Has Russia Been Consecrated by the Pope? Arguments from both sides

Has Russia been consecrated to the Immaculate Heart as the Blessed Mother asked at Fatima? This has become a controversial topic since June 26, 2000. I guest-hosted Drew Mariani’s Catholic radio show on Relevant Radio on Friday afternoon and at the end of the show we discussed Pope Francis’ consecration of the world to Mary’s Immaculate Heart on October 13, 2013 (Deo gratias!).

Not surprisingly, we had a few callers call in with questions about the Third Secret and the Consecration of Russia. Let’s take a look at the history of papal consecrations to the Immaculate Heart.

Has Russia Been Consecrated by the Pope

Has Russia Been Consecrated?

As a reminder, here is the text of the words of Our Lady regarding the consecration of Russia to her heart:

To prevent this, I shall come to ask for the consecration of Russia to my Immaculate Heart, and the Communion of reparation on the First Saturdays. If my requests are heeded, Russia will be converted, and there will be peace; if not, she will spread her errors throughout the world, causing wars and persecutions of the Church. The good will be martyred; the Holy Father will have much to suffer; various nations will be annihilated. In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me, and she shall be converted, and a period of peace will be granted to the world.”

Mary says the Holy Father will consecrate Russia to her and Russia will be converted. Several Popes have consecrated “the world” to Mary. Debate centers on whether consecrating “the world” counts for consecrating “Russia.”

List of Papal Consecrations to the Immaculate Heart

There have been at least 7 consecrations by Popes to the Immaculate Heart:

1) On October 31 1942, Pope Pius XII performed the Consecration to the Immaculate Heart of Mary for the entire world.

2) On July 7 1952, Pope Pius XII consecrated the Peoples of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary by his apostolic letter Sacro Vergente Anno. Pius XII stated:

Just as a few years ago We consecrated the entire human race to the Immaculate Heart of the Virgin Mary, Mother of God, so today We consecrate and in a most special manner We entrust all the peoples of Russia to this Immaculate Heart.”

3) On November 21, 1964 Pope Paul VI renews, in the presence of the Fathers of the Vatican Council but without their participation, the consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart.

4) On May 13, 1982 Pope John Paul II invites the bishops of the world to join him in consecrating the world and with it Russia to the Immaculate Heart. Many do not receive the invitation in time for the Pope’s trip to Fatima, where he accomplishes the consecration. Sr. Lucia later says it did not fulfill the conditions.

5) In October 1983 Pope John Paul II, at the Synod of Bishops, renews the 1982 Consecration.

6) On March 25, 1984 Pope John Paul II, “united with all the pastors of the Church in a particular bond whereby we constitute a body and a college,” consecrates “the whole world, especially the peoples for which by reason of their situation you have particular love and solicitude.”

On August 29, 1989 Sr. Lucia affirms in correspondence that the consecration of Russia “has been accomplished” and that “God will keep His word.”

Subsequent events:
November 9, 1989 Fall of the Berlin Wall
December 25, 1991 Dissolution of the Union of Soviet Socialist Republics
July 26, 2000 Third Secret of Fatima revealed by Cardinals Bertone and Ratzinger

7) On October 13, 2013, Pope Francis consecrates the world to the Immaculate Heart.

Has Russia been consecrated properly?

Despite these distinct consecrations of the world by Popes (one mentioning Russia), people still debate whether Russia has been specifically consecrated as per the instructions of the Blessed Virgin Mary at Fatima.

Here are both sides of the debate.

Those who say Russia has not been properly consecrated, point to two problems:

1) The Popes have not consecrated “Russia” specifically in union with the bishops. It is granted that the world has been consecrated and that Russia belongs to the world. Russia has been consecrated as part of the collective of nations, but not specifically. It’s the difference between a priest blessing a congregation in which you are present and the priest blessing you specifically by name.

2) Russia is far from being “converted” as Mary promised would happen if the consecration were made. If Russia were duly consecrated, wouldn’t she be converted and wouldn’t we be living in “a period of peace granted to the world” as promised by Mary? Since Russia has not yet converted and since we are not in a period of peace, the consecration of Russia, they say, has not happened.

Those that say Russia has been consecrated, point to two proofs:

1) Sister Lucia stated that the consecration of Russia was accomplished by the action of John Paul II on March 25, 1984. If anyone knew, it was Sister Lucia – she received the message from Mary.

Pope John Paul II and Sister Lucia

Sister Lucia with Blessed John Paul II

2) The Holy See, at the revelation of the Third Secret on June 26, 2000, indicated that the consecration had been accomplished. Sister Lucia, it seems, expressed her agreement.

