized a people group. It’s calling into question the arrogance of religious organization in very similar ways I see Jesus calling out the Pharisees. I see this as a secular man, who is very raw in his emotion in this song and has some sort of spiritual background calling for dialogue about a hard question, “What are we truly worshipping? What are you teaching us to worship?”

    Also, the author didn’t fully interpret the rest of the lyrics. He interpreted what he wanted to interpret as if this is a “praise song” that needs to be “biblically and hermeneutically accurate”. Again, this is not a praise song, don’t interpret it to the standards of something it was not contextually written for. That’s inductive bible study taboo anyways, and I believe the author would know this very well too. I’m going to finish interpreting verse 2 for you, in context of Russia’s Anti-homosexual Campaign that bore a fruit that impacted people to hate, prosecute, marginalize, and torture people groups who identified with homosexuality and justified it under the righteousness of religious and less what we see that is true to who God is in Christ in Scripture.

    ——

    In verse 2 he says:

    That’s a fine looking high horse (that’s some contempt you seem to have for us)

    What you got in the stable? (reference to the Christ Child “in the stable”) (And you preach about Christ and hoard Him)

    We’ve a lot of starving faithful (We have a lot waiting for a message of hope, but we’re -still- starving and thirsty)

    That looks tasty (It looks so inviting)

    That looks plenty (It seems there’s room for you to understand and share that message with us)

    This is hungry work (but you keep it to yourself like you’re starving you won’t share until we “clean ourselves up”.)

    ——–

    It seems throughout, he kind of says, it seems it’s better if I worshipped my own god/goddess, in my bed like a pagan, because what the good god is now, is a message of fear and hatred.

    So, I’m going to be a bit vigilant here and ask some hard questions we as people of God who represent Christ need to think about: Do we all agree with Russia’s anti-homosexual campaign which impacted people to hate, persecute and torture people, that it is right and pleasing in God’s eyes? Can we say, the fruit that it bore was from God and good and pleasing? Do we believe the message we preach in our response to the “mainstream church” in how we respond to homosexuals has been without sin and Christ-centered? Should we as evangelical judge a song writer’s heart song and cry for what was happening in Russia “evil work” and be blind to some of the issues we as a Christian community remain silent in its address?

    I’m going to have to say, the church hasn’t been flawless in the fruit it’s bore. It’s bore some pretty bad fruit in our church history (Crusade and Inquisition to name a few). I’m going to say, the church is not immune to sinning and leading people astray to believe and see that of which is not Christ. Sometimes, we let them see the god we want versus the God that is full of TRUTH and GRACE. There are times however, the church is some amazing and bears a reflection of Christ like it should. It’s been a back and forth. I like listening to this song, and it’s a sad, sad song about how religion and its righteousness has been used for something it was not intended to do. Do I think it’s secular? Yes. Do I think it’s a praise song? No. Do I think there’s something more to this than good and evil. Yes. What do you think? What should our response be? I’ll let you decide.

  • Mabafo

    This is why youth are running from traditional organized religion. The Creator creates, man judges.

  • Gandolfication

    Its really sad (and kind of tragically hillarious also) that so many people here recognize the song as being brilliant but still get caught up in the superstions you’ve been taught and thus can neither enjoy nor accept it or its mesaage or critique it based on atistic and rational grounds.

  • Shaili

    I think you missed out on the meaning of the song. It’s a response to state oppression and homophobia in Russia, and the violent riots and actions which accompanied it. (‘we were born sick’ ; homosexual) as in the church considers homosexuals sick, and treats it like it is a condition (‘command me to be well’), and the ‘gentle sin’ is homosexual activity. The video is a clear, very realistic allusion to what is happening in Russia right now. It attacks the church for preaching homophobia for thousands of years, when it is so natural, in his own words, ”about an organization undermining some very natural part of humanity”. I think it is also about sexuality in general, and about how we are not ope about it, when it is a ‘ very natural part of humanity’. I think it also incorporates some of his own experiences, as he from Ireland, where the Catholic church is so powerful, and the society is (in his words, not mine) ‘blatantly misogynistic and homophobic’. I’m no expert, but I think this is great music, all the more so because of the powerful communication and the accuracy of the lyrics, which I can identify despite being non- Christian and atheist. Lastly, I just want to say that homosexuality is completely natural – love is love, and that by suppressing it, we are denying a large part of humanity and hurting millions of people- who are in no way different from us or ‘unclean’. Oh, and, to most of the commentators, if you haven’t experienced homosexuality, who are you to judge it?

  • Emily

    I totally agree. It is a way to get around the “obvious” hatred. I mean its music, so I cant be like “Take it off the air” Im not saying that at all, cause they have their rights, but I have mine too, and I refuse to listen to this song. I turn the radio to another station. I dont like the fact that he’s referencing God as being a simple girl. I would never put up with that if a guy did that. Its repulsive. But like I said it’s his freedom. However, if a Christian is looking for the answer whether or not to listen to this song, I would say no. And then I would tell you to ask yourself, “If God was sitting right next to you and you could see him. Would you listen to this song?” And if your answer is no, then you definitely shouldnt be listening to it. I think the values of this song are all wrong. I will admit its catchy and sometimes its hard to change the channel when it comes on, but I do it anyway.

  • Josh

    Some of these commenters… Ohh no! A song exposing the church’s negative stance on human rights. We must hate it now. Great logic. It’s all about equality people come on.

  • Chris

    What a very sad man is all I think about. If i put all my hope and energy and well life into something that is failing i dont know where id be i can’t comprehend my savior Lord of all not beside me walking with me in this evil world.

  • Josh

    That is such a vile interpretation, it’s not even funny lol.

  • Michael Stevenson

    If you watch the music video it shows to gay men being harassed and one of them being killed by members of a church group for being gay, the lyrics “we were born sick” is what Hozier was saying the members of the church were saying about him and his boyfriend because they were gay, I have no idea what half of you are thinking but this isn’t really a blasphemous song…

  • Jaylyn

    I love your analysis on this song and I agree 100%. As Christians we really have to be careful to what we listen to now a days and can’t be naive to the fact that music can have a strong influence on your spiritual walk.

  • Jay

    Thank you for writing this article. I was just listening to the song (came up on Pandora) and actually started to really listen to the lyrics. It got me thinking, and and like you, I felt extremely disturbed after truly listening. So I did some digging and came across your article. Thanks for taking the time to clarify my suspicions. I know as young people we tend to sway and experiment, but coming back to your faith is the most fulfilling step you can take. Mainstream ideology is definitely rearing it’s ugly head at our youth but be strong. I promise the end prize is better when you walk the straight and narrow.

  • Yaya2012

    This song kept coming on and the “take me to church” line was catchy. But then I read the lyrics…. I want to delete this song from my memory

  • KPage

    I was raised by a devout Catholic family, received 9 years of education in a Catholic School (Middle/Junior High School) and was a part of Christian/Catholic groups during those years and after all of that, I left the Catholic Church because of people like all of you. If I am not wrong, Jesus and God teaches us all of treating everyone as equals, yet you pick apart these people’s lives because you live differently then they do, it is disgusting and hypocritical. You talk of all the sin and “perversion” these people are committing, yet you sit at your computer and judge them? I am sorry, but I thought that only God could judge us, but if one of you is God, go ahead and speak up. Many Catholics do sit on a high horse, and if you all do not believe me, read your own comments.

    And just to put a couple things straight:
    1) I am a Christian, I do believe in God and that Jesus was his Son, but I do not believe in the judgement Catholics put upon themselves to use. None of you are God.
    2) I myself am not gay, but I will not allow those who are to be judged by pathetic hypocrites.
    3) If you are true followers of Christ, accept all and let God do the judging.

  • Tati Bugatti

    Deleted my comment that provided a link to hozier himself explaining the song. Which contradicts everything the good doctor thought. Wow.

  • zurvan

    I have to say that I think this is a quite poor reading of the song and its actual critique of religion. He is criticizing the notion of original sin and the element of religion that demonizes romantic love. His use of religious imagery to describe the relationship isn’t literally worshipping the woman in the song, it is making a point that he finds more meaning in engaging in romantic love than he does engaging in the religious shaming of romantic love, and the woman is not consistently the deity he is referring to. An example:
    “Offer me that deathless death,
    Good God, let me give you my life!”
    He’s referring here to the Catholic Church (and other religious organizations) that would have us negate our own natures, saying that he would rather they take his life than to take away everything that gives it meaning. It’s a much subtler message than you are giving it credit for.
    In short, by all means criticize, but criticize it for what he’s actually saying.

  • zurvan

    I also can’t help but add that you missed a key reference: “Created sick, commanded to be sound” was part of a Fulke Greville poem that Christopher Hitchens popularized in his own critiques of the notion of original sin.

  • Camila

    Ignorant lay will drink poison thinking it is candy. I too was concerned when I first listened to the lyrics, researched a little and was not too surprised by what I found. What struck me, however, was just how nuanced and well formed you have to be to catch what is going on.

  • Amanda

    I agree with you, at first I really liked it and thought it might me Christian based, because he was singing about bring me to church and it said amen in it.
    But now I realize that hie church is the girl, and that is so messed up.

  • katie

    Also, just to clear things up, being athiest doesn’t mean your a devil worshiper. It simply means you don’t believe in god or the devil. The actions and choices people make are not influenced by god or the devil, it is their own choice and actions! We choose to believe in reality and what we see with our own two eyes, not what someone tells us we should believe in!

  • Matthew O’brien

    Wow. Did you completely miss all the pagan references in this song. Clearly this song is about the oppressive naturn that is organized religion. The referance to a high horse and eating it points to how those in religious power back in midevil times and even today have food while those not in power starve. My love is the sunlight and the lyric about dirt rituals is saying he would rather worship the earth. This song is not about Satan. But since you are a brain washed Christian that’s all you can see in it. Don’t let you religion make you ignorant. There is a big world out there with a lot to teach you.

  • HeyyyWait

    Hold on… This sing is about him loving his girlfriend? I’m so confused. When I first heard it I thought it was about acceptance and loving your neighbour, then I watched the video and thought maybe it was about a male gay couple… but Hozier is clearly describing a women so then I thought maybe he was singing from the persecutive of a lesbian, then I come here for answers and it turns out it was just your run of the mill “I love this girl she’s awesome” song… SOMEONE PLEASE TELL ME WHAT’S GOING ON!

    • Matthew O’brien

      The women he’s referring to is the goddess.

      • HeyyyWait

        The goddess? As in Aphrodite or something?

        • Matthew O’brien

          He may be referring to the main goddess in pagan religion. Or he could have substituted she for he since the song is about homosexual persacution in the Catholic church. Using she would appeal to a wider group of listeners.

  • He who is free of sin…

    The tone of this article was quite off-putting. For one who subscribes to a doctrine of not judging, you seemed oddly comfortable making sweeping generalizations about the Irish and their culture.

  • shannon

    it was catchy when i first heard it. but i knew something wasnt right in my spirit. so then i used my soundhound app to listen to the lyrics. its amazing how more and more music blaspheming God is becoming so catchy that even ‘the strongest of believers’ have to be more cautious than ever before and be careful what they are subjecting their spirit to.

    • HeyyyWait

      Is it really blasphemous? I interpreted it as being about acceptance and loving your neighbour, like letting God to the judging instead of persecuting people.

  • atheist

    i really doubt you get it. i was curious what a churchy *not sure if that’s a word* site would say. i come from a christian religious family and i decided i absolutely do not agree with the “rules” of this religion at the age of 12. i am atheist. i wanted to say that atheists don’t “hate” jesus, or any other god, we just don’t believe in it. which is pretty rational. and its not this song, which actually gives an amazing message, that is wrong. its the stupid rules of this religion. that you can’t be yourself. and love is a sin. that is disgusting.

    • shannon

      whats up? just wanted to say that it isnt any religion that says or makes up rules. it was God himself. and they arent really rules. because he gives you the choice at your life anyway. thats because he is a ‘just’ God. he doesnt force himself on you. im sorry you fell away from christianity. we are all sinners in the church and some are fake. some are hypocrites. but God also gave us knowledge. i myself have researched many things. studied hebrew, greek, the universe. its amazing! dont be discouraged, come back. look for yourself. if you find fualts in people, then just be the light! i am a sinner myself. but i know God and his word is real. but i am weak. and God is not ever going to bless me if i continue to live in sin. i encourage you to not turn your back on him. if you have questions then find the answers. the holy spirit that dwells in every one of us will guide you and let you know whats right or wrong. i think you already know

  • Zach

    It’s not the artist’s fault that you initially took his lyrics out of context because you wanted them to align with your beliefs. It wasn’t written to undermine religion or be blasphemous, it was written to express the artist’s concern for atrocities committed by humans on others for simply have a different belief, one strong theme having to do with those who have been discriminated against in the LGBT community. Hozier’s interviews will affirm this if you take a few minutes to listen to them.

    It is important to have differing views, that is something that makes us human. This article is important for those who share the same beliefs as Dr. Marshall and the moderators of this website so they have a better understanding of the lyrics This is not the place to get in an argument about it. Just as the artist has his beliefs, all of you reading this have the freedom to have your own. If God is real, let him judge. Regardless of beliefs, we need to get along.

  • Intellectual Design

    I never saw the visualization of gay. He uses the word “she” and “goddess,” which are terms of femininity. However, I saw a man that lost in the lies of the church he was attending and found “love” in another woman that he is now willing to sacrifice himself for the love of his woman. “and the two shall become one” To give up all of yourself to a woman she has the power to kill you in ways that are a deathless death.
    The video on the other hand now provides a visual support of the underlying meaning that the artist believes. Thus, the homosexualty is now become present. It is the video that destroys the song.

  • Linda Lowry Pugh

    I read this to see if anyone else thought it catchy, yet just wrong. Your interpretation, though more in-depth, confirmed exactly what I thought after listening a little more closely to the lyrics.

    • jimmy nobody

      Yes. Beautiful song. But after watching the video (at least part of it) I’ll turn station when it comes on.

  • GenderQueer

    Ah. This article makes me want to listen to this song even more.
    The song is about the repression of homosexuality in Russia. It’s a beautiful song questioning god.
    I love it. I’m going to put it on repeat, hang my LGBT flag high, and take a bath.

  • aaron son of atom

    so i wonder? in the here after, do you all think joseph beat up jesus for plagiarizing his story? or do you think horus beat them both for it? will the authors of the bible ever be acknowledged for plagiarizing the ten commandments from page 125 of the egyptian book of the dead? wanna discus the 1st council of nicaea, you know where a bunch of guys got together and turned a really good idea into a way to control masses? well maybe later you all seem to have your selfs busy with this one hit wonder of a song………which by the way i think your way off on you analysis

  • JJ

    Everyone has their own interpretation of words. The bible was translated differently, so no surprise we don’t believe the same reason for this song!

  • Rebe

    Thank you very much! I am catholic and i do apreciate jour thoughts, because i really like this song and i feel kind of guilty…

  • Charmander✌.

    You’re such a disgusting person.

    Its a sin being like you, a human full of hate.

  • Take Me to Church

    While your Christian analysis of this song is right on, I find your conclusion confusing to say the least. You admit you enjoy this song. Yet, you think it should be censored? How odd.

    If your faith or the faith of your children can’t stand up to a few refrains in a pop song, then it must be a very fragile faith indeed. Your church is losing parishioners and you think it’s the fault of pop ballads with provocative videos?

    My advice? If you don’t want your children to go down the wrong path, make sure the church you recommend to them is on the right one.

    Perhaps the next time you meet a lapsed Catholic, you should ask her why she lost her faith. What do you think the odds are that she will tell you it was because of a song or video game?

  • Sandra

    I do have to say…..I’m SHOCKED at the real meaning of this song!!!! I used to blast everytime it came on…..speechless…..I thought it was promoting God, and thought this is exactly what the young people of America needs, more stars to encourage faith!!!!!!!!!!!!!!….I’m saddened now that I know

  • Cbhn

    Actually you missed the meaning of the song completely. The song is about how the church has imposed on humanity in the past 100 years. And how far the church has come away from religion. Watch Hozier’s interviews on the song before you tell him what his song is about. The video is a juxtaposition between the church-humanity and the Russian mob-homosexuality. The video is another example of institutions imposing on humanity and human rights.

  • andrew

    this song has nothing to do with Christ and only uses religion as a metaphor for an obsessive and slavish devotion to a dominant woman.

  • Dennisjoe

    I agree with you Dr. Marshall. Why is it that a lot of people act like that God has changed His mind about sin and things that are offensive to Him? The Word of God has not changed.

    • Charles W.

      The word of God changes every time someone new reads it. It literally changes according to the politics of the day. The best example is the translation of the Bible that many consider to be definitive here in the U.S., the King James Bible. Almost every other English translation gives Exodus 20:4 as “do not make for yourselves an IDOL….,” or something to that effect. The anti-Catholic King James commissioned a Bible that reads “Thou shalt not make unto thee any graven image….” to give credence to the idea that Catholics were idolators (an idea that I was taught in Sunday School). A more subtle example is Exodus 21:22. For millennia, in both Judaic and Christian tradition, it was interpreted to mean that the woman miscarried (the literal translation of the Hebrew is “and her fruit comes out”). After Roe v. Wade, it became common to interpret, and also translate the verse as the woman giving premature birth, without loss of the child (thus creating a huge gap in the law)

  • joe

    It’s a song that talks about how he sees the church abusing people’s “humanity” the video shows a right wing religious gang in Russia beating a gay man then posting it on Youtube. This is an actual gang. This happens today. This was from the mouth of Hozier. They are anti-established religion when it causes people to act violently toward others who don’t live up to their moral values. That’s basically it. Let’s not read more into it then it means. Hotel California was cast as a song that talked about the first satanic church in America. I used to believe that in my early Christian life. Turns out its about drug addiction. Neither song is from a Christian perspective for sure but as Christians let’s stay true to the facts of the songs as the writers themselves explain. Sadly this song resonates with many on our society. It’s a statement against the way the church has operated historically.

  • Rudiru

    I´m not Irish. I´m not a native (English) speaker. I ´d like the song for its tunes. The lyrics made me wondering what is the message. Thank you so much for your explanations.- I prefer Hill Songs. God speed. Rudi

  • David Massey

    Hozier’ lyrics “Take Me To Church” are no more perverse than ignoring the millions of Catholics that have turned their backs on the Roman Catholic Church demanding change from within. After all, your personal interpretation is your interpretation, not church canon. This discussion is simple proof Hozier is effecting the ruts of norms we’ve shielded ourselves into.

  • Josh

    This is stupid. This song is about the persecution of homosexuals within and outside of the church. The church is simply the most overt organization who condemns homosexuality. He’s gone on record and said this. Do a google search before you jump to (stupid) conclusions. You are the reason religion gets a bad name.

  • David Massey

    Hozier’s lyrics are harmless enough;his greatest offense is also his widest appeal. There is something in his work for each of us to take away. A protagonist for change, he wins by provoking us into a discussion beyond our personal safe zones. Don’t feel too guilty for enjoying his music. Sometimes a shoe is just a shoe.

  • georgia

    Iam very disappointed of the human’s nature!!!i just saw the official video and i felt disgusting!!!what can i say???you always try to show that the attraction between two men or two women is totally natural…and unfortunately something like this is very common nowadays!!!i would like to ask WHY???

  • JWB

    My 15 yr. old daughter knows that song really bothers me and we have discussed its contents, so she decided to write a “new” version for me in a poem form….here it is, I like this version much better….same title….Take me to Church (and it is about 2 lovers)…..I’m on my knees and I’m scared to go inside, Lover, please don’t think less of me. For you said that we came from dirt, we came from clay. My feet must still be covered in soot because I cannot move them. If I move forward an inch I fear they might burn. Lover, please don’t think less of me. I need your love and I need His, The doors don’t seem to open for me. I stand at the back of the funeral. I’ll wait for you out here. Lover please, Lover, no. Don’t take my hand; I don’t think I can stand. My heart is in my hand, my stomach lurches. Lover, take me to church.

  • Mateja – Croatia

    This song is not about what you wrote. It’s about discrimination, judgment and personal choice, both dictated by church. Superficial as you all are, you can’t see it. Sheeps

  • unGodly

    Well I’m so glad to see judgement from church going folk is still alive and kicking, everyone has opinions and perceptions, but we all need to be a little more humble with them when we speak of others, their character, their body of work, and where they come from. We have far bigger issues than a lyric to a song. And if you have read anything that Hozier has said about the song, you would realize that this song is more that what the blasphemous article above has stated. Persuasion is the biggest sin of church and the bible.

  • mia

    God is real to those who believe in him why would that have to offend people the proof is out there people just choose to not see it … If you don’t believe why do u criticize those who do I believe and no one will ever change that I proudly say I believe in God and in my savior Jesus Christ but I don’t agree that because of that I am a hypocrite I try to live my life as best I can ….. you hate and judge but do u know that when u point at those whom you judge there are 3 fingers pointing back at you …. stop the hate that’s all I have to say

  • Mamabear

    First thing that turned me off of the song was God is not capitalized..sets premiss for the entire song.

  • Kim

    T me, the lurics when I heard it – and only really heard the words of the chorus, it felt like a cynical or angry vent at the church, ie by someone who might have felt let down by the church, or had been at a church full of judgement and hypocrisy. However when I read further into the lyrics, in particular the last few verses, I almost feel as though I am reading some sort of intentionally offensive attack on the revelations.
    I can certainly understand someone being angry at the issuesthatmhozier mentions in his interview about the song, but to me I just didnt feel as though the song really was about a sexual encounter.. Certainly not one you wold expect to happen between someone and their partner that they cared for. There is too much anger in it. The are too many thipngs that dont make sense to me in the context of a sexual encounter, or in the context of expressing outrage on issues such as gay and lesbian rights.

    And everything I can find online that quotes Hozier, he only references the first part of the song and seems to almost deliberately ignore some lines… For example

    Take me to church (remember, “Church” here is sexual reference in this song)

    I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies
    If this is refering to worship of his partner… Why does he call her shrine “of your lies”. Is he attacking said partner here, I dont think so in overall context of his interview. So using that phrase, the shrine of your lies, seems an unusual thing to say and doesn’t make sense that it is about his sexual encounter. It also doesn’t make sense to me for him to refer to her in the line above, then refer to worshiping, (which we wold reasonably assume is worship at said church in previous line) at her shrine of lies.. Just before this, he has implied she is the only good thing… Why would he think that if he thinks something about her is deceitful or untrustworthy?

    And why would he imply the church is his lover, the. In the next line make a reference that seems to refer to his lover, and mid sentence change tack and suddenly be referring to things like the gay and lesbian rights issues? It just doesnt make sense.

    And the last verses just don’t, to me, ring true that they him venting on those issues. im not suggesting he doesn’t have strong opinions on the issues he says he does. But I just don’t feel like he is voicing those opinions in this song…in the latter half anyway

    Drain the whole sea
    High horse
    Meaty for the last course
    I feel as though he referring to the revelations as in the bible…

    Anyway I cant find any explanations that tie the verse two and the bridge with the things that hozier claims. Nor can i find any commentary from anyone else that to me seems to link those words with sexual encounters or hoziers feelings on the gay and lesbian issues.

  • Liladdy

    This has literally nothing to do with the actual song meaning, which he’s explained several times. NOT EVERYTHING. IS ABOUT. GOD.

  • Celeste

    If you think it’s ‘satanist’ then don’t listen to it and leave the rest of us alone.

  • The Disgruntled Fan

    Im bisexual and a christian. Id like to say that homosexual meant “men who sleep with boys”. And since we all disregard leviticus we shouldnt even count that one. But whatever spread your bullshit. Your only proving the songs message. Im am not a traditional christian. I am what I call an Interpretationist. Looking at the bible not through a literal lense but rather a historical and scientific one. Understanding that the bible has human error and bias is okay. Gods Word is different from the Bible. The bible is mans translation. And man is inherently flawed.

  • C

    And this, children, is what happens when you jump to conclusions and spout off as if you know what you’re talking about. Good grief. The song is about repression and violence towards the LBGT community in Russia.

  • Robin Goodwin

    I sat down and watched the video(shudder). It is a travesty that this is posing as art and so many young people will be listening to it.

  • BibleThumper101

    Take a better look at “I was born sick, but I love it, command me to be well”. You can read about it on Wikipedia.

  • Thepersonwhohatesmostreligion

    I don’t care what u think but I do like the fact that u think it is offensive to Christians etc. God does not exist, I have proof.

  • Max

    This is about the churches unacceptance of gays analyze it in this sense, and youll realize what I mean. I love this song because it truley represents the hardship and hatred that gays deal with, because of many christians. #gayrights #equality #loveforall

  • Mercedes Anne Miller

    I have seen many interesting comments on here. Some of which I agree with and others that are interesting and make a good point but I don’t necessarily agree with. Yes, everyone is entitled to their opinion and each is to be respected.
    Now, with that said, I am not Catholic. However I know people that are and they are decent people. With that said, Catholicism has become accepting of many different life styles of the modern world, accepting the life styles that the Bible has proclaimed, sinful (such as homosexuality, though I don’t agree with it, I don’t hate people that are, I just don’t agree with the “life style choice”).
    I think this song is a creative way to look at how homosexuals look at religion. Have knowing many people that are homosexual, most were not religious and a few were and still went to church ( as I see it, just trying to be accepted by people that are religious so others that don’t go to church, also accept homosexuals). Also this song could have been created to open up a civil descussion about a rising topic, that being homosexuality.

  • sam

    Every person has a point of view and one words can have many different meanings to a thousand different people.
    My husband and I are Christians but we also like this song because of the vocals. And that interview with Hozier clearly cancels out this entire article as he said “it’s not an attack on faith”

    • Dessy Natalia

      agreed… well sometime its better if we just become a listener.. lol

  • Melisa

    First of all, if you are going to start a sermon and break down this song…maybe it would be wise to research it first… The song is about what is going on right here on this very page… it is a polite dig at certain religious people within the church, that sits high upon their high horse and judges while holding tightly to the keys of their own closets… It also suggest that there is hate”poisonous words” spoken out against people right from the pulpit every Sunday … Who are we to judge others…we don’t know their hearts or their journey… Maybe instead of blasting things we fear or know nothing about we could learn to love others; instead try accepting the fact that we aren’t all going to agree on things or believe as others may believe and maybe just maybe then we can learn to love as Christ compelled us to do…

    • Tom James

      “Maybe instead of blasting things we fear or know nothing about…”

      Hozier should heed those words. He is obviously ignorant of the Christian faith.

  • Sadforgod

    This post is exactly why you cause people to buy this song and hate God. This is all of your faults for using the Word for hate and discrimination. You have given lucifer pride. And you blame Catholics? They are the only church considering softening its stance to try and turn Gods image around. Stop casting stones and worry about yourselves, you have your own sins to answer for and I don’t think God will call any of you into the room for your opinions come a homosexuals judgement day. People like you sadden me for the hate for God you inspire.

  • Ty

    This song is about pure lust and addiction for a women. In spite of everything he knows to be right, just, and true his lust of the flush has taken over and instead of worshiping Christ or Lord and Savior he is worshiping Jezebel. We all know temptation is out there and we fast and pray to stay strong and not buckle to our flush. I personally like the song because it is a lesson and a warning to what could happen to you if you turn from your faith and to the lust of the eye and flush just like the devils tempts us all on a daily bases with all types of SIN. I have seen men that hold high offices in church fall just as this song describes and in the process of the chase he turned to a rabbeted mind and is now lost. It is not my job to judge but to learn what is happening in the world. The question is what would you do when the devil tempts you?Amen

  • Isa

    This is possibly the worst analysis of these lyrics I have come across. You have evidently completely missed the point of the song, only bothering to explain the biblical references included. We can understand those parts ourselves. The meaning of the song, well, of that there is no mention.

  • Gen

    I have a gay family member. I just want to say that I am glad that he was not born to a homophobic family or he would be living an impossibly miserable life. I sincerely hope that no one within your community is a gay person who is living in misery because of your beliefs.

  • dave

    My first question is…How did a discussion of the meaning of a song get so lost in a discussion on religion. I personally (just to way in) have no idea what I believe when it comes to religion but there is one thing I have learned.

    When ever you have someone that challenges anyone’s beliefs system (and it usually doesn’t matter if you can prove beyond a shadow of a doubt your point) there will always be the same response. Whomever is being challenged can only respond with what they have been taught and you can’t fault them for that. What you can fault them for is not wanting to question anything that may shake that system. (and this goes for anyone and everyone)

    i believe if you actually listen to the song…in depth you will her the meaning. You are right it is exactly what Hozier says it is and I can understand with your beliefs it is very easy to dismiss the meaning of this song and”dumb” it down to the song is just about sax and food. This song is a perfect expression how certain organized religions, people and organizations view certain people, mainly being those who’s sexual orientation does not agree with there belief systems or whom they choose to love.

    More an this later 🙂

  • SChavez

    Your analysis of this song is well, bad. But sadly and understandably you can only analyze to the extent of your limited knowledge.

  • Sori

    Self-righteous.

  • Andy

    This is some of the funniest stuff I’ve ever read. You people are ridiculous.

  • David J

    You are not quite correct. The song is about a gay man not being accepted by his church. He says he who is without sin, cast the first stone. He is being ostracized by other sinners. (We are all sinners). Its actually a ‘dig’ at the Cathoilc Church.

  • Gandolfication

    Seriously this song gets better every time I hear it. I’m not gay (don’t think so anyway), and it doesn’t matter, it is powerful and beautiful song that forces you to think and feel. Truly and accomplishment that stands out especially in this era of garbage pop music.

  • Echoesv

    Its funny, most religious groups try to convert others for no greater reason except to believe in what others tell them is true. As humans we have free will, the drive to do what we ourselves want, not to follow blindly like cattle. When I was a christian( and this is an example because I used to have the faith a lot of you do now) I had always ben told to spread the word of Jesus christ and God, and essentially convert them to Christianity. Although how is that any way shape or form what God wants when he gave us free will to believe what we want. Also having animosity towards another “religion” (such as atheism) going by things you may have heard by a few people’s mouths; it holds no relevance. Not to mention the ability for ones faith to stretch to such extents, you should know that making false arguments and false accusations is just a way for you to feel smart about something you have no comprehension of. Lastly to those that believe in the church as an acceptable institute of religious teachings/prayer/worship. God tells us that we should not look to material possessions and bask in his glory…then why do all the churches act as if he demands a tithe, an offering of the worst material possession of all ‘money’. It’s because when we get down to it, no matter how much faith we have, no matter how hard we believe and want to trust in a God. Religion is just a way for people to run away from their problems by relying on a higher power to take care of all their problems. We can only believe in ourselves, otherwise we’re not human. ” I do not hate religion or religious thinking, but Im also not one to admire it or accept it in any way shape or form” (please don’t take this as an attack against you or your belief, because I’m not directing it, I’m only sharing.

    • Dessy Natalia

      agreed…

  • Dessy Natalia

    well, this is such a great anylize, but however it depends on the person, for me, i like this song because of his voice, even though when the first time i heard this song, i knew that there is something with this song. but yeahh.. im just a listener and i still have my faith….
    wohoooooo….!!!

  • David Toms

    Wow! You are so, so wrong.

    • Guest

      who? me wrong?

  • Lucy07

    The “she” the song is referring to is religion. The chorus is a sarcastic way of saying that religion has failed him. In the sense of those who incorrectly follow the teachings of Jesus. Those who say they follow the word of God and then go out and murder ppl because they are different. It is a beautiful song.

  • Sarah Price

    I think many religious people will too this song away as completely corrupt, but there is a part of the song’s message that all Christians need to hear and address. In the day and age where the youth are being lured away from faith, Christians encourage the mass retreat. “I’ll tell you my sins, and you can sharpen your knife.” This rings true for so many disillusioned souls. Churches today reject or ostracize those who need love and acceptance the most. The attitude of most religious folks is reminiscent of the established saduciees and pharisees towards Jesus. Thier loud proclimations of thier righteousness. Jesus showed us a different way, yet we fell back into the shunning of tax collectors and blemished women… just in our day and age it’s anyone with a sexual past, a gay man or a drug addict. It’s has never been our role to stand as judges. Like the song, most Christians sharpen thier knives against a sinner, and never open their arms. That is the tragedy. You all blasted the video because it portrayed a gay relationship, buy you did not blast the beating of a human? Shame.

  • not the point

    I think its a beautiful song. The way I see it, its not attacking god with blasphemy, but he’s making a point about organized religion. He’s subtly pointing out the faults of organized religion because of humanity; the faults that make their church an object to worship and not their God.
    If you look at that video and immediately detest the “perversion”, you’re just proving his point. So you can argue about religion all you want, but the song is about humanity, not god.

  • midnightlace

    It is a Sinead O’Connor Cover. She is the original artist.

  • Val

    God made man and woman with a strong sexual orientation. The act of love-making is a gift to treasure, not be cynical about, or ashamed or sinful. If orientation varies from the ‘traditional’ understanding, you would never be judged by God. Man judges man, but there is only one true judge. Your happiness is the ultimate goal ! It is not found from within, but rather by sharing and caring for each other.

  • egscruggs7929

    Glad to know someone else hears this song as I do. We should all pay attention to what we’re listening to/singing along with.

  • Leviticus

    “The people of Ireland must bear his guilt, because Hozier has rebelled against their God. They will fall by the sword; their little ones will be dashed to the ground, their women with child ripped open.” (Hosea 13:16)

    • zurvan

      Another good reason not to take everything in the Bible literally.

  • Lidia

    My interpretation is that he’s gay and the church condemns it and hence the sexuality of the song and so on. Bhup…that’s what I think. I could be wrong.

  • Rainbow Corgi

    You must not have seen the video. So someone doesn’t believe the way you do. It’s not the end of the world. It’s going to be okay chief.

  • Marcus

    Wow. You certainly completely missed the entire point of that song. Deluded, and re the video, hateful.

  • mumofsum

    Its amazing how quickly this commentary stopped being about the song.
    Perhaps we should stop and take a look at what’s going on the world at the moment “in the name of religion”. Wars are cause by one “man’s” interpretation of their specific religious text, Aetheists, Islam & Pagans as with Christianity and the Bible, there are no less fanatics in all of them. As a Christian, I believe He gave us choice, hence why there are people who believe those that don’t and those not sure, that’s their choice, but as for the haters, well that’s where ‘the other one’ comes in (no he doesn’t deserve a name check from me) & that IS where the bad things come from, to make dis-believers hate, not-surers dis-believe, and believers not-sure or hate.
    Whether you believe, are not sure, or don’t believe, that’s fine, just don’t hate or persecute others who hold different views (that includes those middle east fanatics). Love each other or at least don’t ‘gob off’ at people with differing opinions.
    JUST DON’T HATE, LIVE AND LET LIVE. Love to you all

  • Cathy

    If you don’t like the song, then just don’t listen to it. If you don’t like the music video, then don’t watch it. That’s what I did. I’m a 16 year old Christian, and I have been reading the comments for about 30 minutes now. Kinda wasted my time doing so… heh.
    Anyways, just wanted to say that people who don’t believe in God or trying to convince/argue with believers on this site should just leave. I understand you have your own opinions and beliefs but then you’re just making it worse here. To Christians replying to them, just stop. They most likely would never be convinced & pinpoint the words you would say so there’s no point in arguing with them. To both, just stop as well. Arguing or debating will do nothing to be honest.
    I am not trying to start another argument. It’s just kind of annoying for people to argue and argue over and over again. Just ignore it, leave it be or whatever. Just love each other, please.
    That is all. God bless everyone!

  • Guest

    Look at it this way, if you believe in God and there is after you’ve gone, then you will be proved right and He will look after you, but if there isn’t then you haven’t lost anything. But its only proven AFTER death, so what difference will you make then? None. Believe and you can only benefit either way.

  • fed Up..

    Yes i do agree.. the tune is catchy.. although it MAKES ME SICK inside to hear the words and than he sings this song at the Grammys…Of course dressed in black satan attire… Has the world gone mad or are people under Satans rule? Are we blind to the lyrics that purely run down the Catholic Faith… the sad truth is that his Catholic Faith is probably what saved him in his life more than once…
    God still loves him i am sure of that…… he just needs to recognize this love…and Love God Back..
    Now write a song on Gods Love and you win a Grammy !!!!!!!!!

    • paolo2

      Holy Cow. You are batshit crazy.

  • tillie2

    I liked it when I first heard it – and then the more I heard it, the more uncomfortable I became until I finally told my (teen) son that we have to turn it off when it comes on. I couldn’t catch all of the words earlier in the song but it made my heart uncomfortable and that was enough for me. I’ve taught my kids that every song has a story, a meaning, it’s trying to convey – because I never realized that when I was younger, and now the songs that I loved (and truly didn’t listen to the lyrics of) are songs that I am sickened by – I want them to see that early on. This is one that is banned in our house now.

    • DG

      I agree… I was so hoping this song we heard on the radio was somehow pointing to faith in God, but as I actually googled the lyrics, my heart dropped. There’s no denying this guy hates the Church and there’s so much he profaned in his writing. It’s a shame. I really liked the tune, too! There is something about it that draws you in…at first glance, APPEARS to be a good, but alas is not.

  • Matty

    Thank you for shining light on this darkness and revealing what it really is. The world is becoming more perverted every minute of every day and this song just one example. I would also suggest that the lyrics “I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies” are a reference to a sexual act. Disgusting.

    • Mark Burns

      That’s strange. What does that lyric have to do with sexual positions?

  • aimee

    This is exactly what I thought it was about. Catchy but if you listen closely you can tell what he’s really talking about. Definitely blasphemy. Makes me sick.

    • DiosEstaEnojadoContigo

      Lol…. SOOO simple minded. Good thing you have guys Mr. Marshall to tell you how to think. It’s going to be quite an awakening when you hit the Pearly Gates and God is pretty pissed that you’ve all twisted and turned his true love to fit your pathetic vies of what loves is and who has the right to love whom.

  • May

    She’s the giggle at a funeral?…

  • NoWorries

    I thought this was a conversation about the meaning of a song? Take it from the horses mouth… Hozier explains the meaning behind his song… and for the video, artists use them as a platform to send a message not always as the exact meaning of a song… As for Jesus you are all missing the point! He is all about love love love and nothing more or less… In the new testament he does not mention that being gay is a sin… why would he condemn someone for who they love… it doesn’t make sense! So I will continue to ask for forgiveness if I commit one of the ten commandments and sleep well knowing that if I die Jesus is my lord and savior and he knows my heart is true…

  • Curious Observer

    I love this song because it questions organized religion and the beliefs that it instills that seem contrary to basic human nature (like demonizing certain types of physical intimacy as “sin”). It would only be offensive to those who don’t appreciate a person’s need to question what has been taught. Even if you don’t share his point of view, you can appreciate the discourse. This song is beauty.

  • BlandlyAverage

    It’s about how he will love a man despite being judged by his family and church, the part over he worship like a dog is how he will go to church with them despite their disapproval, the goddess is not just a girlfriend but a goddess of love and really I’m a 18 teen/adult and I can tell when I hear that song it’s about he will love and love life the way he wants but still try to be a part of family’s life. Some of the other people in comments really need to calm down since I think you are hating on atheists and masts how the video or song you hate but if you do then don’t listen to it please.