As you can see, those that allege that Russia has not been properly consecrated must say that Sister Lucia, the recipient of Mary’s message, was either wrong, deceived, or performing some sort of mental reservation to deceive everyone on the matter. One must also say that Cardinal Ratzinger, the future Pope Benedict XVI, used extended mental reservation to deceive the world in this matter on June 26, 2000 and ever since.

On the other hand, it sure doesn’t look like Russia has been “converted” as Our Lady promised.

No matter where you stand, remember that we the laity have our own “Fatima responsibility” – to pray the Rosary daily and keep the First Saturdays devotion. For me personally, the “Russia question” must include the laity’s embrace of the Rosary and true devotion to Mary. She desires that our hearts be consecrated to the Sacred Heart through her Immaculate Heart.

Question: It’s your turn to weigh in. Be kind in the comment box. Have you read much about this debate? Where do you stand? You can leave a comment by clicking here.

PS: We have reopened enrollment in the New Saint Thomas Institute for online courses in Theology and Philosophy. Please learn more about what we offer: newsaintthomas.com

NSTI ad

Download My Book for Free
Thomas Aquinas in 50 Pages
Over 15,000 copies downloaded! This is a quick and easy way to learn the basic philosophy and theology of Saint Thomas Aquinas. The Popes of the last 300 years have endorsed St Thomas Aquinas. Learn more through this accessible resources. Download it for free.

Comments Policy: I reserve the right to delete comments that are offensive or off-topic. If your comment contains a hyperlink to another site, your comment automatically goes into "Comments Purgatory" where it waits for release by way of moderation.

  • David L Alexander

    Those who say that Russia has not been properly consecrated maintain that Sister Lucia was an impostor, and the real one was locked up somewhere. They also expect things to happen right away; on their time, and not God’s. Communism has fallen in Russia, but three generations of a people who have lived without any form of moral compass, can hardly expect to transform overnight.

    • James Kohn

      other then the sedevantists…I dont think you can say they believe in the impostor theory. And I wouldnt agree that communism has really fallen in Russia it seems more like a shell game, and Russia and China are again forming the same alliance that will be stronger then before because we in the US are beholden to the debt we foolishly took on. Plus I dont think its beyond possible for God to convert a nation in a short period, even instantly…consider the conversions of the people at Fatima from the miracle there. Just a thought

      • James Finn

        “. . . shell game. . .”

        Well said! This “communism is dead” rhetoric is dangerous talk indeed. A slight of hand trick right out of Saul Alinsky’s handbook.

        • David L Alexander

          A few thoughts in response:

          1) Fr Nicholas Gruner is no sedevacantist, and he has been known to promote the imposter theory.

          2) I was pretty clear that Russia had a ways to go, even after the fall of the Soviet Union (which is a matter of record, and far from a “shell game”). The alliance with China only reinforces my contention.

          3) To identify my claim with Saul Alinsky is quite a stretch, as I am hardly an apologist for him, and nothing I wrote would even remotely suggest that. Yes, communism fell. No, Russia’s not out of the woods. As to Russia’s conversion, it is obviously a work in progress. On God’s time, not ours.

          • James Kohn

            thanks for the thoughts…I have yet to see Fr. Gruners promotion of this theory…do you have a link or anything for this? Thanks!
            btw I just dont buy into the whole russia is no longer communist, names change practice remains the same, application can change as well, just a thought

          • James Finn

            Dear David,

            My comment was directed towards the rhetoric in general, and was not intended to paint you personally as an Alinsky apostle. It is the rhetoric itself, however, that is “Alinsky-ish”.

            To be clear, a popular rhetorical ploy, of which you again make us, either intentionally or unintentionally, is to focus on the dissolution of the objective structure of the USSR. This rhetoric is “slight of hand” in that it is, by deliberate design, intended to distract us from the proliferation and implementation of subjective communist political philosophies and policies by the highest powers in the West.

            You can not dispute that Communists have assumed direct and unchallenged control over our national systems of government, education and information (i.e. media) in the advancement of a deliberate and preplanned agenda that dates back to the 1920’s.

            The words of Our Lady:

            “. . .if not, [Russia] will spread her errors throughout the world. . .”

            The “errors” are spreading as we speak. Will you deny it?

          • David L Alexander

            “Alinsky-ish”? Sorry, I don’t get it.

            That the Soviet Union dissolved, and that Russia is no longer under the rule of the Communist party, is a matter of history, one that can be verified. It is fact. It is data. It is not “slight of hand.” Having said that, one could argue (as Pat Robertson has) that the Communist era itself, and its takeover of Eastern Europe, was simply the latest manifestation of the old Russian empire. The current regime can be seen in that context, and so a continuity between “the fall of communism” and the present can be reconciled.