  • BlandlyAverage

    The song is about how he will love despite being hated by the church and his family, the goddess is one of love plain and simple , and did you finish the video they killed/potentially burned him on the sole fact that he is gay, please if you all believe god as I do then please let him judge what is right or wrong when we die, after all god and Jesus knows best. I don’t think this is Offtopic or rude since it’s only offering a different opinion.

  • Amber

    Oh how wrong you are. Lol little do you know that the song is about being gay. Watch the video, you uptight close-minded Christian moron

  • BlandlyAverage

    They kill him over being gay did you see that? He wants to love the way he wants and try’s to till they come to his home and beat his father and drag him away to kill him. I did say he was gay and also he wants to love that way meaning a gay relationship or are you saying that all gays should be killed Amber.

  • BlandlyAverage

    Your all so mean in the video they kill him can’t you see how they hurt want to love on another? And can I ask why my comments were removed, I don’t think they said anything that bad.

  • Flabbergasted

    This is an amazing thread that ties directly into the lyrics of the song. To see how this went from an analogy of one song and its subsequent verse to aggression… And quickly! Remember…respecting other’s choices does not mean you have to necessarily agree with them. We all answer to a Higher Power… It is just in the interpretation of who and or what that power is.
    BTW… Pretty sure the “Girlfriend” in the lyrics is a “Boyfriend” and, as sacrilegious
    as it may seem to some, this is a part of humanity and has been going on since before Christ was born.

    Peace.

    • Preacher’s Daughter

      Thank You, Dr. Marshall. I agree with your opinion. God bless you, “Spontaneous Chick”, I am proud of you. You seem like a very well-rounded girl and it sounds like your father is doing an excellent job in raising you.

  • awms

    I could not watch the entire video, it was just too sad. I still really like the song and its symbolism of devoted love, that it what the song means to me.

  • SeekerOfTruth

    I have to admit, this song captivated me from the moment I heard it. They melody is so soulful and the words are biting. I wonder if it is not a cry from the heart searching for something sacred, and yet not reaching deep enough. The song is tragic and beautiful to me–I am disturbed by its tragic beauty.

  • Tom James

    The song is quite disgusting. Hozier needs to educate himself regarding the faith he so openly mocks. He really comes across as yet another ignorant moral relativist. Yawn.

  • Colin

    Um, how do you know what kind of Satanism is in fashion, sir?

  • Antonio Escarraman

    Who said Athiests hate God? We just don’t believe in God. People need to stop and realize that no matter how much faith you have, it shouldn’t undermine any other belief or religion. People believe in different things. Some people are gay, and some people aren’t. I hate how you guys hide behind a book and readings instead of realizing you guys are spreading hate. I appreciate your faith, and what you believe, but doesn’t give you the right to say someone is perverse or disgusting on who they kiss! But hey, ignorance is a virtue I guess. I happen to love the song, and how spiritual it is, and yes, I understand the lyrics from the man who wrote it himself.

  • Scoob91

    This song needs to be interpreted by thinking outside of the box. He’s not literally talking about a real church our bodies are our temples and in this day and age we are so extremely disconnected with not just everything around us but our very own emotions the majority of the time which is extremely sad! Everyone has fallen inlove and knows the feeling of placing them above everyond and everything in their life regardless if the significant other is playing you like a fool you’re still in love and have your blinders on. It talks about letting go and becoming connected with ones self again so we won’t fall prey to others schemes. After all we are all made from the divine creator so in return that makes us a part of the creator. Jesus I believe was trying to get that message across but as I can still see there are many individuals that are having a hard time looking past the service to find a deeper meaning, such as the author of this article. I truly hope that you’re forgiven for your passed judgements all of you. Truly truly sad that a follower of god can’t remember that they have no right to say or pass criticism on anyone, why? Because you’re not a god! You’re human! When judgement day comes it should really be the Christians who are worrisome for they have started to become the evil they so desperatly try to dispel. I pray for your forgiveness. Brightest blessings.

  • Michael Eberly

    An anthem which marks the death of Christianity in Ireland, and in particular Catholicism. The 2000 year mental tyranny is almost over!!

  • Gerry

    Okay,
    I understand your beliefs and how this effects your religion
    But you analysis of this song is atrocious,
    The song clearly represent two homosexual people that are in love,
    GIVE THEM A BREAK!
    People should be able to love who they want and please,
    otherwise it wouldn’t be love now, would it.
    now it is obvious that you want your religion to have a great influence on the people in the world,
    BUT THIS IS TOO FAR!
    You can’t defy human rights for a religion with all honesty could be true or could not be true.
    Homosexual love is completely the choice of one indervidual and it should not be prohibited by your religion,
    This is the complete meaning and outline of this song, is that people should be not controlled by some kind of authority such as a church.
    Hozier said it himself that he believes that one should be able to love anyone they want,
    and he has the right moral,
    every sane person in this world agrees with him.
    STOP TRYING TO CONTROL PEOPLE WITH YOUR RELIGION
    If you have any questions or complaints please feel free to email me: gerry.mullaly@cathedral.qld.edu.au

  • justagirl

    Okay…I’ve debated in commenting on this as it is clearly a very diverse yet deeply argumentative forum considering these are just song lyrics….but here goes. I’ve read nearly all of your comments and perhaps I shouldn’t involve myself as I kind of disagree with the vast majority of things being said it’s just….a song is a form of expression just like any art form. This man had a story to tell, he told it through a very powerful musical piece based on his own beliefs and it seems that through what he percieves the gay community is being targeted by Christianity. Not it’s not official this is what I see him saying with all this, keeping in mind that a song could just as well be a speech or a canvas….the song just So happened to get a lot of positive feedback. I, myself….I’m not religious but I’m not trying to bash anyone on their beliefs but just soften their outlook and consider te e fact that this is just an impactful take of one person’s perspective. Its not satanic, its all just a bundle of hardcore feelings. Just like all rock music isn’t satanic. Just like gays shouldn’t have to feel like outcasts. Nobody should be shunned based on their beliefs either. But only because I see things a certain way…I just want everyone to know that not all atheists and agnostic people are satanic or hate God just because they’re opposed to those of Christian or catholic descent. They just don’t feel anything about the topic…it’s difficult to explain when you share different views than another. Because one can not fully understand another’s explanation if they share opposing beliefs.

  • Asmaton

    Songs like this lend credence to the traditional view that Lucifer was the musician of Heaven. Music can be such a testament to the glory of God, but like all beauty Satan tries to pervert it.

  • yourstruely

    Sorry to burst your bubbles guys but the entire song is about homosexuality. Listen carefully. He’s saying he’s living a sin-a sickness- but he loves it. He’s saying take me to church, wash me of my sins, sharpen your knives and judge me as you please.

  • Mike Jennings

    The song is about LOVE….not a sexual encounter….he (Hozier) is clearly expressing his faith being shaken and his heart being broken by loss…..dig deeper, people.

  • Curt

    I think you hit the nail right on the head. The “music” is amazing and gospel like and Hozer is a talented musician, but the lyrics while catchy bothered me for some reason. I Goggled your assessment and you confirmed what I thought. he replaces the “girlfriend” with God.

  • Atheist

    I’ve seen some ignorants around here, so let me get this straight: satanists hate God and worship Satan; atheists DO NOT hate God nor believe in him. There’s a difference.

  • Carey

    Ohh, I forgot to add that he questioned, but didn’t give up his faith and belief in God, he lost faith in the church he was attending…

  • LowellB

    Ignorance is not a good platform to preach from. Black Sabbath sang more about the evil that men do, often in the name of religion, than anything else. Same thing with Marilyn Manson.

    This smacks of an “all rock music is evil” homage like something you’d hear in the town the unfortunate character of Kevin Bacon moved to in Footloose. I remember in Sunday School (yes, I went to the brain washing sessions as I was born Catholic and began thinking for myself somewhere along the way) there was a session where they played rock songs backwards for us and told us what they were saying, or, they interpreted the meaning of songs and how the devil was trying to communicate to us. I was a child, maybe 10yrs old? Horrible. I was terrified of the radio for a month. My parents went ballistic, as they should have. This is a perfect representation of the church. Anything that makes you think outside the box, vilify it.

    For goodness sake people It is art, it is meant to provoke and make you question things. That is why religion and those caught in it’s talons fear it. I am not anti religion any more than I am anti homosexuality. I am straight, married, and chose that lifestyle. The difference? Homosexuals do not routinely judge me or my actions or try and force me to follow their doctrine. Dont you see how awful that immutable facet of Christianity is?

    I find western religions in particular rife with hypocrisy and ignorance and this post feels like someone scared into thinking that any words outside of the brain washing are to be feared. It is art, it is an expression of sorrow, and it is the questioning of the religious doctrine that you should too. Just once I’d like to hear a religion challenge people to question it. If they had the confidence in the doctrine that they claim, it would be no big deal.

    I am impressed that you have gone so far as to analyze this song, but listen more to the other bands I mentioned. They are smart, philosophical, and thought provoking in general. Thinking for yourself is NOT a sin. It is NOT scary. It is freedom from the tyranny of men trying to control other men.

  • Isabella

    Smart article. Very true. It is such a catchy song, and beautifully orchestrated. I caught myself turning up the volume every time it came on and singing along to the chorus. Then I began to actually listen to the lyrics and realized it was sacrilegious… Definitely blasphemous. Looked into the meaning of it and came across your article. Have to say this was a well written and accurate interpretation. Needless to say I won’t be turning up the volume and singing along to it anymore in the car, quite oppositely I’ll be changing the station each time it comes on.

  • thatoneguy

    Exactly!!! I have been trying to explain this to my ignorant friends FOREVER!!! They don’t believe me about it’s true meaning, and totally misinterpret this offensive song. Apparently, “That’s not what it’s about,” and I failed to “understand what it means,” or at least that’s what my peers say. Nonetheless, I say, “THANK YOU for not jumping onto the bandwagon of nescience! Kudos to you for helping others get the memo!”

  • Bye

    It’s a good song and it shows REAL PROBLEMS people are faced with because some people dont know how to accept other sexualities or even better, don’t know how to mind their own business because essentially, it is no ones business what they like so stop analyzing this great song and making it all about your religion.

  • Robert Lee LaPointe

    Hello Dr. Marshall. I think you have nailed this with you’re analysis on every relevant point. This was helpful. I’ve been debating with a FB friend who denounced the Grammy telecast as satanic. I have a more nuanced view that is very close to yours. I’m 60 and don’t follow popular music like I once did until not long ago. I watch the Grammy’s as an annual primer to stay current and also I do enjoy the unique collaborative performances. My outlook on this years briadcast was that it was heavily scripted and not very subtle slap at Christians and Christian values. Irrevrent and in various places sacrilegious but to say satanic an exaggeration. As you pointed out the industry is more sophisticated in it’s secular humanistic messaging. Still I would say that gloves are now clearly off with respect to the antagonism towards and denunciation of the Christian domain. In keeping, the pro LGBT messaging was more explicit than ever. Last thouht. I got a chuckle when you said that part of you likes TMTC. The song is catchy and clever and provacative in way that has some constructive merit. I’m Robert Lee LaPointe on FB.

  • Frank

    Wow….lmao, the things you people come up with, no wonder you’re a dying breed.

  • armygal

    I agree with your synopsis of the meaning, and for that reason I choose not to listen to it. Personally, I found it offensive and was just as surprised as you were that this song has gotten so popular – until I thought about it, and then I wasn’t surprised anymore. 🙁

  • carla

    Its a great song!! Its playing off of the bull views of religious fanatics.. brainwashed by the book version of how they want people to think god is..they are wrong!! God is love..we all have that love inside of us.. our souls are here to do earthly things in human form…as long as we come from a place of love we are living as god!!! Love that song it gets me hype a little. .lol

  • Brandon Cummings

    The girlfriend is actually a guy. It’s about homosexuality.

  • LP

    Also, I’ve heard the culmination of intercourse referred to by the French as “la petit mort”—the little death. So that’s what I was assuming he meant when he said “deathless death.”

  • Really?

    I don’t know where the author got all those ideas, but it is frankly out of point.
    We are our own Church at first. Jesus imself told us that we need to love ourself before being able to love others and give love to people all around.
    We need to be able to speak of our religion with some criticism. That makes it, and us, more humane. Else, we are just robots that needs to follow a book.

  • justacouplatwocents

    So the artist himself states that it is not an attack on faith, yet you take the lyrics and label them a hidden attempt at satanism anyway. Interesting.

    I happen to agree with Hozier. The church is entirely hypocritical when it comes to homosexuality, and I find this song incredibly hard-hitting and well-written.

  • God

    It’s a good song and meanings are well noted. Religion is a fairy tale and followers are lost losers.

  • Lucifer

    Hump that bible!

  • Makena Ambrosi

    Christians (I am one) tend to sin at the worst and do it blindly. They are the first to point fingers, the first to judge. As Christians, is our sin less sinful than a homosexual? We are saved not because we are heterosexual but, because we chose Christ. We still sin. We still raise our heads and judge. We accuse those who love and give love but, have less focus on giving love ourselves. Instead of pointing fingers and damning people, we could focus on being more like Jesus. Go out in this world and take care of abused kids. Go care for the needy and not just on holidays. Spend more time doing good than looking for bad. I pray for all of you. You are misguided and need a good chat with Jesus.

  • cebyler

    You sir have missed the mark, big time. He is not attacking God but he is calling out the church as an institution. The simple fact is that we, the church, have perverted Christ’s mission and misaligned our goals. Now when we get call out on this we label the messenger as a blasphemer and crucify them? Isn’t that what the Pharisees did to Christ?

  • “We’ve a lot of starving faithful” is a comment on sexual repression.

  • “That’s a fine looking high horse” is an oppressed person threatening to kill and eat the horse from upon which his oppressor casts judgement

  • Rational Human

    Are you out of your mind?

  • Dude.. You’re wrong. Making congestion about something you don’t even understand the real reasons. You haven’t heard from the writers point of view the lyrics so you can’t put out your own analysis about something you merely understand. The song do is about sexuality, and do is about couple. At least understand first what you want to talk about.

    PS: The lyrics analysis is wrong…

  • Mike Clout

    God I love the genius behind the lyrics.

  • Bebeto Walberg

    hi hello

  • Bebeto Walberg

    every time that i coment my coment gets erased

  • Cassidy

    Yeah this article is to say the least.. Wrong. This song is about gay marriage.

    • Mark Burns

      Well, the music video in particular is about the persecution of LGBT people in Russia (heavily in the news at the time of the winter olympics). But the song itself is about more than that. Check out the Gigwise interview by Hozier on YouTube. It’s very interesting.

  • brenna

    You are turning a beautiful and raw song into something sinful and morally wrong. The songs about how horrible the church is and everything wrong with it, and you are turning it into sin to defend your beliefs. You are utterly mistaken my friend

  • Christian Carroca

    What if the song is a satire of how so many people are…

  • Elizabeth Scott

    This song is the new normal and it’s paving the way for our society to allow immorality to a point of numbness. When did right and wrong ever become “As long as it doesn’t offend anybody” become okay to define our society? We have resorted to letting right and wrong become “grey”. It is so sad to watch as our nation continues to collapse and conform to please everyone and not step on anyone else’s toes. I believe in equality, but all of this didn’t happen overnight. It’s really just a sign Christians will have to be more courageous than ever. The Bible says it would be like this, so it really isn’t a surprise. Eventually, devout Christians will be persecuted because we will offend people with the way we live and how we refuse to submit to the grey area.

  • Mark Burns

    Hozier has actually given an interview in which he explains what the song is about. In spite of the heavy religious overtones, he speaks as though the lyrics are deeper and more symbolic I would say that he seems to focus on opposing institutions that attempt to impose restrictions against what Hozier considers natural aspects of the human condition. So it’s really no surprise that he used the treatment of LGBT people in Russia as an example and major theme in his music video.

    If you are interested in the actual meaning of the lyrics in this song, his interview is well worth watching. It is on YouTube with the suffix watch?v=zKzwZnyvLcE following the forward slash. The title of the video is “Hozier on the story behind ‘Take Me To Church’ – Gigwise Interview”. If you can’t use the suffix, just copy, paste and search for the title. The author of this blog doesn’t seem to allow links directly in the body of comments, or I’d provide a direct link for you.

  • Joseph Biddle

    I don’t agree and the writer states and makes note that its not what you have described or what he intended in his meaning. There is nothing more hypocritical than Catholicism and the Catholic Church. Just do what ever you want and then go Saturday and confess your sins in a little booth and you are forgiven. What is that ? A true Christian doesn’t live that way. He stays true knowing what is right and wrong, you can’t live any way you want and then be forgiven on Saturday after coming out of the little booth. Catholics have more hate, more mental illness, more crime, more confusion in their lives than any other religion. I like this song, and believe the words have more meaning about the subject in the video than atheist meanings. In fact it has more to do with homosexuals and possibly the missed beliefs of the Catholic Church. Gay people can be and are Christians too. Read the Bible, in a Methodist Church not in the Catholic Church. Besides there to busy in the Catholic Church drinking wine, because its ok to and passing the basket or playing bingo to get more money. Money is really all they worry about. And yes I am predjudice….. The Catholic Church is screwed up…… fact…

  • VLG

    I’m beginning to like the song but I try to check out the song meaning/lyrics behind it before I share.
    Sad.. but thanks for taking time to explain the meaning. By the way, it’s not that popular here in the Philippines.

  • Ann Power Smith

    The lyrical analysis is good, with the exception of the stable line, which is referencing finding an animal sacrifice/gift, not birth of Jesus. However, it is absurd to the point of hilarious to suggest this song is part of any satanic motivation or some conspiracy by the music industry. It is the poetry of an individual artist, deeply influenced by the trappings of the catholic church (agree with author here). Unlike speculations about the writings of dead poets, we have Hozier’s contemporary comments on the motivation underlying this song, so there is no need to fantasize about it. He has stated that it is about reclaiming one’s own sexuality as natural rather than something to be ashamed of, regardless of one’s orientation. He describes it as a throwing off of the sexual repression and shame associated with his catholic christian upbringing. It is deeply powerful because feeling freed to fully experience sexuality without the chains of guilt and shame that were drilled into you from childhood is a powerfully liberating, poignant, and wonderful experience, like coming into the light of truly living finally.

  • Rebecca

    I just think it’s a clever metaphor. Instead of downright exclaiming his sexual desires (Such as Animal by Maroon 5, bahaha), he did it in a tactful fashion. I think you’re diving a bit deep into this song, considering he’s expressing how religion seems to shame people for having sexual desires, when its completely natural. I’m agnostic, so I dont really have a general faith that I follow, but I dont find this song offensive at all, when it’s merely stating his own ideas and opinions. It’s not “wrong” by any stretch, and to say so, is an opinion, not a fact.

  • thatguy

    I think the writer of this article couldn’t of been more off. Back story. The artist was raised as a pagan. His wife had him convert to Catholicism to be wed. Now thinking of that, maybe reassess. Paganism has no absolutes unlike Christianity. F.Y.I. I am a Christian.

  • Sarah

    Thank you for dissecting this. Ever since I heard this song I was curious about the meanings to the song. How could it be a popular, mainstream pop song about Church? And kids these days like it? That’s why I questioned it but never took the time to listen too closely. I just got the feeling it wasn’t that great and tuned it out. It’s catchy, but I can do without.

  • CB

    What I don’t understand is why I should be tolerant of an athiest’s views, meanwhile they’re incessantly attacking me for believing in Jesus Christ, actually having values and something to live for. How “open-minded” of them.

  • Daniel

    I am amused that you feel you need to provide a Christian perspective. I think the songs basic message is clear and in no way deceptive. It offers a point of view, if it doesn’t fit your philosophy then don’t listen to it.

  • Justthecook

    I found it interesting that you single out the Catholic Church as having the only “sickness” perspective. My understanding is that, “all have sinned”…. And not just by acts, but by our very nature. We are all born, “sick”….