            As to the infiltration of communists, or those with socialist leanings, into various segments of our society, that began long before the current presidential administration. What we are seeing now is only its fruition. Yes, Russia has “spread her errors throughout the world.” They could continue to spread, even in the wake of a regime change therein.

          • James Finn

            It’s hard to relay precision via these forums.

            All I’m sayin’, the oft repeated mantra, “communism is dead”, you hear it everywhere, from everyone. Conservatives say it to plug Reagan, Catholics say it to plug JP II. Everyone is marching to the beat of this drum, and the left is lovin’ it. They too repeat this mantra – they say it with their right hand, while their left hand “spreads errors”. (This is what I mean by “sleight-of-hand”)

            Research the Frankfurt School, Herbert Marcuse, Antonio Gramsci. There is a paper trail that leads from the Soviet Kremlin, directly to DC. The Soviets are flourishing. So, the USSR collapsed, removing Communism from the visible stage; but their influence is stronger than ever, albeit covertly.

            You lost me with this Pat Robertson stuff. The Bolsheviks overthrew the Russian czars. A new power rose, and overthrew the other. The Soviets annihilated the old Russian oligarchy in an unprecedentedly bloody and merciless revolution. Indeed, the new Russian regime can accurately be characterized as an unholy alliance between capitalists and Soviets, but the similarity you draw between this and the change of power which took place in 1917 is dubious.

          • marcin

            Fr. Gruner never promoted such outlandish theory so stop spreading rumors that lead to more disinformation.

          • Kirk Hansen

            Fr. Gruner denied the impostor theory and posted a video specifically to that topic on his YouTube channel.

      • Cathy Ceigersmidt

        Very much in agreement with James. I in no way believe Sr. Lucia was an imposter…concecration must be a mutual experience, the laity have to be open to God’s grace. The consecration may have occurred on some level, but its effects have yet to be realized until enough people accept it.

    • babs

      Remember Our Lady of Guadalupe? The bishop obeyed Our Lady and when he did the conversion of the Aztecs was miraculous, 8,000,000 Aztecs converted in 10 years. The priests could not keep up with the baptisms and there was no miracle of the sun with this apparition. Imagine the miraculous undeniable transformation of this world once the consecration is fulfilled. It will be totally breath taking!! The Mother of God does not disappoint, but we must cooperate.

    • Jerry

      “Those who say that Russia has not been properly consecrated maintain that Sister Lucia was an impostor, and the real one was locked up somewhere”

      While I don’t doubt that the above claim applies to some, I know many people who argue that the consecrations do not fulfill the Blessed Virgin’s request and have never even suggested that there was an impostor posing as Sr. Lucia: only that there is no credible evidence that Sr. Lucia ever validated the consecration of 1984 (i.e., that lies were being told using the name of an obedient servant of God who was forbidden to speak out on the matter – a very different claim).

      • David L Alexander

        Sister Lucia was asked specifically by the late Édouard Cardinal Gagnon if the conditions were fulfilled. She answered him directly, and in the affirmative. The cardinal related this to a priest of the Arlington Diocese shortly after it occurred. That same priest recently recounted the story in a homily.

        Considering that private revelations, even those with approval, are never binding on the faithful, this should be sufficient. If it is not, then for the reason given, it does not matter in the strict sense. To believe otherwise would be to maintain that the revelation is binding, and as has been indicated here, it is not.

        • Jerry

          Are you saying that the only evidence supporting the claim that Sr. Lucia affirmed that the consecration occurred is a second-hand account of a conversation that was not related publicly until after both parties to the alleged conversation were deceased?

          The second paragraph of your response makes no sense.

    • Chyrysanthemum

      It is now ten months later 8/14. What is Russia doing now or better still, where is Putin heading next in his conquests? Don’t kid yourself. There is no peace out there. Sister Lucia was silenced at one point. The message revealed that the Pope would die in Israel and there would be much bloodshed. Pope John Paul II was shot in 1982 and they used that incident to say that the “message has been fulfilled”. NOT!!! And if the consecration was fulfilled, where is the era of peace Our Lady promised? I don’t see any peace out there, do you?

  • Cathy Ceigersmidt

    Doesn’t there need to be a joint consecration of the world to Mary’s Immaculate Heart by all of the Catholic bishops along with the Pope? From what I have read, therein lies the problem, because some of the world’s bishops have not and continue to defy or neglect this crucial necessity for conversion and peace.