  • Ann Ahrens

    I wonder if the line “that’s a fine looking high horse, What you got in the stable?” is really a jab at Christianity, an accusation against Christians for being up on their “high horse” of morality? Seems that Hozier might actually feel a bit of shame after all, thus the jab against perceived moral superiority.

  • SJ

    This song is actually about the terrible atrocities done in Russia to the homosexual community. They are luring the LGBTQ community by means of the church then they beat them bloody and mercilessly. If you’re a gay female they rape you to try and change who you are. Then they record it all and post it to social media for laughs. It is absolutely disgusting and appalling to judge a perfectly thriving and loving HUMAN being because you would rather choose who they love and punish them because you can’t get your mind out of the sacred bedroom that is none of anyone’s business. I hope refugee status becomes available for endangering the harmless soul of survival. This is a war against humanity all in the name of the church against LOVE and it needs to stop immediately. If Jesus was the son of this god you speak of he most certainly would not be happy with this situation.

  • Christine

    If you read what the artist has stated about the song, it is actually about the church and their intolerance of homosexuality.

  • Dutchroll

    You do realise the song is a damning commentary on the Catholic Church’s attitude towards homosexuality and sexuality in general, don’t you? This has been made clear in interviews by the singer himself.

  • HASAN

    I like the simulations in the song.

  • Elias Legere

    I don’t agree with this. The song is more about the reason people go to Christianity. “Offer me that deathless death” is the promise that he will go to heaven. “Dear god, take me to church” is the reaction of being promised eternal life, which is appealing to people

  • mary

    You heard it exactly right. When I was listening to this the very first time I thought the same thing and couldn’t believe what I was hearing. Morality is collapsing. One day God will bring us to our knees and those who think these things are cool will be the same uneducated to question why?

  • Tamesia

    I was very shocked when i heard this, at my job they have the radio playing and i dont really pay attention to the lyrics but i heard that song and now knowing what the lyrics is saying makes me realize how crazy sneaky lyricist can be. I really need to guard my spirit man. Wow!

  • Alayna Jones

    Yes I totally agree with you..at first i thought he was worshipping the god Horus in the song or something like that. But yes the devil wants us to LOVE sin..like he mentioned in the song “We were born sick but I love it” I pray that whoever wants to be set free from sin and it is breaking you and it is leading you no where…The one Jesus Christ Our God will save you and will set u free.

  • It’s typical in many art forms to take on thing that people are familiar with and compare it to another less familiar or less discussed thing. I don’t have a problem with it.

  • Cristi

    I agree with you i think the devil has a plan and he’s suceeding. Its a catchy tune and those that dont listen just hear “take me to church”, “God I give you my life”, but the lyrics are right in your face that’s why the people perish because they don’t have the knowledge of the Bible we have to get the knowledge so we could differentiate good from bad. God bless!

  • Lori

    Okay, people. Does anyone realize that this is an Irishman’s commentary on his (and others’) life? Perhaps the ‘She’ mentioned in the first stanza refers to a universal “God.”

    Please move on…

    Do you not see references to the establishment (the oil derricks, the airplane, etc.) and the fact that his lover is always RUNNING?

    He admits to “Being born sick” and also that there is “a fresh poison each week” ( A reference to the Roman Catholic Church). Isn’t he saying what we already know??

    What about the fact that the men hunting the character down look hauntingly like KKK?

    Get PAST the fact that two guys are kissing and get to the REAL meaning of the video!!

  • Shantelle G

    Every Sunday is getting more bleak
    Fresh poison each week
    I believe here he is referring to Sunday Mass each week. He possibly sees the bible teachings as lies…fresh poison each week

  • Waxil Davidson

    There’s no god, so it’s not regrettable at all. Your “absolutism” has merely been conditioned into your mind as neural rot. Grow up, the truth is we are all just animals trying to live due to the biological imperative, everything else is ancient, army-building, noise. You are limiting yourself, please, much like Moses, please smoke some DMT and get over your juvenile mysticisms, then re-review the song. You are indeed bright, but in the main key area you have failed to move on from something ingrained in you from youth out of fear from something that simply isn’t there. You need a psychedelic intervention sir, then you will see the true truth.

  • joshua

    I think the chorus is actually him mocking the real God and Church – insinuating their bloody judgmental nature and the futility of slavic submission.

  • Heather

    Your theological analysis is garbage. That is all.

  • Riki

    wow! i am glad i came across your article. when i first heard the song, i couldn’t get it out of my head, especially the chorus and i felt so guilty about it coz it did leave an uncomfortable feeling inside. and its nice to see how u address the issue and mention how catchy the tune is. I understood some references (having been brought up catholic)but i couldn’t quite put my finger on what exactly he was trying to say. this does help me better understand and be aware.

  • Tryclyde

    And rightfully so. Religion (such as Catholicism or any branch of Protestant) has it’s positives, but the overall negatives for the individual and ultimately, the world, are detrimental to progressive evolving morality and peace. Belief in a higher power will always be questionable (as far as we know), but it’s about time for religion to stop holding us back.

  • Nunya

    JESUS! (Pun INTENDED!) You All Need To Get A Life!

  • Hello

    It’s amazing how many Atheists are here. Not saying that to be critical either. This post was intended for Christians, yet a good 50 percent, more or less, of commenters are Atheist.

    • zurvan

      It’s easy to get jazzed up enough about something when you really disagree with it. What gets to me is that Marshall misses a golden opportunity to offer a real, meaningful rebuttal to the actual criticisms of religion in the song in order to misread it (I have to think somewhat intentionally) and then respond to that misreading. It’s a classic straw man, and I want better for my religious brothers and sisters than that.

  • AtheismTV

    The song is MORE blasphemous than you think. The analysis of this text is only superficial. If this man was really rejoicing in his sin, the song would be upbeat and happy. It’s sad and depressing. Why?

    There are a couple allusions to Atheism which you missed completely. For example, the words “I was born sick… command me to be well” is an allusion to a quote from Christopher Hitchens, who himself was paraphrasing Fulke Greville. Also there’s the word “I’m a pagan”.

    The girl in the song is the christian church which he used to love in the past but now he’s sarcastically criticizing.

    • stan

      Um, no. The artist told exactly what the song meant. You can interpret all you want but that’s not what the writer ever meant.

  • Stupid Conservatives

    This article is definitely bias and skipped over a lot of the lyrics. Oh wait just like the Christian church to choose a particular angle for their benefit and ignore the rest.

  • KitKat

    This interpretation is rather shallow and misses the deeper meanings and themes, particularly when interpreted in tandem with the music video.

    “I’ll tell you my sins so you can sharpen your knife

    Offer me my deathless death

    Good God, let me give you my life”

    This is a reference to people who kill in the name of God because they decide that someone is sinful. This happens with Christians harassing and murdering people who are gay because these Christians believe God considers being gay a sin. It is cultural as well and pervasive. Some Christians are rather blunt as well: that a gay person deserves to die because they are gay, giving no acknowledgement to the awful pain and torture and routine hostilities gay people face around the world.

    Jesus was pretty clear: love your neighbor as yourself. Loving others is so important that Christ named it as the second most important commandment.

  • Belle

    It’s actually down right horrendous reading some of these comments.I’m literally just going to tell you about this song and what I think it meant. I’m not saying you are wrong but this is just a view and my perspective. I always connected with this song because I always thought it was talking about someones struggle to believe in God, that there was regret or something such as homosexuality getting in the way of believing God. I don’t believe Homosexuality is a sin, I’m not Homosexual either. My view is that if God can’t accept someone who is homosexual, someone who is just like me, but just shares there love in a different way, he won’t be able to accept me either. I always connecting the song with someone crying out for God to love them. At the beginning it speaks about the girlfriend who is not very holy and I always thought the girlfriend always wished to be loved by God, but couldn’t because of “everybody’s disaproval” of her so the only way she can be loved properly is “worshiped in the bedroom” I still think this song is beautiful and Hozier is a talented artist and I’m pleased this song is as popular as it is. I think some people are a little too closed minded when listening to this song. The beauty in music is that it is based on peoples perspective. A song can be written with one meaning but can mean something else to another person. Just because someone has a different view on the song, doesn’t mean they are wrong.

    • stan

      Whats “horrendous”, people speaking their mind? And where is homosexuality called a sin? Because the Bible says it somewhere? How is it a sin if my religion doesn’t say it is but yours does?

  • Finicky

    I remember when you said (Hey at least he knows it’s sin – he’s Irish!) ._. Like really dude wtf is that? I thought you would at least leave the whole “Irish drunkards” stereotype out of this! Serious dude, I’m not even Irish and I’m offended by this racism…

  • Ponythewarriorcatfan

    Look at the music video, to me it looks like these dudes dressed in black coats are burning down the house of a gay couple O_O
    I’m straight but I support Gays, Bisexuals and Lesbians.
    **Haters Gon’ Hate**

  • david

    Love it

  • david

    Love it

  • Bernadette

    I thought it was beautiful ^-^ honestly I take it in when it comes on, if their is a god I dont hate her but whenever I tell my mom what its about she turns it right off X”D I think its the best… also what about marilyn manson? ….o3o ^-^ I enjoy some of the old conversations recorded back in the day that some people have of him on certain shows, hes really an intelligent man as well as a spiritual artist.

  • Jonathan R

    Hello, I was baptized catholic and raised going to ccd. When I entered high school, one which has numerous blue ribbon awards in lake county illinois, I learned about world events and history. Believing in something from the bronze age no longer seemed suitable to me. Now I am agnostic. I am well traveled just like you, canada, mexico, england, france, italy, belgium, germany, south africa, taiwan, japan, hong kong and mainland china. Creationism makes little sense to me as I believe in Evolution. I think it is a luxury to think the way that I do. I look at world maps and see the lines that separate religion and language are the same lines that deadly conflicts are happening on now. Science and religion do not go together they are separated by too much time. Now what is wrong with acceptance, morality with reguards to religion has lost its way. There are now radical elements of all religions around the world. This song was simply about acceptance. We need to become more inteligent as a species. We are custodians of the environment and animal kingdom. The sooner we can learn to accept this, the sooner humanity will begin to improve.

    Peace

  • georgiboy

    To those who do not believe, no evidence will ever suffice. To those that do believe, no evidence will ever be necessary. Atheism is indeed a religion in and of itself. They have faith that there is nothing more than the world they live in. That the the perfect balance of nature created itself. That the laws that govern the universe itself created themselves. It’s inexplicable in my opinion to put your faith in science. Science generally and historically acknowledges that it has no idea what it is talking about and throughout history, it turns its own theories upside down and discredits them on its own. While we continue to strive to understand how God’s universe works, we gain small victories from time to time which usually present themselves in the form of technology. In the end, religion is not defined by those who have historically perverted it (crusades, inquisition, modern day terrorism) but by those who live it correctly in their daily lives. Those of faith have a much broader positive impact in this world than atheists would ever admit.

    • Jonathan R

      Science has the luxury of changing though. It adapts. Like the world we live in. I think god only exists because people put their faith in it. In a nutshell god could be a metaphor for our universe…but nothing more than that. People of faith do a lot of good things for people, they just happen to kill a lot of people too. The path to enlightenment begins with you opening up to the world around you and observing. Science will be wrong in things it states in the future, but we are only human and it will find the truth eventually. This petty fighting has to stop tho. Muslims killing innocents, christians eating muslims (in africa), jews bombing innocents…we all need an education that does not come from a religious school, rather a mathematical and science based cirriculum.

    • zurvan

      Science may not be perfect, but the thing it gets really right is that it has a way of accounting for when it gets things wrong, and tries to correct for it. Religion should envy this quality.

    • stan

      Atheism is not a religion.

  • jagdmmad

    The first time I heard this song I was completely offended.this song judging Christians for judging others. Newsflash! Not all Christians judge other people for what they do or what they believe that is between them and God.

  • Its an interesting analysis… and yet it doesn’t take A LOT into account and contradicts itself, through and through.
    “He should know it’s a sin, he is Irish? I kind sorted at that line.
    .

  • I checked out the video, as another commentator suggested, and the imagery is POWERFUL.

    • zurvan

      It is, but I think it does a small injustice to the song itself. The song is nuanced where the video is a bit heavy-handed, in my view. Still very well done.

      • It does do it an injustice. It brings to mind that Pharisee and the tax collector… about that which is fine in the light. As for the video, setting aside public agenda, I dug it. It had a variety of messages for a variety of communities. Defying physical death… Defying spiritual maiming.. Love…no matter what image applied, is steadfast. They choose a visual that struck home… if it had been a video with a black family, living their lives, but in the wing community, and we’re punished by this community members..the visual would be different but the underlying message the same. It’s NEVER been about the messenger and always about the message. How many prophets were sent? Full of untruths, and insecurities, and issues? My personal opinion is if one sees God in all things, as we are supposed to, we should sine the light on those things. Throwing salt is wasteful, personally, when we’re supposed to be the salt of the earthy(adding flavor). Throwing shade is the opposite of being light.

  • JustAnotherHuman

    I’ve read the comments and there’s just one thing to say: nobody really knows the truth. Even if you are an atheist and you support racionalism, there’s no proof that God doesn’t exist either. Of course faith is absolutely questionable, but doesn’t matter how many arguments you think you own, you can’t prove it wrong. People just believe in what they choose to believe in and no one can fully prove each other wrong. So please, couldn’t we just let each other live? The only thing that I am certain about is love, so let it be.

    • Ed Me Gel

      Dear Moderator, I am trying to understand the
      reason my previous comment was removed here. I analyzed it looking for what may
      have been the reasons and changed it accordingly before posting it again after
      this comment. If it is still not acceptable would you please email me and let
      me know the reasons you will not allow my comment and I will try to adapt and
      redo it in order to make my point clear without potentially offending you or
      anyone. Once it is finally acceptable would you mind removing this comment? I
      do understand, greatly respect and very much appreciate the role you play
      here.

    • Ed Me Gel

      Dear Moderator, both of my other replies here to JustAnotherHuman are a mistake. Intended them to appear as a reply to Ulrich Botha, who commented above if these comments were sorted to show Newest First. Would you mind very much removing my comments here? I already posted them again where they belong. Thank you, as I greatly respect and very much appreciate the role you play here.

    • zurvan

      Most atheists are agnostic atheists, which is to say, it can’t be said precisely that God doesn’t exist, it can only be said that there is no reason to believe that God exists any more than there is evidence that leprechauns exist, and is therefore not a belief worth considering.

  • Ulrich Botha

    Gay rights is at the forefront of human rights. The fight will not end. Good will always triumph over evil. Don’t call yourself a Christian when you don’t practice what your own Saviour commanded you to do. Love thy Neighbour. Stop judging. Only God can judge and I’m afraid you all are missing the point.

    • Ed Me Gel

      Dear Moderator, I am trying to understand the reason my previous comment was removed here. I analyzed it looking for what may have been the reasons and changed it accordingly before posting it again after this comment. If it is still not acceptable would you please email me and let me know the reasons you will not allow my comment and I will try to adapt and redo it in order to make my point clear without potentially offending you or anyone. Once it is finally acceptable would you mind removing this comment? I do understand, greatly respect and very much appreciate the role you play here.

    • Ed Me Gel

      I
      believe it’s true that the great teacher of those that call themselves
      Christians required love and did ask those who would follow him to first look
      at the things that they need to change about themselves before looking at the
      things about others that may also need to change. That’s pretty much the gist
      of “judge not”. It’s about not being a hypocrite; but it’s not about
      closing your eyes and pretending that you don’t know what “wrong” is. That same
      great teacher taught that adultery was wrong and taught that frivolous divorce
      was wrong and a list of other things, including turning your back on your
      neighbors, on those in need when you actually have the means to help them. And that
      great teacher defined who a neighbor was. If anyone actually adheres to what he
      taught then I agree, we are all each other’s neighbors. But what if a person
      sees the practice of adultery or divorce as not being good for them, not being
      good for their children, not being good for their community? Will their beliefs
      about divorce and adultery be interpreted as that person not having any love
      for their neighbor, a neighbor who may have committed adultery or divorced for
      frivolous reasons? And what if a person sees the practice of s-x with members
      of the same s-x in the same light as they see the practice of adultery and
      frivolous divorce; will you then claim that that person actually hates all
      those who practice s-x with others of the same s-x? If so, my next question is, How
      have you reached that conclusion? Does one have to believe what you believe;
      does one have to share the same moral beliefs as you in order to care about
      their neighbor or their brother or their sister? Are you saying that anyone
      who claims to care about you and doesn’t share your moral beliefs is really just
      lying?

  • Ed Me Gel

    In looking through these comments, the comments
    regarding the philosophical differences between atheists and theists, I can’t
    say that I see much real benefit in either if the everyday, practical outcome
    doesn’t result in behavior that I can see as being good to me or good for me.
    If your only point is showing that you’re smarter than someone else or a whole
    group of other people as an atheist or a theist, then you’ve become not much
    more than a banging cymbal or a clanging gong that most everyone would just want
    to stop. What good is it if someone has all knowledge and the highest IQ ever
    recorded, yet lives for the next bag of heroin? You have to be good for people
    to have any real value to them. You can spout off your amazing knowledge of all
    things in the universe and actually be correct in everything you say, yet have
    very very little to offer. There was a comment here that I thought was good,
    not necessarily intelligent or profound, which, again, can be utterly
    worthless, and it was this, “Its only in helping each other that we find true contentment in life –
    we are all on the same journey, lets make the journey as easy as possible for
    each other as its a short one.” That comment would not be a banging cymbal or a
    clanging gong to my ears if the person who wrote it actually lived it. Regardless of their belief system, a person
    who actually lived out these words would be music to me and that’s the real,
    everyday, practical difference for me. In a world of people, others determine
    your ultimate worth. If you’re good to others, you increase your worth and your
    chances of others returning the favor and being good to you. Therefore, if
    you’re an atheist show us what practical good comes of it by living out that
    good so we can all take note of it and to be thankful to you and your beliefs,
    which have graced us…And the same to all of you theists.

    • zurvan

      Atheism doesn’t (usually) make the claim for itself that it necessarily leads to a moral life. It’s simply a position on the existence of God. One can take such a position and be moral or immoral, the same way one could take a position on whether they think alien life is possible without that reflecting their moral landscape. The same can’t be said for the religious position: religion usually makes the claim for itself that if you follow a certain set of beliefs, you will be a more moral person.
      If I were to make the case that atheism (or agnosticism) leads to a more moral life, there are a few points that I think have some validity. When you are less worried about what God wants from you, then you have more bandwidth to care about your fellow human beings (and the LGBT issue is a good example of that). When you don’t think God hands you all the answers in life you have to work harder to figure out what your own moral values are, which makes you a better person. When you aren’t invested in the earth being 6,000ish years old, you are more open to the evidence of science on things like geology and evolution. When you don’t believe that God will make everything right in the end, you become more invested in creating a greater sense of justice in the here-and-now, etc.
      Now people like Reza Azlan would argue that this is an argument against fundamentalism rather than religion, and I don’t disagree. I do think that there is a very dangerous element in religion that can steer people off of a moral path.

      • stan

        Good point. I agree that doing good with your life for now makes more sense then doing good now for what comes after life.

  • Anon

    You are actually completely wrong….. In an interview he talks about how it’s about the Christian church is repressing the LGBTQA community. He was trying to advocate for the LGBTQA community in Ireland.

  • i s

    The point is, its not a sin.. they just say it is, he points out to that. The fact that he says “its a sin, but I love it” is from their perspective or wording “a sin”. Its a very interesting song. He also says.. that the only heaven is when he is with his lover. Which is love, its true bliss, and it also is what god represents. The singer is a straight man.. but aware and sensitive that he also wanted to make reflection on gay issues in Russia. Comes down to the belief, understanding, of what god is, what he represents, and how church leaders have twisted and abused their position out of ignorance, power play, against the people of faith. Love, understanding, acceptance, getting over ignorance, expanding over ignorance, is all gods way. But, preaching one thing, and practicing another.. seems to be the way.. for many, and that is not gods way.

  • i s

    There is plenty of stupid people that will call themselves religious. And you don’t even have to call yourself religious to walk the gods path. There is no need to get confused by the words. If god represents everything that is good.. acceptance, love, understanding.. not doing anything bad to other people.. It is very clear how to follow the gods path. Nobody else has to interpret it for you, and you have no excuse if you don’t carry this in your heart.. and know its true, but let somebody else lead you.. in hating ( not gods way) etc etc.

    • Ed Me Gel

      Yes and there are plenty of people that blindly brand others as haters simply because these “others” do not share the same moral belief system that they themselves adhere to –for example, because these “others” see the practice of adultery or frivolous divorce as not being good for them, not being good for their children, not being good for their community, or because they see the practice of s-x acts with those of the same gender in the same light as the practice of adultery and frivolous divorce. My question to you is, Do these “others” have to share your moral beliefs in order for you to consider them as caring human beings that can follow the “gods path”?

      • zurvan

        Same-gender attraction isn’t at all like adultery or frivolous divorce, although I take a certain issue with the notion of “frivolous” divorce since it’s usually a very painful process and I don’t think most people go through it lightly. Adultery is wrong because it is the betrayal of a partner, and frivolous divorce is wrong because it is reneging on a commitment. LGBT relationships do neither of those things. If you think it’s wrong, and in particular if you would vote for legislation against LGBT rights, then you need to understand why you think it’s wrong. What moral principle does a committed, consenting LGBT relationship violate?

  • Amanda

    I don’t really think this is an atheist vs. theist issue at all, so arguing between the two beliefs does no good for the purposes of this song. Hozier even said it himself, “it’s an assertion of self”. He’s not saying he hates God, he’s just saying it’s wrong to teach that we have the right to judge and dehumanize others. I mean, for goodness’ sake, what happened in the video (the torture of the man) is not just something made up! These things happen all the time and it’s because we choose to dehumanize and shame.

    • Ed Me Gel

      Are you saying that no one should feel shame for any acts that they commit to another human being? Should we not judge those who commit these acts, such as those who film adults performing s-x acts on children for the viewing pleasure of other adults? Are you saying that we should not judge others, absolutely?

      • zurvan

        Of course we should condemn certain acts, but for better reasons than what the Bible has to say about it. We should condemn harm done to children because it’s harming a child (and incidentally, The Bible does not condemn acts committed on a minor because there was no concept of an age of consent at that time). We should not condemn LGBT relationships because there is no good reason to criticize adult romantic relationships between consenting partners, even if The Bible says otherwise. It is, to be frank, quite clear that Paul did not understand how being LGBT works and we should not take his condemnations seriously.

    • zurvan

      I would agree, and I certainly don’t think the point of the song is that God doesn’t exist, but the song does pretty clearly align itself with a non-theistic worldview. “The only heaven I’ll be sent to…” is one such line, and the “Born sick/Command me to be well” is a reference to Christopher Hitchens. Both/and, I think.

  • Samantha Carter

    so are you basically saying that for a christian this is an insulting song? I’m a christian and I’m still trying to wrap my heard around this song. I love the song, but the words are where i loose it…. I just want to know so I can get over it….. could someone clear this up for me ? Thank you

    • zurvan

      The song is criticizing an element of religion, not religion in total. As others have mentioned, Hozier has a video where he actually explains what it means, but the message is fairly simple: he disagrees with the notion of original sin and the idea that romantic intercourse/attraction is sinful.

  • Fireheart

    I listened to this song on the radio today, and I was like hey, “This song is nice. Talking about God and church, and it has a nice beat too. Wait what did he just say?” It is not nice to put down on other’s religion and such. Let him believe what he wishes, but do not let him make his way into people’s heads with his music. Beliefs are here for a reason, and if his religion includes a girlfriend for a goddess no one wishes to hear about it (wrong there…pretty famous) especially when he prays to her with intercourse. If that is religion, I do not want to know what is really “love”.

  • Alisha Walker

    That’s a really dumb analogy.

  • Someone

    It’s about gays. Which isn’t wrong. He’s calling out religions for Calling out gays. This is an amazing inspiring song. And I’m a christian

  • EJG

    If you let the lyrics speak for themselves you will see that it’s about a girl,
    not about 2 guys. The lover that the singer refers to is female. The only
    reason it’s about same gender s-x now, in the artists comments and in the
    videos, is because whoever it is that is managing this for a profit knows that
    making it about same gender s-x is going to increase exposure, which will
    ultimately result in increased sales for the artist/producers, etc. The music
    industry is ultimately about capitalism, about making a profit and whoever it
    is that saw this opportunity to connect this now MOSTLY to same gender s-x is reaping great dividends from a very popular and emotionally charged topic and public. It was all about s-x, s-x, s-x, and worship of s-x, human sacrifice/paganism and religion as the big damper but luckily the lyrics are vague enough to keep it somewhat open to allow it to be stretched, if people buy it, to make it about the BIG topic of the day. They chose this all-encompassing pop-culture revival of the free expression of s-xuality your way, any way you want it–it’s all good… Cast off those shackles if you feel guilt, shame and fear with this whole new controversial and inspiring song, a revolutionary afterthought that’s good enough to get us all fired up to love the new good and hate the old bad…

    Lesbian/Gay = Free S-xual Expression Your Way Any Way You Want It = Love Love Love = True God = GOOD.

    Mean Church/False God (Not The God Of Our Way) = Repression = Sin = Shame = Guilt = Evil = Hate = BAD BAD BAD.

  • Emile Durkheim

    I don’t think you could be further off base with the sexualization of the lyrics; the song is without a doubt about religious oppression. I implore you to approach your analysis of the song from an atheistic standpoint as opposed to a Christian one, you will find that when looking at it without bias, the song actually has a relatively positive message about not indulging the shortcomings of oppressive religious societies (obviously not exclusive to any Christian denomination or world religion).

    • Jonathan

      A positive message about not indulging the shortcomings of oppressive religious societies while indulging in what? The worship of S-x? Being a pagan of the good times? Getting something meaty for the main course? That looks tasty. That looks plenty. Poor starving faithful. At least he understands pagan gods, a slave nonetheless to them, his own lusts, his own desires, rule. Holding back nothing. That looks tasty. That looks plenty. He embraces a darkness, a sickness, a demon and he knows it. I was born sick but I love it. It’s his source of inspiration. Not someone that I envy, somewhat like Jim Morrison.

      • zurvan

        The “that looks tasty” bit is a reference to the “high horse” of religious hypocrites. It’s a particularly clever bit of the song, but by virtue of being clever it’s somewhat more inscrutable.
        One honest criticism I have of religion in general and Catholicism in particular is that sometimes it lowers the level of it’s audience’s capacity for moral reasoning by giving them a set of answers to conform to without having to really consider them. It creates a false dichotomy: obey this set of rules, or fall victim to your own desires. Actually, the third way is considering one’s values for oneself. It is possible to accept aspects of The Bible such as love of neighbor and the golden rule without accepting all of its norms around food or romantic relationships. There are good reasons to accept some aspects and to reject other aspects of it.

  • Maz

    Yes, you missed a great deal. Watch his explanation on You Tube and you’ll have your answer about how much you “missed”

  • April

    This is one persons opinion. Hozier actually has a video talking about what it means.

  • Kat

    The song lyrics read like an S&M relationship. I like that it’s being associated with religion and religious people attacking God’s children because it gives a platform for such persecution, but I don’t think that was the original intent of the song.

  • gina

    its just a song. if you dont like it dont listen to it.

  • Cora Ashyan

    It’s not about satanism, its about hypocrisy and homophobia. Hozier has flat out stated this, plus the music video makes it pretty obvious.

  • Who Cares?

    All above comments are irrelevant

    • Mark Burns

      Yours notwithstanding…

  • nah

    this is fucking hilarious, every bit of it

  • Misty S.

    Thank you for posting. This song was playing during my morning drive and I thought, what is the real meaning behind this song…do I need to be listening to this, is there anything good in this song….so I search. I couldn’t agree with you more. As a daughter of the King, this is not what I want my kind permeated with. Despite the “music”, which I admit I do like, the words take over. It’s just a personal choice for me and as a Christian, it’s a daily battle to keep out what this world tries to justify as good.

    • stan

      Wow, that’s scary, that you actually believe this.

  • Praise the Lord

    I am amazed that with all the words written below, there was nothing worth anyones time.

    • goldushapple

      Says the poster with one post whose handle is “Praise the Lord.”

      These articles ALWAYS attract the secularists and fanboys.

  • Naomi Navarrete

    The “She” and “Her” spoken of in the song is not a girlfriend. It is his new found Knowledge that he is responsible for his own happiness, and not a God. “If the heavens ever did speak, she’s the last true mouth piece.” This is an insult to all Religions, he is saying that if there truly is a God, man has distorted his words for self gain since, well, forever. Therefore there is no suitable instrument left in the world for God too speak through. I love this song and hope that it opens peoples eyes to the fact that they not allow a man made institution to govern their decisions in life. “She” is his realization that he should do what ever makes him happy, regardless of what anyone thinks of him. The video is based on true events that took place in the 1990’s in Russia. Religious groups would lure suspected Homosexuals into the forests and make videos of the torture and murder of their victims, and then upload the videos for other extremists to watch. I find it so amazing that so many Christians are disgusted by the Homosexual behavior in this video, but not at all upset by the torture and murder that takes place at the end.
    Yes, I am an Atheist. No, I am not mad at God for some disaster that has taken place in my life. No, I do want you too pray for me. I am not lost, confused, and Certainly not ignorant. I simply do not need the promise of grand reward in order too be a good person.

  • Okay28

    If you think this is bad, you should hear Britney Spears song called 3. It’s very fast and catchy, but they heavily use audio tune to manipulate her voice, so it’s hard to clearly hear every word she says. Anyone, one day I heard the song again, so I decided to look up the lyrics. To my horror, the song uses Biblical characters to describe a threesome. Like you say in this piece, music has become very slick in how they present it.

  • Karl

    Wow. Two months since I last saw this article and look at all the anti-Catholic replies to the comments. Gosh people can be so insensitive to sensitive people. Secular liberal intolerance and hypocrisy at its best.

    I thought you moderated the comments Dr. Marshall. O_o

    • zurvan

      There is much I disagree with about Catholicism, but I don’t mind that people take a different stance. I find those conversations interesting. The real issue I take with this article is that it lowers the level of debate by taking a really pretty awful interpretation of the song as a way of ignoring the more serious and sophisticated critiques that the song is actually making about religion.

    • Mark Burns

      Apparently, I’m one of the insensitive people. Do you do you not think that people have the right to disagree? How is that intolerant? And I am not anti-Catholic. I am anti-theist.

  • Ancie

    As a ‘good’ christian, i am wondering who you are to judge and condemn your fellows : “We were born sick”, you heard them say it (“they” [Catholics] teach original sin). Now, i would like to know How ‘they’ do that!?

  • Tom Walsh

    I think the reference “I’ll tell you my sins and you can sharpen your knives” is a subtle dig at Catholics in general rather than the Catholic church as an institution – nobody is better at deriving a smug, perverse (albeit concealed) pleasure from another’s misfortune or shortcomings than a practising Catholic. If there is word of a “scandal” in a particular family, nowhere does the gossip spread faster than among a smug pious holier than thou Catholic congregation.

  • vaderof3

    Wow, the atheists now are bashing the Catholic church in a Catholic website? You guys must have too much time on your hands.

    • Mark Burns

      What is “bashing”? Disagreeing? See, I think that, when you find the truth, it can stand up to scrutiny. I personally welcome people disagreeing with me, because that helps me find out what is right and what is wrong. I don’t hide away in my website and criticize people for infiltrating with their own dissenting opinions.

  • LCarbonCopyL

    I dont follow your religion. I wanted to praise you for such a lovely breakdown for the true meaning of the song. You are completely right. No one sees the blasphemy. Thats what makes the song amazing. Thanks for the spot on translation.

  • Lisa

    I have more respect for those that question faith than those that promote a faith that breeds hate, discrimination, and use God’s name to identify themselves as self righteous. The problem with this song to the ears of the “holy” is that it powerfully expresses a primal pain of being hurt by the church. The one place in the world that was intended to be a vehicle of God’s LOVE for all his children, not a place to make self righteous pastors fill their pockets while teaching their congregation to judge, belittle, and cast out those that he sees unfit. The most evil in this world are those nearest the alter that run off or distort the faith of the genuine hearts that seek God. One might want to consider the true meaning of blasphemy, which might just be taking God’s name to nurture hate in his herd….in the church.

    • rex

      Well said.

  • Hiccup

    LOL

  • Joe Thornton

    I think the chorus has another meaning. Instead of “take me to church” being a sexual reference, he is actually being very hypocritical of what going to church means. If he was referring to his girlfriend he would not say “I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies” why would she be the lie? He see’s her as the truth. “she doesn’t offer a deathless death” God does = eternal life. I concur with the “confession reference” with the last line being the most cynical “Good God let me give you my life” I feel he is saying “Let me not enjoy the life I am living and wait for the life in the beyond that you promise, yeah right, that’s going to happen”. the song is very “catchy” but I cannot in good conscience agree with any of the lyrics. Christian and Atheist alike now have something to agree on, this song is slamming religion as a nonsensical way to live your life. I think Carrie Underwood would disagree with her song – Something in the Water..

  • CookerOfFun

    AY YO YOU Atheists! Heres a little teaching to you, you are judging all christians based on one person, in the bible it states lifes purpose is to basically get atheists and believers of different religions to convert to christianity so if we torment you about god ITS OUR JOB

    • Mark Burns

      I am an atheist, and I’m not judging you. And I don’t have any problem with you trying to convert people to Christianity. But you’re going to have a hard time. Since the invention of the Internet, and the availability of information to people, Christianity can no longer control what people know and learn. I am no longer a believer because I have the ability to learn more about other religions and unbelief and see the truth, and you will not be able to stop others from learning as well. That is why atheism and the nones have increased from 7% to almost 20% just in the last 40 years.

  • Jocelyne

    I never heard the song so I went on you tube and listened. I completely agree with you Taylor I don’t think you missed anything. The video is absolutely horrible. I have young children at home and this would be the last thing I would want them to see and hear.

  • Sam

    Did you even watch the music video for this song? You call this man a blastamist and yet you don’t have any idea what the song is really about. I myself am a proud Christian, but you are missing the entire point of the song. It is criticizing people exactly like you. Christians who don’t understand something or someone so the write it off as un-Godly or full of sin. This song has nothing to do with him sleeping with his girlfriend. In fact, it is just the opposite. This song is showing how the church is reacting toward the Gay community. You should be ashamed of yourself for becoming exactly what this song was created to show. I have no doubt that you follow God whole heartedly, but I think that you should get your facts straight before accusing others of not having a strong enough faith in the Lord OUR Father.

  • Liz

    The song is about Semiramis, Astarte, Ishtar The whore of Babylon not about a girlfriend. The consort or Satan. She is the Goddess you must worship in order to be famous and promoted. it is a semi covert religion. She, just being another face of Satan demands human sacrifice just like Babylonian times. Not much has changed. The lady in stairway to heaven is also referencing her. It is the religion of the elite this occult luciferian demonic worship.

    • Mark Burns

      You are kind of crazy, and it is a little scary and super interesting at the same time.

  • Sarah

    To be honest, I disagree with you on one point: I don’t think “That’s a fine looking high horse
    What you got in the stable?” Is about Christ in the stable, to me, its about people who sound their lives running after materialistic things and live on their “high horses”, forever adopting a “holier than thou” attitude. But that’s just my opinion. I really enjoyed the article though, it was very insightful!

  • Michael David Sugg

    As a former atheist who at one time could prove better than anyone on this planet that their was no God…..too many things have declared to me at my lowest point in life (drunk, meth cook adulterer you name it) that there is indeed a God and He is not me (or anything objected on earth) He is a real person in the form of God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Spirit…sorry to disappoint all the nay sayers but I have seen my best friend come back from death tooooooo many times and certainly He has lifted me out of the mirey clay and put my feet on the solid rock that is Jesus Christ. In fact if you want to hear a power driven rock ballad that is totally clean listen to Natalie Grant’s “I will not be moved” 100,000 times better then Take me to Church….IMHO.

    • Marilily Teresa

      Great testimony!

    • Mark Burns

      If you think that, as an atheist, you could prove that there was no god, then you were not an atheist. That’s not what we do. Not going to disparage your life experience, and I’m glad that your life has improved, but you come off as hating and rebelling against God, whereas we atheists are simply unconvinced of a god, and perhaps somewhat indifferent. I respect you having your opinion and perspective, I just don’t think that what you were really represents what most atheists actually are.

  • beki5

    Oh my!!
    ….you’ve interpreted what YOU THINK the song is about. Making an issue saying its “blasphemous” why don’t you read what the artist states It’s about? If you can’t understand it….. It’s about those who state and teach shame about sexual orientation being sinful and offending God.
    Who are we to judge? Everyone will have to face the only One who can judge and that is God. Hozier clearly stated what it’s about…..why can’t you stay
    on that level without causing
    confusion, strife and
    divisiveness? Let’s promote peace and love and maybe….just maybe we can do what Jesus taught. And if I have to explain THAT to you, then you clearly should not have started this comment.

    • Mark Burns

      I disagree with one thing. The music video is about the mistreatment of homosexuals in Russia. However, if you listen to an interview by the artist, he speaks of the lyrics in broader terms. It isn’t a song about an issue. It is a song about institutions demonizing things that are natural. He intentionally wrote vague lyrics because they apply to various social concerns. If the song were about gay rights, wouldn’t it be strange that it is a man singing his woman as a metaphor? But I do agree with most everything else you said 🙂 thanks for commenting.

  • Junonia

    Your analysis is somewhat accurate, but Hozier does not equate God with a girlfriend. He refers to the Church as “She,” because as a Christian should know, the Church is the “Bride of Christ.” He makes this clear when he says “If the Heavens ever did speak, She’s the last true mouthpiece.” This means that if a God has something to say, the Church would be the last to know; he wouldn’t choose the Church as his mouthpiece.

    The artist has given numerous interviews and made his meaning clear. The point of the song is that the Church warps religion to support hate, much as you are doing in your completely original analysis. It’s no mystery that Hozier supports equality.

  • Robin Witham

    It is a shame that this is such an evil song. The music IS hauntingly beautiful. As a Christian, my “Jesus sense” went off right away!! God let’s us know when something is wrong. I felt it the first time I heard this song. Shame on Hozier. Now to get it out of my head.

    • Rex

      “Jesus sense” You are being sarcastic, aren’t you. If not, is, “Jesus Sense” like Spidey sense?

  • Peace

    From the first time I heard this song I was offended. Yes, I
    do have a Christian back ground; however my life experiences has developed a
    more personal philosophy; something that
    does conforms to an accepted standards of morality and respectability. This
    song in my option is certainly does not, and if it was to reflected on another
    belief; I still would turn it off when heard. I just cringe when it’s played.

  • Chris Wooten

    Oh my God!!! Two guys kissing. What ever will we do??!!

  • Jeff Stein

    This year, economy is going to collapse. September 2015. Get your house in order!

  • Corey Scott

    Personally I think it has less to do with raising a girlfriend to a Godlike status and more to do with feeling alienated by the church. The video suggests a VERY different meaning from the one you interpret here, and I don’t think it’s necessarily contradictory to the use of “she” and “her” if the artist identifies more with God as a female entity. Personally, I take the song to be an expression that this person doesn’t understand Christian persecution of people and doesn’t feel that God would condone the violent acts of those supposedly acting in accordance to their Christian religion.