    • David L Alexander

      If you can’t take Sister Lucia’s words for it (and she saw the vision, and to my knowledge, no one here did), who would you believe?

      • James Kohn

        I think some people question whether it was Lucias words to begin with. To my knowledge her own sister was saying things contrary about what Lucia supposedly said about the consecration in 84 according to certain questionable cardinals. From what I have seen of those that question the consecration its really not about what Lucy said or didnt say but what the Cardinals put forth as Her words. But thats my understanding of the arguement

        • James Finn

          Excellent observation. Sr. Lucia was a cloistered nun. Her words only come to us by way of the Curia, for better or worse.

          • David L Alexander

            What do you expect a cloistered nun to do, call a press conference? Her access to the public is no different from any other cloistered nun. The Church is handling this as they would other similar incidents.

      • Jerry

        You are being disingenuous, David. The issue is not that people don’t believe Sr. Lucia; it is the credibility of the claim that Sr. Lucia affirmed the validity of the consecration.

        • David L Alexander

          Speak for yourself, Jerry. Is there anyone in this forum who can prove that Sister Lucia did not say what Cardinal Gagnon claimed? That’s where the burden is, not on those who will take the word of someone who was there.

    • Jerry

      The request was for their to be a joint consecration of Russia, not the world, to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. It was revealed to Sr, Lucia that the consecrations of the world did not count — that Russia had to be mentioned by name. The lack of participation by all of the Catholic bishops was another deficiency.

  • Xenabobb

    To say that Russia has not been converted and therefore must not have been properly consecrated would be presumptuous at best and arrogant at worst. Conversion does not always happen immediately – and indeed, usually does not. There was no timetable given for conversion.

    • Carmelo Fallace

      The Mother of Jesus has asked that the pope with the bishops of the world do the consecration of Russia, not the world, which words don’t we understand, Russia, consecration, or bishops. It does not seem it was done as Mary, the mother of God has asked. How the conversion of 10 billion people is done, is not for us to know at this time.

  • Maria

    I do not favour laity who cause confusion and scandal. If the Vatican says that the consecration has been done, let us exercise obedience and support rather than show the world how divided and “intelligent” some of us think to be on such serious matters. As you rightly point out, the Berlin Wall has fallen. Communism has dissolved in Russia, and Pope Emeritus would not lie.
    We say of our Protestant brothers and sisters that they take things too literally, and now it appears that some of us are doing the same in contest with the Vatican who have charge over this matter.

    • Jerry

      What Pope has confirmed the consecration was completed? What are you referring to with the statement “Pope Emeritus would not lie”?

      Contra, it is my understanding that Pope Benedict made a statement that suggested it had not, after which the officials of the curia who had been arguing it had suddenly fell silent on the matter.

      • Maria

        I refer to the book, ‘The Last Secret of Fatima’ written by Cardinal Tarcision Bertone which has a foreward written by Pope Benedict XVI. In the foreward B16 addresses Cardinal Bertone:’The conversations between the seer, the last survivor of the three little shepherds and you, the bishop sent by the pope, were not only an important ascertainment of the truthfulness of the events but also an opportunity for for you to become acquainted with Sr Lucia’s transparent soul…'(p x). He vouches for the truthfulness of the account which Cardinal Bertone gives. There are no two ways to understand this – either Pope Emeritus B16 and Card. Bertone are truthful or they are not.

        The book addresses the 3rd secret and whether Sr. Lucia ever wrote another secret. She did not write any other secret. (p 64). Regarding whether consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, Sr. Lucia tells Cardinal Bertone that the consecration was already performed in 1984 and it was accepted by Heaven (p 56). If any person is going to say that Cardinal Bertone WROTE falsehoods, conjured up words or made misrepresentations – I think that they are saying that Pope Emeritus B16 and Cardial Bertone were using false, conjured up words and misrepresenting Sr. Lucia. Pope Emeritus was a most accurate man and went to extraordinary pains to be accurate in what he said. If he vouched for the truthfulness of Cardinal Bertone’s account as well as the truthfulness of his accounts with Sr. Lucia, then I think it would be foolish to say by implication or directly, that Pope Emeritus B16 and the Cardinal were not telling the truth. The book makes it very clear that the secret was entirely revealed and the consecration was done. To conclude otherwise, leads to accusations of dishonesty of the people making the statements that they are making.

  • RobinJeanne

    One thing I don’t understand is if the Popes knew that She asked for russia to be concecrated, why didn’t the popes simply comply, why did they make the disision the “concecrate the world) to her Immaculate Heart??? Why not have done Russia (as she asked) then if they wanted or felt moved to, concecrate the world? It would have saved decades of debates… Wouldn’t it?