    Even if your interpretation is closer to the intended meaning, however, I fail to see how this is somehow more sinister than the pseudo-satanic or at least anti-religious music you mentioned. It doesn’t appear to be hostile so much as an inner struggle. Blasphemy involves sinning with the intent to ask forgiveness later, using God’s promise of salvation as a loophole to behave outside of the way God would have followers behave. To me, this is more of an internal struggle with what the church feels is morally right or wrong vs. what the artist feels is right or wrong. I don’t take it as a hostile song at all, which can’t be said for the ones you say aren’t any more offensive than this one. I hear pain and lamentation over being unable to reconcile what the singer was taught in church vs. hire he wants or feels he should be able to live. Yuppie right, it’s not in line with strict Catholic teachings, but I don’t find it sinister, hostile or blasphemous.

    • Mark Burns

      Well said!

  • chris

    i don’t want to hear this song again. and its so catchy..
    thanks for the explanation.

  • Elaine

    the line “I was born sick” most likely refers to the fact that some people view homosexuality as a sickness.

  • Kartik

    Um actually I think the sing is about him going against the church because of homosexuality.
    I mean, we were born sick can also imply that since the church thinks homosexuality is a sin and since he was born gay, he could be born sick. Then the next time born sick is mentioned, it can also imply that he likes to be gay.
    Also if you look at the chorus, he says he will worship hard at the shrine of your lies as in he thinks that the church is a shrine of God’s lies since he might think that God will accept him, but the church doesn’t. I’ll tell you my sins so you can sharpen your knife could also mean that if he tells them he’s gay, they will sharpen their knife, as in attack him. Offer me my deathless death as in being forced to live without his lover is equivalent to death for him but he’s not literally dead. Good God let me give you my life. As in he’d prefer to die than leave his boyfriend but that’s just my interpretation, what do you think of it?

    • Mark Burns

      But the whole song is about his lover…a woman. The music video is about the maltreatment of LGBT in Russia, but the lyrics themselves are broader…they are about the mistreatment of people by institutions for engaging in natural, human behaviors. Google search an interview with the artist, and he is pretty clear about what the song is about but no need to interpret the lyrics. He just tells us what that means.

  • I completely agree. I loved the song because the sound was amazing, the vocals were powerful, and lyrically, the creativity is nothing short of sheer poetry. However, I couldn’t help but feel uncomfortable with the religious references when the song was clearly not about praise & worship of the Most High. I searched the lyrics just to confirm things within myself and boom, there you have it. It’s sad, but most great music these days is clearly demonic, satanic, or blasphemous. Ah well. *deletes song from playlist*

  • Angel

    so sad…I didnt see any …. ANY! reference to the bible which is supposed to be the word of god in this ‘theological’ study. love the song and the video… it clearly show that religons -yes! i put all of them in the same sack- are used to harm people. the guy who posted this ‘study’ should be less biased and more open to love people. thats what jesus did, before he died…

  • Joss

    I’m praying for your grammar sir. The letter A is nowhere near the letter E.

    • Mark Burns

      You didn’t hit the “reply” button. We have no idea who you’re talking to.

      • Joss

        The writer of the article.
        “Take Me to Church” by Hozier could only have been written by an Irishmen with Catholic roots.
        You can’t have “An Irish MEN”.
        It’s either “An IrishmAn” or “SOME Irishmen”
        I’m lost out here in the world, and it’s hard for me to hear God trying to speak to me through people when their grammar is poor.

        • Mark Burns

          Ah…that’s helphil. Thanks for being more clear.

  • CarynL

    It’s funny that the writer goes through so much work to “analyze” his completely obvious lyrics. Hozier has given interviews where he has spelled out the meanings. He isn’t trying to trick anybody, he is very open about his dislike of homophobia and of, as he says, institutions that “would undermine humanity by successfully teaching shame about sexual orientation.”

  • rex

    Dr. Marshall, How sad you are so narrow minded you have to pick apart a song. If you don’t like it, don’t listen to it. This song as well as any other song, has different meanings to all who listen to it. Its a shame you are shackled by religion and can’t think for yourself.

  • Scarlet

    This analysis is so simple-minded I can’t even…

  • Rosalie

    Hahahaha OMG I couldn’t stop laughing throughout this article. You do not even fucking know what it’s about. It’s about homosexuality and that’s the sin he’s referring to throughout the song. Oh good lord

  • rjkeyes8

    It an amazing song about giving yourself, making yourself completely vulnerable to another person. To analyze it theologically is inane. Take it at face value. And if somewhere in the song it referred to “her” as his “wife” would the acct still be sin? He r recognizes his sin nature. ..something the Bible says we were all born with. I am a Christian. The song does not offend me. Not does the video. I feel sorry for anyone who has never loved or been loved like that. I can’t believe anyone took the time to analyze this song and draw religious conclusions. It is a brilliant expression of a very intense and perhaps different kind of human emotion.

  • “Lost sheep”

    It is not actually about “his girlfriend”. It’s about being a homosexual. And the line “That’s a fine looking high horse that you got in the stable” is about those folks who feel they are above homosexuals and tell them that it is wrong. I grew up in church. I went to a private church based school and attended 3 times a week besides being there 5 days a week for school. I was taught to be accepting of others, you didn’t have to agree with them but you shouldn’t treat them as if they were diseased. This song is about those who speak using their religion to make others feel less of a human being. We are all human, just because someone does or does not do something you personally believe to be the “right” way to live does not mean you should treat them as if they are not a human being as you are. Jesus accepted all, even after being persecuted for his beliefs. He came back to save us all from our sins. ALL of us. So why do you feel you deserve it over a homosexual? I do believe we are supposed to live by the New Testament and learn from the Old Testament. But yet many of things said and done today are all based off what the Old Testament says alone. We all believe what we believe but just because I don’t believe what you do does not mean I’m wrong. This article is an interpretation of one mans opinion. A warped opinion at that, but his opinion nonetheless. We all have our own. It does not mean it’s correct.

  • Anna Star

    I come from a semi-devout Muslim family. Our religion does not permit same-sex love, and yet my generation as no problem with it. (The previous generation has mixed reactions since they have not been as exposed as we are.) Why wouldn’t I be okay with this song? It’s pretty catchy. And I know the “Church” symbolism makes it seem kind of wrong for me to like the song, but quite frankly, I don’t care.
    And people shouldn’t care. You love who you love. I have a couple homosexual friends who I’ve known since childhood. Sure, it’s a bit odd to think about (I’ve known them all my life), but every time I think of it as slightly odd that I hadn’t known it, I feel ashamed. Why should I look at them differently than I have before. And then when I see them again and they crack a joke, it hits me. They’re the exact same as they were before, just happier because coming out to people who accept you no matter what is a liberating thing.
    And the song isn’t specifically aimed at the church. It’s aimed at people who advocate against gay rights and such. I mean, come on! If you have a problem with it, fine. But in the process of fighting against it you are hurting other people, and isn’t that infringing their rights? Let them have their rights, what’s it to you? They’re not asking you to “sin” with them.
    So basically, if they can’t get married because of your religion, then you can’t eat or drink during daylight hours for a month because I’m fasting.

  • Corinne Smith

    Wow…I never bothered to check out the lyrics. Just liked the tune. I’m going to delete it from my playlist. Thanks Taylor for bringing this out.

    • ralp

      Its so sad you can’t think for yourself but would let someone who “interprets” lyrics to make up your mind for you. I think you had it right in the beginning, its a song that you liked.

      • Corinne Smith

        It’s not a case of thinking for myself or interpreting it Ralp. Unfortunately I’m in the habit of getting hooked on to a tune first. That being the case here too. I never bothered to check on the lyrics. I am not a holier-than-thou person, but love God and don’t like to acknowledge anything said or done against Him or His teachings.

  • kmc

    I do agree, wholeheartedly, with your evaluation of his song, and that is definitely blasphemous and an insult to those who practice the Catholic sacraments. One thing though- Hozier’s video that accompanies the song does bring up a different yet important point. He highlights the treatment of gay men. I assume there are some other issues in his country or that he is actually gay himself and that homosexuals are treated very badly and that is the reason for the video. I do believe that regardless of how we feel about the subject of homosexuality, horrific treatment of people based on our differences is never ok and so I do think it is good on some level to point that out as an artist. But overall, I am saddened and worried about the lack of understanding of the sacraments and the Love of God even by Christians themselves. Thanks ! kmc

    • ralp

      “Blasphemous” is in the eye of the beholder.

  • zerogravity

    I like your point of view. keep up the good work.

  • Listener

    I think of Hafiz, the expression of passionate love. The lover being God. I think this is the mixture here as well. The need for passion, intimacy, worship, transcendence. As is pointed out, there are references to religion, perhaps antagonistic. But the passion requires it to express this universal theme and feeling. Even the word “passion” is used mostly for either the love of God or another person. I believe these lyrics embrace it all.

  • A. Bos

    I cannot judge for other people, but this songs made met think about the
    church and being a christian, some things I was forgotten a long time
    ago. So I think its quite positive from that point of view.

  • Stefan

    I think it’s great that you know so much about Judas Priest and Manson. Your perception of them is clearly 100% accurate and in no way derogative, judgemental, or fictional. How about doing your research properly before throwing names around? Very Christian of you to smear names in the mud out of judgement without evidence. You sir, are the reason songs like this are written.

  • honest

    I definitely thought it was about the corruption of the church. Although I consider myself a Christian, I often do not attend church because of the hypocrisy. I feel that church is a place for sinners, not for “perfect” people. And I feel that sadly the church has turned many away from Christianity because they are gay, or single parents, or just more open and honest about their sin. I do believe there is scripture having to do with the punishment for leading people from Christ. Anyway, church should be about love and support. Instead of telling each other what is wrong with one another, let us help each other learn and strengthen our relationship with God and surely the stronger that bond, the less temptation there is for sin. Anyway, words and symbols are what we make them. And I know it’s not a popular idea, but I’m cautious when reading scripture because although God is perfect, man is not, including the men who have written and translated the bible over the centuries…

  • 666Sent666

    HA HA Suck it, Christians. Bitch some more.

  • T

    You took a lot of liberties in your assumptions about what this song is about. You should interview the writer, then blog about it? I don’t understand this video on utube in reference to this song, but even if you go with whoever produced the video, the video does not reflect these assumptions as far as I can tell.

  • Joe

    Im sorry but this is a poor analysis. If you were actually to read the interviews of Hozier you would know that the song is about the church’s stance on homosexuality (something you didn’t reference at al in the analysis). It takes a narrow-minded person to say this is satanic music. The catholic church teaches love for everyone, yet at the same time we should love some people more than others? That is what the song is saying, it is a critique on the stance of the catholic church. An outdated stance that promotes hate when all catholics should practice love.

  • Outcast

    It would be a far greater service to your faith to listen to and address the very real problems presented in the song. This interpretation is grossly inaccurate but far easier it is to point fingers than to take responsibility and spend some time in due self-reflection. It’s a horrible shame that you fail to see the true depth of faith expressed in his words and that the gospels are interpreted with as much ineptitude on a daily and radical basis.

  • Stephen Butler

    I think you are reading too much into this. It’s a song along the same lines as “Personal Jesus” by Depeche mode, which is to say it’s only Christian in the most loose sense of the word … yet is still a powerful celebration of faith. God isn’t the only one people place faith in, also family, lovers, friends, and the occasional good neighbor.

    If you want the Catholic angle on this, read the Song of Solomon which is so close of an opposite to the metaphor in this song that I have a hard time believing it is a coincidence. The Song of Solomon uses the metaphor of a lover to describe the Church. This song uses the metaphor of the Church to describe a lover …

  • Mariah

    Maybe the artist is expressing his feelings, not preaching heresy. Not everything is an attack against God or those who follow His teachings. I think we, as Christians, can learn a great deal from non-Christians. After all, how else are we to reach them?

  • smbateman

    My husband and I had the exact same experience. The songs “hymn-like” nature caught our attention but very quickly the song took a blasphemous turn. We are praying for him and that he uses his obvious understanding of the church’s sacramental nature for good sometime in the near future. Anyone can see the truth. Lord, give him eyes to see and ears to hear.

    • Mark Burns

      Boo. I find the lyrics deep and insightful, interpretive and interesting. If anyone can see the truth, you should be able to glean that. Maybe you should ask for ears to hear instead of petitioning on behalf of Hozier.

    • ralp

      I always thought that when religious people say, “they are praying for someone”, they are actually condemning that person they are praying for. This phrase comes across as pompous and demeaning. Its just a phrase that says the person you are praying for is wrong in their beliefs and yours are right. Its such a head in the sand mentality. I think the phrase should be “preying” and not “praying”.

      • smbateman

        I do think his lack of belief in the Church and his lack of reverence is wrong, just like you think you are right and I am wrong. However, by praying I am lifting him up. I prayed the rosary for him in hopes that he will continue to do good and cease to do wrong on this journey we are all on together, and I will pray the same for you.

        • ralp

          You really don’t get what I’m saying do you? Or maybe you are just being subtle at being insulting. But no, don’t pray for me.

  • Heidi

    Leave the judgement to god. This song is about the pain and discrimination, experienced by people who love others of the same gender, by so called christians . I doubt very much that jesus would approve of the way organised religion behaves toward many members of society, particularly those who identify as gay.

    If you want to start pointing fingers, talk and learn about right ways to live as a christian, turn your hearts and minds toward real world issues such as sensless violence and greed. Practice forgiveness, do good and love thy neighbour. Leave the judgement to god.

  • Jessica D. Hutchinson

    I love this interpretation, I was assuming that this song meant what you say it does, the real wonderful thing he is that Hozier is saying that the only true act, something that drives humanity is love, something that no Christian/Catholic church has for every human on this planet. Religion will scorn, shun, or stone any person they don’t feel as living up to their standards, love judges no one. So you write it as a bad thing, I see it as another eye-opener to what truly matters in this world and that is human kindness, acceptance, and love, not religion.

  • Goon Benishi

    Geez, the God I was taught about in school said we have no right or authority to judge anyone….

    • Mark Burns

      Interesting. It can become a vicious cycle of, “Don’t judge me for being judgmental.”

      As an atheist, I welcome people judging me. The more they are willing to be judgmental, the more they open themselves up for reciprocity. It’s a two-way street, and I am willing to travel down that street as far as the next person is.

      But good on you for poignantly and concisely identifying one of so many hypocrisies in the church.

  • Zach

    The song is about the hatred and bigotry the church and religion shows towards homosexuals. A message against the reality of most religion.

  • Anonymous

    The only thing i have to say is that when hoizer made his statement, his words were “sexual orentation”. This song is about the ‘sin’ of being gay. It’s not really a sin from my eyes though…

  • Jana

    Does anyone know where the phrase “This is hungry work” comes from? I seem to hear echoes of the book of instruction for the auto de fie. There was a shameful period of time when women of property tended to be burned as witches. The Church got the property and the Witch Hunter took in 10%.
    Or a quote from a play?
    Anyone?

  • Joakim

    Well no, I’m anti-evil so I can’t really agree with you.

  • the eye

    You’re a sad, scared little man but the worst part is your analysis couldn’t have been any more wrong any any more boring to be quite frank.

  • Spencer

    This song is about the gays in Russia being beaten and killed by small mobs of assassins. The hits were ordered by the president of Russia, Putin. Its not comparing a goddess to God. Though, it might have been comparing two male lovers to one another. It is still complete blasphemy but if you do enjoy this tune I advise you to watch the music video. You will be so disgusted you’ll never listen to it again.

    • Spencer again

      I meant to say comparing the male lovers to God.

  • Get it right…

    Your interpretation of the song is comical, twisted to your benefit… Sad really… that you believe God picks and chooses people based on what they believe and not the positive, moral lives they live…

  • saydita

    It has meanings that are so close to florence and the machine’s “bedroom hymns”

  • Whoeverrwrotethisarticlesucks

    You are a complete and total fucktard.

  • ralp

    I am going to pray for all of you who want to, “interpret” the lyrics when the song writer has told everyone what the lyrics mean. So what is music? I never listened to the words growing up, it was just the song itself that had meaning. Music was a big part of life growing up. TV was 4 channels and what was on sucked. But the radio, am radio, was what we had. WLS out of Chicago. Music that was a part of our lives, and still is. How many memories come back if you are 45-50 and hear the Stones or Journey? But I like this song, “Take me to Church”. I can understand why church sucks. I quit going. And Hozier said what it means and why he wrote it, and I take his thoughts and make the song my own. And that’s the point. Every song is to us, what it is to us.

  • Bishbosh

    Decent article until the crack about Hozier being Irish. It all just went downhill from there. Sorry bud, but being a jerk about someone’s national origin is not okay, especially when it involves stereotyping.

  • gays-are-people-too

    you people are the disgusting ones.. Being gay is natural, just like being straight is. If only you were not foolish enough to believe in an invisible man floating somewhere above the earth, who supposedly created this planet, then everyone would be a lot happier. I pity you.

  • Christian

    Dear Mr. Marshall,
    we should not confuse blasphemy with words sung not about Him but about the catholic church. Mr. Hozier being from Ireland has no doubt seen His word being skewed by clerical men in his country, and although his youthful rage might take things further than what one might think is decent, clerics in Ireland surely did, too. Is there not a reading of this text where we can see Mr. Hoziers Ire is not with Him but with those perverting His word down here? You seem to turn your back on a young person clearly in search of His embrace.
    Kind Regards.

  • umbuddah

    I listened to Take me to Church with my 2 granddaughters ages 12&16 a few times. Yes the song is easy to listen to however I asked my granddaughters what the song meant and I repeated some of the lyrics to them. They didn’t really know the meaning of the song. Seems like a good song if we want our young children to listen to lyrics that will confuse them and pull them away from our Lord.

  • God isn’t Religion

    Wow Christians can do no wrong, you people take your religion and twist and turn it into something ugly.You down people, act better,condemn things and turn something beautiful ugly.Some of you people are talking as if you are God,lol its pathetic really,but clearly some Christians act like their above everyone and have their own agendas. God loves the people you talk about,your wrong and nothing you can say or do will say otherwise, so read your book and quote some scriptures and act better,God loves all and you don’t matter.

  • this essay and the accompanying comments do nothing more than prove the musicians point. amazing that the “disgusting” part identified in the video was a couple kissing, rather than the violent self righteous mob that commits murder and arson

  • Paul Jones-Lopez

    I’m confused…Dr. Marshall, you write an analysis about the biblical and blasphemous meaning of this song, yet at the end of your article, you quote the actual ARTIST of the song in an INTERVIEW, explaining exactly what your research “discovered?”

  • lisa

    Boy did you get it wrong. The artist is gay and the church teaches that he is sick and a sinner because of that. It is the church and those who hate who are twisted. Grow up. There are no magical creatures watching your every move that hate the same people you hate. Take responsibility for your own prejudices.

  • MimiG

    I have not heard this song, but I read the lyrics. My 7-year-old great-grandson had heard the song, and had found the lyrics on his tablet. He was actually copying down the words, thinking it was a real “church” song. I find these words verging on blasphemy. Very offensive, and certainly inappropriate for a 7 year old.

  • Miguel Seon

    +Mark Burns how about we forget the whole idea of religion because religion is a tool used to segregate and discriminate and just focus on the idea of “god” we actually don’t need religion

    • Mark Burns

      I don’t know which of my comments you are replying to, but you are on the right path. Why not forget about all of it and focus on being good humans? I don’t see any reason to believe in God, nor any reason to practice religions. Do you?

  • Sara Rose

    I like the song. Especially the music video. Hozier tries to tell you that homosexuality and every other sexuality is fine even though everyone says it’s “against god”. You know what’s against gods will? Divorce. Do we care? Nope. So why should we care about the sexual orientation of others? Why should we claim that their love is wrong? In the end no love can be wrong. God loves us and them equal. He knows that, as long as they are good humans, are similar to us. So please stop hating. It’s irrational and worthless. As long as there is love and the faith in god, there’s nothing you should worry about.

  • Ponderer

    Respectfully, I came to this page seeking some insight and depth of discussion from a theological standpoint. I confess I was woefully disappointed at the trite and shallow treatment of the subject matter. If this is intended as a “theological” treatment, it causes one to wonder the depth of understanding acquired at seminary. While there are certainly sexually-based allusions throughout the lyrics, that is hardly the point. (Is the Song of Songs merely pornographic literature?) The song, more broadly, is clearly an indictment of “the church” (and other social institutions) for its failure to minister to the needs of the faithful. It is not, except in an allegorical sense, a paean to paganism or satanism. If that is all that is gotten out of it, a great deal more introspection is required.

    Before posting something such as this, I would respectfully suggest a LOT more thought be given. Are you, for example, willing to accept that “the church” – Catholic or catholic – has room for improvement? Are you willing, as Pope Francis urges, to “lead with humility” and acknowledge that all of us have to be humbled, that none of us (even the Pope) have “the answer”? Are you willing to acknowledge that “sin” is a human construction, an explanation of behavior rather than an indictment of it? Are those who persecute in the name of “faith” true guardians of the faith, of the promise and the sacrifice? These are much more significant and central elements of the song than the fringe points you focus on. Next question: Are you willing to engage on this level?

  • Chrystal

    I enjoy this song and video. It displays/explains great contradiction with religion. You don’t need religion to have morals, just simply (TRULY) treat people how you want to be treated, religion is the very contradiction of the following. It provokes you to think. Question everything.

  • This is pathetic

    Why are some people still thinking like this in the 21st century? Thought humanity was evolving :/ I only hope someday people will have no religions, only then there will be world peace

  • mikesensei

    My thought as this song came on the radio the other day: “This is quite possibly the most depressing and soul-sucking song ever recorded.”

  • Timothy Moulder

    Don’t you think you are perhaps being a bit over-sensitive?

    Many Christians purport to love the song “Hallelujah” without understanding the song is about a marriage disintegrating, and the singer is listing the grievances he has with his wife using religious imagery. Even understanding this, however, the song is hauntingly beautiful, but tragic.

    Lastly, remember the words of the apostle Paul – “It is good for a man to remain single, because a single man is concerned with what God wants, while a married man is concerned with what his wife wants.” Alot of people don’t realize he had a sense of humor 🙂

  • Megan Abell

    I wish I could put into words exactly how fucking stupid you are. However, any and all explanation would fall on willfully ignorant ears.

  • anon

    dude you’re just mean…

  • Taylor

    The author of this is fucking christian scum, Marilyn Manson and metal isnt satantic you fucking uneducated swine, use your fucking brain, youre worse than a pig and no im not satan, even though you think i am, im not. Jesus Christ you all are idiots.

  • Alexana

    I really agree with you. I was so confused with the lyrics so I research the meaning about it. The line “I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies” makes me really curious. Thanks for this 🙂

  • Holo The Wise Wolf

    Bro….. The entire song is about the persecution of gay people by the Chruch….. So you’re entire breakdown is WAY off.

  • tinker bell

    The breakdown and your interpretation of the song is completely wrong. Hozier has pointed out that the song is about the persecution of homosexuals by the church and its followers.

  • Charlie

    What’s up with the music video what does it show and what does it mean?

  • SRENEA

    THIS MY FAV SONG EVER

  • HATER101

    THE SONG TAKE ME TO CHURCH IS A GOOD SONG BUT WIN YOU TAKE CHUCH IN THIS SONG IT JUST WRONG

  • jon

    Be serious. Butt hurt for nothing. . Its asong… either listen and enjoy or don’t listen and change the station. God damn. This is why religion is fading out.

    • Jonathan Morais

      I posted this… im Catholic so I can speak from experience… im not gay nor do i very much enjoy seein guys holdin hands or kissin in public but girl on girl is pretty hott … especially if one or both are hot.

  • Angie

    Wow, talk about over thinking things. This song is about the hypocrisy of “religious” people who hate gays. Watch the video. With our new Pope, the Catholic Church is back on track with the TRUE teachings of Jesus. No hate, no judging others – just love and helping our fellow brothers and sisters.

  • Seriously,.. that is rubbish

    Analysis 100% incorrect in my view. The song is about the church’s persecution and subjigation of homosexuals. It is not a comment on the thin line between Catholicism and Christianity (which are basically identical in any way that matters – a commonality that they share with Islam for anyone who cares to look with an unbigoted mind). As such I see it as a perfectly appropriate piece of social comment on the failings of the modern-day church. For any who choose to read the bible you will notice that it is full of homosexuality (which in the Zeitgeist of Christ’s time was not uncommon).

  • joanna

    Jesus Christ have mercy! I never even knew I’m so glad I checked this about the song…..and how did this turn to a full blown out talk on aethism?

    • Mark Burns

      It might be due to all the religious imagery in the song. Atheists are well-versed on religion. It’s why I’m interested in the lyrical interpretation of Hozier’s work.

  • retrobob

    Whoever wrote this review, I personally want to punch you in the face

  • Barbara

    I rarely agree wholeheartedly with anyone, but your interpretation and concerns are exactly what I thought, right down to how there is a part of me that likes the song. There’s something about the tone and melody that draws me in. Somewhat scares me that I enjoy listening to this song, while I knowingly despise the intent and subversive message.

  • linda

    Well you need to watch the video. Because it shows to men kissing and people coming after them . To take the guy to beat him and burn him.

  • Robin Thomas

    Dont flip out– its a metaphor for a kind of religious obsession for his lover. Metaphors arent blasphemous they are comparative. This song is beautiful and lyrical. Dont judge it through self righteous eyes or ears. Im a christian– I have no problem with this song. I do have a problem with people making judgements and passing them along like they are gospel. WWJD? Jesus would tell you knock it off.

  • Robin Thomas

    very one sided convo if you delete dissenting opinions- dude.

  • Tina Alcozer

    Well to me the song almost references the horse as being the bull that was made out of gold in Moses days and the women being sacrificed on it..(movie reference from The Ten Commandments). All the sexual immorality that ensued when Moses was in the mountain getting the commandments. Every one thought it was ok to do the things they were doing, remember there were no laws yet. A people without direction..and now this song states that all of this is ok and right. Your point is clear on one thing that the devil comes in many disguises..and even in a catchy tune. Sad our youth cannot or will not see what is right in front of them. In the end of times many shall turn away from the truth.

  • love is all there is

    The song was always about humanity at its most natural, and how that is undermined ceaselessly by religious organisations and those who would have us believe they act in its interests.

  • shelly

    When I heard this song, I fell in love with it. I played it so much tht my 3 year old Memorized parts of the song, thats horrible! When I acually listened to the words, and listened to hozier himself talk about the song, i was mortified!!! What a shame that the melody and music draws you into such a blatantly evil song without a person even knowing it’s happening. ..

  • aw

    You really couldn’t have misinterpreted the poetry in this song more wrong. It’s about the Catholic persecution and slander of same gender love.

  • richardhead

    And now, pop culture has made everyone’s comments irrevelant. New song next week and people will be ranting about it.

  • Erica Brown Salinas

    Beautiful Things
    Countless memories of the past, some we store some we cast.

    I feel you missed is that the lover spoken of is in reference to a male not a a female. I also believe the song is written from the perspective of a child in relation to l petafilia and the sexual abuse he was forced to endure within the confines of the church. I am a christian and I myself found the lyrics an ingenous way to speak of such an intolerable act, the innocence if childhood lost at the hands of someone you should be able to trust. Perhaps the child an alter boy .. Perhaps the adult a priest.

  • Jesus

    Hozier is an amazing musician and good on him for speaking out. He should write one on child abuse too (have the pope on this front cover). Religion makes me fell dirty. It’s not God, it’s the way so many use it to fuel there own mental instability and impose their delusions on to the vulnerable, thus creating a cycle of mentalists. God is fake and the lack of intervention in a corrupt world highlight this. To stay in the clouds would be cowardly, and I don’t worship cowards. I chose reality

  • Jesus

    Hozier is an amazing musician and good on him for speaking out. He should write one on child abuse too (have the pope on this front cover). Religion makes me fell dirty. It’s not God, it’s the way so many use it to fuel there own mental instability and impose their delusions on to the vulnerable, thus creating a cycle of mentalists. God is fake and the lack of intervention in a corrupt world highlight this. To stay in the clouds would be cowardly, and I don’t worship cowards. I chose reality.

  • Yalitzer

    The song is great, however the lyrics are just more ignorance from people that can’t understand God hates the sin, not the sinner. Of course the media is going to push this song into the spotlight.

  • Megan

    This reads like it was written by a fifth-grader. What compelling analysis! Where’d you study theology, Head Start?

  • Timothy

    Your wrong about Catholics, in fact your absolutely wrong. That song is about Christians going and killing Homosexual men. We should all be offended that the music Industry makes us look like savages

  • GardenGnome

    The lyrics in the chorus are not about the girl. They are about the actual church, and being judged by the church. “I’ll tell you my sins so you can sharpen your knife”. I’ll tell you my sins so you can judge me and cut me to pieces with those judgements.

  • baby pk

    i agree with u Dr Taylor. after i read the lyric n watch the video, i decide to delete this song from my playlist. this song is just insulting God and Christian

  • Tatia L Sanchez

    I think the reference to the “Goddess” is a wiccan reference. As they revere her and she has the sexual/sensual/earthy tones as well.

  • SB.

    Is that some sort of satire or does he actually mean that Christian bullshit? If not, that’s one of the best satire I’ve seen so far!

  • Megan

    I hope you realise that the song is actually about homosexuality.
    “we were born sick” certain people dispise homosexuality. They get told theyre ‘sick’ for liking same-sex. Also, they are born like that, as they tell people – they dont choose to be gay.
    “I’ll tell you my sins, and you can sharpen your knife.” it’s obviously a sin to be gay, they confess to it. And they know people hate them for it.
    Plus, the music video… It’s about homosexuals running from people who clearly hate them for being gay.

  • joe

    When I first heard this song I fell instantly in love with the melody and the surface meaning of what I thought it represented. Then I paid attention to the lyrics!!! I guess the write accomplished his goal. He created a song that is as deceptive as both organized religion and satin. He mask physical sexual and home sexual worship in a lyric religious seeming package.

  • Kel

    Your Horse reference is wrong. “High horse” referencing those who may think they are better. However he throws back what’s in your stable? Meaning are you without sin? So a “let them cast the first stone” concept.

  • Sebastian

    You guys do know that it is a rebellion against LGBT hate from the church, right? And the “girlfriend” is his/her partner, not God. I won’t say it is mockery, because the problem of hate against LGBT people can’t be solved by that, it is more of saying: “Oh you said I sinned for loving, fine take me to church”. Please feel free to scream your religious butts off at me. 🙂

  • Cryer

    Please get a grip you religious fruitcake. Songs aren’t written to conform to your personal superstitions.

  • Ed Paulin

    SO is he singing about his gay boyfriend like the video shows or did they turn it around like that for the “SHOCK VALUE.”?

  • Ed Paulin

    BTW RELIGION- MADE BY MAN TO CONTROL MAN…….and that is all. sorry to disappoint folks.

    • Rachel Kenner

      Your perspective on the world is not perfect, and as long as it’s not, no one has any reason to belive you. Ultimately belief in religion is in a way derived from a sort of logic, but this logic is highly affected by emotion and action and reaction.
      When you learn somthing you automatically compare it to what you know or “know” about the world. If it’s not compatible you have little or no faith in the idea.
      For me relgion both has very high world compatibility, and very high personal compatibility ( teaches me standerds I want to fallow).
      You can insult us, but I am pretty sure we fallow the exact same thought process as you.
      To prove your statment you will have to use somthing other then the most common kind of logic.

      Have a nice day, I wish you a happy life 🙂

      • Ed Paulin

        My perspective of the world has nothing to do with the stupidity of religions- ALL RELIGIONS. I’m sure you have been brainwashed to the Muslim religions 72 Virgins upon death of a martyr & all the other nonsense. In the old Jewish religion is you are not a Jew you are to be treated as Cattle or animals. And all the other dumb crap some Religious Head came up with to control the sheep. Catholics with the notion of GOD in heaven watching down on you & ready to punish you at any wrongdoing is really moronic. But if u need something to worship- just as they planned- you go right ahead. And to believe someone who barely has a High School level of spelling- there is something called SPELL-CHECK- then I’m not concerned at all about what YOU think.
        Have a nice day. I wish you a happy life no matter what you believe or what I don’t believe.

        • Rachel Kenner

          I have a spelling disorder :). If people can understand what I’m trying to say I see no reason to spell things correctly, or use correct punctuation.
          It is a reflection of intelligence, but it can not show all of intellgence. Admittedly some of my cognitive abilltie are lacking ( for the life of me I can not tie nots ( don’t rember how to spell that).
          But I do find find it intreasting how many people won’t consider my opinions based on spelling. My intellgence in the area from where spelling comes from is rather low, but what about other types of intellgence?
          Not asking you to change your opinion on anything, just asking you to consider being slightly more open minded. No offense, I’m sure your pretty open minded in lots of areas.

          And another thing. Belive it or not, I’m a little harder to brainwash. Not saying I’m not though, I’ve probably been slightly brainwashed on certain matters.
          But realize it’s not just religions who do brain washing. Media, socaity, school system, and the government do this as well. Media ( showing who you should be, and how you should want to be). Socaity ( changing your opinions, sometimes without even considering them to fit in a group). School system ( they have control over the material given to the students, does not help suppress feelings of inferiority, teaches students how they should think, elvates certain standards of life, forces comptitivty). The goverment ( hides certain information well bringing attention to diffrent, maybe less important or skewed information). Not saying the world is like this, but I see no reason to belive it’s not. I find seeing how the world is with no error extremely difficult.
          I’m sorry for wasting your time. I just sometimes feel the need or disire to express my opinions, though I realize they are of little importance. I am a highschooler with poor grades and a lazy additude, so I can see why they are not worth considering.
          Enjoy life :). And thanks for the wishes.
          Again sorry for troubling you.

  • Paula

    I love this song. It crept right into the heart of me and I don’t feel that it is mocking God at all. I feel that Hozier is singing to the hypocrites found in every church, the people that know that they too are sinners but refuse to admit it. If they refuse to see their own sin then it is easier to point out everone elses. Yes the churches are full of people like that and people that do God’s judging for him. He is the all powerful holy one. Not us! Why so many of us take it upon ourselves to try and do God’s job for him is beyond me. We were meant to praise him and love each other. That is not what today’s church puts out there for the most part. I grew up in church and help found the one I left 5 years ago. I left because the pastor was allowed to have “Clay Feet” as he would say when he did something ugly or un Christ like. But when I fell from grace I wasn’t a true christian. Yeah ok 🙂 Well I have since found peace and rest in knowing that it is not up to my former church to help me feel God’s love, it is up to God because they have all turned away from me , but guess who didn’t? God is still as present in my life today as he was while I was sitting in a pew. God is so much greater than most churches teach him to be. He is loving and embracing and caring and that is what people need to know. We sit in pews and call it helping people, Jesus was in the trenches helping and healing people. Remember that 🙂

  • Luunad

    hahahahah lol.. worst interpretation ever! watch the music video and you’ll see that this song has nothing to do with his “girlfriend”. This song is about the discrimination of minorities. In this case of homosexual people that get discriminated by the conservative christian community.

  • cat

    I don’t think you have the true meaning of this song. “Shrine of your lies” “that’s a mighty looking high horse” To me it’s obviously about how the church doesn’t accept gays. More generally, about how the church says natural human behavior and desires (sexual) are shameful. It is very common for people to refer to the Church with female pronouns, so that doesn’t necessarily mean the lyrics are mentioning a literal female. I think that’s what makes the song so intriguing, because at a first glance you would think the song to be about a woman, but once you delve deeper into the lyrics, it’s something totally different.

  • Zhi Xuan Goh

    I cannot agree better, people in the world are so blind that they cannot even see or differentiate good and evil anymore. I feel even though we might like the rhythm but I feel we shouldn’t listen to this kind of song that mock our lord and saviour. Firstly because music has an effect on us if we hear it too many times. This might cause us to get brainwashed and might cause us to conform to the world. Secondly, Christ sacrificed his life for us we can’t even stop listening to a song that mocks him? I feel we should really devote our life to him since he died for us.

  • Sarah Coogan

    this is SO wrong. It is about gay marriage that is banned in the catholic church. “I was born sick”, “I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies”.. His “God” is not a woman, it is the church banning him from loving who he wants to love. Your “Christian Critique” proves just this; the message is not getting across.

  • SteveFiets

    This analysis is ridiculous. Watch the music video for this song. It was inspired after Russia past many extremely homophobic laws. It was also a response to the violence the LGBT community faces in many parts of America and elsewhere.

  • Rachel Kenner

    I’m not completely sure but I think there might be two versions with diffrent, identical, lyrics. I heard this version today and it seemed a lot diffrent from the one I usually hear.
    I think some of you are right about the statment about it being about homophobia. But also the lyrics up there suggest the poster of this is correct. Unless it was originally sung by girl, but I get the feeling it was sung by a guy.
    Based on that and the fact the word girl was used as the subject of the love. If we really want to understand this we will have to look more into it.

  • Rachel Kenner

    “My lover’s got humour
    She’s the giggle at a funeral
    Knows everybody’s disapproval”
    I just realized somthing, in my opinion this girl is kinda messed up. There is a few ways a can interpret this. 1 she is laughing during someone’s funrual, not getting with the mood. I would find this highly offensive if some one was doing that at one of my family members funeral ( most likely to the point of yelling at them to get out and punching them in the face). 2 she is making cracks at the doctrine. The problem with this is that the doctrine helps people have faith that their loved ones are in a better place. The girls comments are going to make the family members doubt wether their loved ones in a better place, or wether they will ever see them again. And again, it is rude. Making a family who has just lost a loved one suffer even more is just cruel.
    If this is what she’s doing then I’m surprised that she’s not getting more then disapproval. I don’t really see what else it could mean.

  • Ri

    When I first heard the song it troubled my inner spirit but I did like catchy tune and hoping someone will change the words a bit or at least follow up with the same style
    It’s the beat the haunting way the song plays

    Hopefully this style will be picked up by someone and add change the meaning to the one true God

  • Lamp of David

    I would think you folks should be more concerned about the Catholic Church (and Christendom in general) being under Satan’s control for not practicing the true Christianity that Jesus taught, instead of worrying about a silly song.

  • Joe

    Love the song, love the meaning.

  • Rachel Kenner

    I don’t know, it just seams kinda wierd. I think the music video and the lyrics convey diffrent messages. If their both men I think he would be referring to his boyfriend as a “he” and not a “she”.
    They are analyzing the lyrics, not the music video.

  • Rachel Kenner

    Ok, I looked it up. Saying it’s about homophobia wouldn’t truly be correct, beacuse the message is brooder. It’s about sexuality not being a sin.
    And still, that girls messed up. Funurals are not the places to make political statments.

  • Jake

    The fact that people are still getting worked up over imaginary friends baffles me.

    And for the record (no pun intended), Black Sabbath, Marilyn Manson, Slayer and not to mention Hozier, have made some of the best music in their respective fields. I think it’s time to ditch the ridiculous, childish crap that is religion and realise we’re not here for long, so fucking enjoy it.

    • Rachel Kenner

      It is true, we can all die tomorrow. We can lose every last one of are loved ones. We can suffer sever brain damage, become completely paralyzed, and suffer insanity.
      But what is childish about religion.
      Is it silly to pursue what makes us happy? Is it better to make our decisions based on what every one else thinks? Is it silly to belive in free agency? Every single person being equal? Is childish to belive hatred leads no where?

      No offense to you, but what I find childish of anyone is condemning a lifestyle you might not understand. Same could be said of myself, but I’m not looking to condemn, but to just ask for open mindedness.

      Not saying you don’t, but don’t insult things you don’t understand. I find nothing childish about a better world, and even if the gospel wasn’t true ( I know it to be true, but everyone is free to thier own belifes, even if they are singular) it offers a world without hate, and an increasment of joy.
      Are you saying we should deny a group of people the right to persue hapiness? You might see it as some of are members are doing that exact thing. But that comes from human imperfection and not from the system.
      How I see it is I can ethier think there is nothing after death or there is. The thought that there is an afterlife is comforting, so there no reason to belive there is nothing after life.
      I would argue, and you have the right to disagree, that the church teaches a lot of good standerds. To love everyone, to work hard, to strive every day to be a better person, to persue your happiness as well as the hapiness of others. Ultimately I think if we all lived like this the world would be a better place.

  • rockdovefarm

    Does the music industry have any intent other than making money? This song was such a sleeper hit, it’s hard to ascribe its success to promotion by the industry.
    Also, Marilyn Manson can hardly be described as overtly satanic. They had shock value to be sure but their music was mostly about the hypocrisy of the church, the inability to fit in society, and the narrow mindedness of the music industry(is if it, or you, don’t sound like something that already is a hit, then good luck getting a good contract). These are themes as old as music and religion.
    Wasn’t Jesus condemning the hypocrisy of the temple in Jerusalem? Doesn’t the bible talk about the difficulty (and rejection) of fitting in? Even John Mellancamp has talked at length about the music industry, and the way it changes the music that is played and heard in the US.

  • Cody

    What I got from it was his dissatisfaction with the way the church looks at Homosexuality. Watch the music video and you will see why I think this

  • Alec

    Perfect description of the way I felt about the song. Thought it was catchy and cool at first until I really listened, unbelievable…

  • Rora

    Pretty sure this is about the church’s rejection of homosexuality. Especially telling at the end “in the madness and soil of that sad earthly scene, only then I am human, only then I am clean.” Refers to a funeral…Means to me that LBGT people are only acknowledged when they commit suicide or are murdered. I havent seen the video but the lyrics are very sad.

  • Rora

    This whole conversation is basically why I converted to paganism.

  • Archeress

    I like this song. Watch a documentary called ‘Zeitgeist.’ It will enlighten you. No religion is perfect, not Islam, not Christianity, not paganism not Buddhism. We need to take the best of each and follow logic and what appeals to us. Philosophising about the purpose of life is interesting, but only theories can be put forward. No proof is given anywhere… We are basically just people on a pale blue dot floating silently in space and arguing on comments bars of aanything.

    • Sebastián

      Or just detroy them all………And just follow our common sense. Religion is the real big sickness of humanity.

  • tu puta

    Seriously…..I want to punch your fucking christian face

  • John Hill

    Song is just another check mark for Satan. The artist is already way down the slippery slope and helping to take the innocent and those who want to remain ignorant with him. His explanation confirms his blindness.

  • WannabeXenophile

    I just read the lyrics and while my analysis is nowhere near as comprehensive as yours, I did come to around about the same conclusions!
    Shame, as the lyricism from a secular POV is better than most chart songs, but the meaning is very sacrilegious and unsettling, especially considering its sound is initially hymn influenced. There’s no overlooking it – Vigilant Citizen and The AprilandWayneShow would have a field day with it. The photo of Hozier himself, well, the eyes have it … *shudders*

  • Ashton

    One part ofnyour analysis is wrong. Yiu got the lyrics wrong. Its not “my church offers no absolutes” it is in fact “my church offers no absolution” meaning his church doesnt offer “forgiveness” or “salvation”

  • Me

    Interesting. I thought is was about homosexuality though.

  • Paul

    Your analysis is completely wrong. Please watch the video and you will see what it’s about. It has nothing to do with original sin. “We were born sick, you heard them say it” is a direct blast at the Christian stance that homosexuality is sin…. if you send your life driving a section of humanity away from jesus because of the body parts of the person they love then you reap what you sow. It won’t take long for everyone else straight or gay to see it. And then that hatred leaches into areas you never expected… and I’m sorry but it was a well deserved testimant of the illness in the Christian faith that hatred and exclusion are a mantra under the idiotic guise of “love the sinner hate the sin”. You are at the threshold of a giant flushing of organized religion because you traded the gift of love for the absolutes of rejection. You morally justified your hatred as religion has done so many times in human history. Slavery, woman’s rights, interacial marriage. If your good book got these common sense issues wrong how long do you expect before people have just… had… enough. Shame the message was pure and humans twisted it and got it all wrong. Shame indeed.

  • ABIGAIL DEVARY

    Thank you. I found myself drawn to the arrangement and yet chills came over me as I heard the lyrics. I choose not to listen to it. I am still amazed at how everyone lauds this but seems to be confused about what it really means. Music has power and spirituality. I think it is worth the reminder, at least to those who will listen, to question the source of all spiritual experiences. Especially in music. Some of the most famous songs are also from the darkest places of the spirit. No matter what anyone says, the body and the spirit are intricately interconnected. It is a universal non-optional principle of existence. I appreciate your perspective. I sat down with my daughter to explain the meaning. Half way through she asked me not to read anymore. It was offensive to her and her relationship with the One who is mocked in this song.

  • msrowena

    You’ve missed the boat entirely in your analysis. It’s a “gay” song. Even the composer says that. You’re letting the pronoun references confuse you, but the “she” in the song is his real faith, as opposed to the false faith of the Catholic Church. The song is about a gay man being killed by parishioners who believe that’s what the Church would have them do. Look at the video, sinful as it may seem to you, and you’ll see this is so far removed from your interpretation. If you go looking for zebras, you’ll probably find them. If you go in search of understanding what the lyrics mean, as opposed to grinding them into what you thought they meant, you may see what’s he’s really saying. That said, you probably won’t like it. I’m from the other side of the aisle. I liked the song, but figured it was too “churchy” for me and not “real” enough. Surprise.

  • Ian

    Scary, he has no fear of God or the consequences of his actions? Maybe he ll change on his death bed – coward.

    • cosmicstresshead

      What a horrible sentiment.

      • Ian

        Whats more horribly despicable blasphemy or my comment? Us christians are faaaar too complacent about these things! Remember God is a God of love but he s also a God of anger, it s time we got a bit more outspoken about these things. Sorry if my comment upset u.

  • Justin

    Ok after all that im not sure cause I don’t understand. Is this song Take Me to Church, For or against the Catholic Religion?

  • Alyx

    Um, If you looked up any more about this you would know that he is referring to homosexuality, not a “girlfriend” …. “a dog at the shrine of your lies” is to be loyal like a dog, literally…obey your master even when he abuses you. Please look deeper than simple blasphemy….

  • Michelle

    I’m literally crying this is so funny.

  • rjl

    This song is more about falling in love in a scenario considered to be a sin. A sexual union between a married man and woman is one of the most holy of sacraments and any man or woman that is deeply in love with the other, knows the humbling power and depths of the consummation. In fact, it is a form of communion and the most beautiful way that a child can be conceived .

    There is rage against the Catholic Church in this song, this is true but where righteousness is practiced without love, mercy and compassion of which the Bible condemns, how do we expect people that fall to respect the Church? I believe that recognizing these emotions the song expresses should be acknowledged and used as guidance without judgment and condemnation.

  • Robin Hillyer-Miles

    I’ve been waiting for churches to start singing it like they do “Hallelujah” – which is about sex and unrequited love … if you pay attention to the lyrics! 😀

    It’s actually about a lesbian relationship and sexuality but the video shows it as a male gay one instead.
    And you are WAY off on your analysis of the lyrics – the girlfriend and their relationship is sometimes the church not your god in the lyrics, in other times he’s showing how the church really is, in the narrator’s opinion)

    My lover’s got humour
    She’s the giggle at a funeral (she’s the sunshine in the dark times)
    Knows everybody’s disapproval (she’s never been accepted because she’s different)
    I should’ve worshipped her sooner (I should have paid attention to her before this and accepted who I am)
    If the Heavens ever did speak (“If the Heavens ever” = revealed religion is cast into doubt – I’ll give you this one)
    She’s the last true mouthpiece (she speaks the truth in a world of lies)
    Every Sunday’s getting more bleak (church doesn’t do it for me anymore)
    A fresh poison each week (preachers yelling and folks telling you how horrid you are, trying to get you to change to something that you are not)
    “We were born sick”, you heard them say it (they are homosexuals)
    My church offers no absolutes (you don’t have to stay strict and follow the narrow path, there’s more out there to see and experience and still be morally sound)
    She tells me “worship in the bedroom” (where does one feel more spiritual or more loved than during sex?)
    The only heaven I’ll be sent to
    Is when I’m alone with you (you make me feel whole)
    I was born sick, but I love it (acknowledges homosexuality and accepts it)
    Command me to be well (a reference to Christ commanding people to be well in the Gospels well, yes, but in this instance, she’s telling her that she’s fine as she is, it’s okay to be herself instead of listening to those who say she’s sick for being gay)

    [Pre-Chorus]
    Amen, Amen, Amen (sarcasm, sarcasm, sarcasm)

    [Chorus] (x2)
    Take me to church (remember, “Church” here is sexual reference in this song – nope, sorry, this is a pure dig at church and the beliefs of the fellowship)
    I’ll worship like a dog at the shrine of your lies (dogs love those that feed and house them, they are obedient)
    I’ll tell you my sins so you can sharpen your knife (confession reference – ummm maybe in a way, but it’s also saying, I’ll come to you with who I am and you will ridicule me, holler at me, and be a horrible person to me because I’m gay and you think it is vile because of your belief system)
    Offer me that deathless death (the only thing the church promises is life after death, deathless death)
    Good God, let me give you my life (he hands over his life to her the “god” – nope, he’s being sarcastic, since the church wants you for life and she’s refusing the deathless death )

    [Verse 2]
    If I’m a pagan of the good times (I love this line)
    My lover’s the sunlight (she’s my happiness, she’s shown me the light)
    To keep the Goddess on my side (the god/girlfriend is also a goddess – nope, hello, she just said the girlfriend is the sunlight, this is turning the phrase God to Goddess to show there are many religions and many Gods – other religions are just as bad)
    She demands a sacrifice (here’s where the song gets “Eucharistic” with reference to sacrificial meal and hunger… – kinda the rest of the lines are about sacrifice and what the church and or all religions demand)
    Drain the whole sea
    Get something shiny
    Something meaty for the main course (these three are about what religions are after – and what they will do to get it)
    That’s a fine looking high horse (religious people look down their noses to those who don’t fit their mold or share their beliefs)
    What you got in the stable? (reference to the Christ Child “in the stable” – Maybe but also reflects the church going around and taking food and animals from the stables – taking from the faithful and non-faithful)
    We’ve a lot of starving faithful (the church says it does good but look at all the starving poor AND/OR, they are faithful but they are starving for truth and can’t see without blinders of faith)
    That looks tasty
    That looks plenty
    This is hungry work (this is sarcasm in that the church is always hungry for more tithes, more tax free benefits from the government, more followers)

  • total kaos dana n kev 4 ever

    so by saying this song is bad you feel it is proper to feel ashamed that you love to have sex with the one you love? what would be the sense of having sex and creating life if you should feel ashamed before after and during?

  • Sebastian Almazan

    Just about the dame as vegetarians…

    If somebody does not believe in god, you Just want to convince him/her dont you?, but ohhh!!! If someone, anyone, tries to tell you their believes or explain their religion or non- religion or their tought about it, its wrong isnt it?

    Every religion in the World tells other religions that they are pagan or something like it… And their god is the only one and snuff, fuck, Just let people believe in whatever they want to believe.

    Want respecto and freedom? Respecto the choice of others…
    And yes, i compared religion with vegetarians

  • Abc

    From what Hozier has said about the song, we know that many of the metaphors drawn out in the lyrics above are incorrect interpretations. That being said, your last line completely captures the message, and leads me to think that through research you found exactly what he meant. That being, of course, that gnostic theology steals away our humanity and that tangible, worldly love (represented by his description of his relationship with “she”) is what we really crave. That, to a Christian, is surely blasphemous.

    Also, just to be clear:
    Hozier is Irish, not American, and he and first presented this song to a small independent label in Dublin. The American music industry is not ‘cleverly’ attacking Christianity, and wasn’t even involved until Hozier was already incredibly popular. He became popular because he went viral, presumably because the song has a beautiful tune, lyrics that cut deep, and a heart wrenching and socially relevant music video. And in case anyone was wondering, the music video depicted some of the (then) recent hate crimes against LGBT youths in Russia that were inspired by religious zealotry.

  • Angel

    It’s sad you missed the whole message of the song. It’s about hypocrisy and the teachings in Christianity, more specifically, the Catholic Church. Now , before I go further, let me state I was baptized Catholic and continue to be an active participant however, with my eyes, mind, and heart open. The song basically is stating in one breath to love humanity in its entirety as did/does Christ then in the next breath condemns those who don’t conform to its teachings, basically that homosexuality is a sin. Are we all God’s children or are we not? Are not those of a different sexual orientation open to God’s love or are they not? It’s the hypocrisy referenced in the song that’s blasphemous, not the song. The song is merely an attempt to open eyes.

  • Kiki

    I think the main reason why I don’t like this song is because he misunderstood the concept of Christianity. If someone is TRULY a Christian, then to them it’s not just some “religion” but a relationship with them and Jesus. And this dude…..I feel like he’s kinda making fun of us. He’s taking scriptures out of context…intentionally. Sure, do whatever you want, it’s your art man…..but did you really HAVE to make it specifically about the Catholic or Christian church? Church is fun for me. I get to hang out with my friends and family and relax in a safe place…and he completely mucks it up by replacing God with sex. I get it, sex is good, but why is EVERY SINGLE SONG about it? And why bring RELIGION into it? It just doesn’t make sense ya know? -Kiki

  • Racheal Smith

    No, it’s about getting criticized over sexual orientation because of “religion”. People say that it’s a sin to be gay or bi. That’s what this song is about.

  • Janet

    With all due respect, I love the song and if there is a God out there, that God wouldn’t have created sex if it were a sin. Why would a good god create a mix of good and bad. It doesn’t make sense. And the guy loves the woman he sings to and he has sex with her and he worships her. Seriously where is the so called sin???

  • A Roman Catholic

    I am curious why each religious stream thinks and preaches that their teachings and beliefs should supersede others. Isn’t God about love, understanding, forgiveness and compassion to others? How can anyone presume to sit in judgement of another persons’s actions, especially in the name of God. I seriously doubt that there are any humans who have not had some instruction on their cultural and religious beliefs as children, either through their caregivers or teachers. We may all have similar experiences but our thoughts, and emotions are uniquely our own and as adults we should be able to make our own choices and have the courage to live with them without a barrage of criticism. Actions have consequences and whether we believe in the hereafter or not, our personal choices are just that, personal.

  • Joe Brennan

    The meaning of the song is to not be ashamed of your God given primal sexual instinct just because you were guilt ridden from a young age that sex is dirty and evil. That it is beautiful to have sex, though as a Catholic, there is no escape from the guilt since you were brainwashed since birth, even after you realize that you were brainwashed you will always have that guilt somewhere deep inside you, and yet you will still sooner or later follow that instinct like a moth to the light, and as much as you try to pretend that you have let go of that guilt it will always be there somewhere haunting you.

  • kate

    I was brought up Catholic and am disgusted by the hypocrites in the church. The church forgives the perverts who call themselves priests while 35 years ago I fell in love with my soul mate and we were denied marriage.? Because he was divorced. So we married, have 3 wonderful sons, who the Catholic Church would not baptize, as they told me they were illegitimate as we were not married in the church. When I asked the Monsignor if he thought Jesus would refuse to baptize my sons he said..this is not about Jesus, this is about the church. So I think love large, love your family and love and live God the way He meant us to, not through the Catholic Church. It’s a shame. Yeah…Take me to church! Any day of the week!

  • Brian Lennon

    You people are so small minded. It’s just sad. If you were taught that unicorns existed a thousand years ago you would believe it.

  • Ignatius Fahmi

    totally he is satan worshiper.

  • Quentin Tartock

    The lyrics for line #14 are “We were born sick, but I love you.” Not love ‘it’, but ‘you’.

  • Larry Ganz

    When he refers to his lover being the sunlight I felt he was referring to Satan also called the morning star who Formley masqueraded as the sun God ra. I feel as thought he’s referring to his newfound faith which is satanism all the while mocking Christians.. And I could see his disenchantment, I mean if I were raised Catholic I’d feel as though I’d been fed many many lies. Makes sense. This song is about
    self indulgence.. The very idea behind satanism

  • Susan Schneider

    You are so right about that song. I liked it at first but then my 12 year old great granddaughter said to me, Gran let me tell you what this is about. Wow, she got it right away, don’t know how but she did. Good kid.

  • Julie W

    Perhaps the songs universal transcendance is our underlying disenchantment with the powers that be… goverment and religion, “the rules” and the shame amd judgement inflicted on us if we do not conform.
    I personally believe in a God of Love so strong that he gave His only Son to show us a better way… to live the ultimate example.. one of unconditional Love for our fellow man. Giving us always free will as we chose from the begining…knowledge of good and and evil and the cost of making selfish choices that eventually lead to the death of Love in our souls. However humanity and its ego and relentless need for power and control in every segement of society instead of surrendering our selfish choices made outside of the power of His Love.

  • Robert Matthew Brown

    I was born sick and commanded to be well. It is pretty horrible isn’t it.

  • Footballgirl56

    He’s right. That is the reason this song is so popular. He’s brilliant! The song is about sex, the best part of our humanity. You are way off base with your take on the song. If you have an issue with your original ideas on what you say are ‘the wrong values’ you may become apoplectic with what he is really saying. You should watch the video of the song as well as the video of him explaining his reasons for the song. The Church should keep it’s antiquated ideas to themselves and quit messing up the hearts and desires of humanity.

  • Rosie WIlliamson

    The song isn’t about catholics, its about being gay. “We were born sick”, you heard them say it
    If you watch the video it makes a lot more sense

  • WhyDoYouCare

    Omg!!!!!! and the comments just keep coming.

    Dr Marshall what have we got here? You seem to be hiding…

  • Randa6

    I like your interpretation. It is essentially what I thought but not knowing anything of Catholicism, it’s nice to have it explained. Thanks!

  • CherylAnn

    Too bad. Anyone can twist any perspective any way they choose. Having church shopped /visited most of my 50+ years, sorry to say some of the sickest, most hopeless, suffering I’ve ever seen.

    These lyrics (from my perspective) reveal what I’ve witnessed over & over.

  • LogicAl1

    You are so far off it hurts. If it makes Christians feel better to believe that this is the meaning, go for it, but he’s pretty clear that it’s not just about the old catholic church.

  • Sister

    I agree with your summation. God help us!

  • Mmm

    Im sorry but I think tou should just rely on the meaning by Hozier himself. You cant give new meaning to his song. Its great song and I agree with the message of his song.

  • different viewpoint

    the song isn’t an attack on christianity. it’s saying that she “the church” is not accepting of different sexual orientations.
    “i was born sick, but i love it”
    can be translated to
    “i was born gay, but i love it”

  • KD

    I thought God was supposed to be the only judge? While you’re christian self is knocking Catholics?
    I think anyone who loves God is awesome. Isn’t that the point of our lives? To love GOD, Be KIND and not judge others?