    • James Kohn

      …perhaps an attempt not to offend the Orthodox? Many in the Church dont want to push the Orthodox to accept Catholic doctrine…convenience? Im just happy Pope Francis took this step, its a good start to his papacy

      • Benjamin

        Consecrating another Christian to Immaculate Heart Of Mary.. How dare you, cheeky roman Pope! Oh really? Very offensive, indeed!

    • David L Alexander

      They have complied. Sister Lucia has said so, eyewitnesses have testified to this, and the conversion of Russia that is to follow is on God’s timetable, not ours.

      • Jerry

        What eyewitnesses other than Édouard Cardinal Gagnon, whom you mentioned in a previous response? In his case, a private recounting of the incident to a single individual, who apparently (going by your explanation) did not publicly reveal this until after both parties to the conversation were deceased and no longer able to confirm or deny the account. Hardly “testifying”.

        • David L Alexander

          Is there anyone in this forum who can prove that Sister Lucia did not say what Cardinal Gagnon claimed? Nah, didn’t think so. I’m out.

  • Patricia

    Communism has been defeated there, personal conversion is another story, free will still prevails . I think we shouldn’t put things in our human timeline, and tap our foot to God, expecting instant results . Its the big picture that counts, and its Gods’ picture, not ours.

  • Dan

    I see the fall of the Soviet Union as significant. A significant tie-in is that Pope John Paul II gave a rousing speech in his native Poland which precipitated the fall of communist Russia. There errors do not seem to spreading through the world. As far as I know, the world is becoming less communistic, though some worry about lite European socialism affecting Western nations, including the U.S.

    Regarding the conversion of Russia: they are not Catholic, but has there not been a resurgence of religious faith in their native Orthodoxy? Do they not pray to our Lady? Would this not please her? Perhaps the message of Fatima is not the exclusive property of the Roman Catholic Church. As ecumenism continues, we can always pray for full reconciliation of East and West.

    I certainly do not mean to demean those who think the consecration hasn’t happened. But I think their view is a little bit narrow. There does seem to be evidence of a change in Russia, beginning with the fall of the Soviet Union.

    • My suspicion is that God will convert to the Russians to Catholicism and they will rule the world and protect the Church – not America.
      Godspeed,
      Taylor

      • Joel

        Taylor, edit this and let people know about the rosary and chotki image…

      • Dan

        I could see that. Archbishop Fulton J. Sheen once gave a talk on the strengths of the Russian character, which communism was hurting. They take stands on some issues that the U.S. is currently waffling on. I am a big hoper in the reunion of East and West, including Canterbury. I also would like to see an influx of Jews in the Church so that we may benefit from their experience and wisdom with Yahweh.

      • Graciela

        I am a scholar of Russian Language. I visited Russia prior, during and after the fall of the USSR. I know many young people there and see the conversion at work. People in Russia are not afraid now to explore and express their Christian faith. The Russian Orthodox faith is historically close to Catholicism in that Vladimir the Great was baptized in 988, before the Great Schism. Russia entered Christianity under the mantle of the One True Church which was still whole then. The Russians have great devotion to the Mother of God. Will Russia one day acknowledge it’s Catholic roots. I have hope. One example that fuels that hope is the work of 2 priests in the

      • Maria

        A little hard to rule the world when the women in Russia average 1.2 children unlike USA who is still producing average of 2. Russia is hemorrhaging people.

    • The Truth Will Set You Free

      Actually, I would disagree with the statement that the errors of Russia don’t spread. Coming from communist Poland, I can assure you that what I see is drastically happening around the world, especially in the so called developed world, is for me a deja vu that grows bigger and bigger every day. Even if those happenings are not communistic in name, they are communistic in essence.

      • Dan

        That may be the case. I would certainly value your testimony over mine! Can you please elaborate on “communistic in essence.”

        • The Truth Will Set You Free

          1. Most important, abortion on demand.
          2. Spreading the welfare system, making people dependant on the government and lazy (we used to say loosely translated: if you stand or if you lay, you entitled to a pay).
          3. Make the them addicted (in Poland it was alcohol)
          4. Mass media propaganda and lies. At the end most will believe it.
          5. Destroy morale and family by making women work (my mother had to work Mo-Sa. Sunday was for laundry. I went to school 6 days a week, too.
          7. Corruption in the health care system. The socialized health care was for nothing. One had to pay under the table the nurses, the doctors and the carers.
          8. Faith is bad, especially if it is a Catholic faith.

          I could go on an on an on. I left Poland as a young woman in 1981 to escape the dictatorship. Now in my fifties, I am making full circle.

          • Kathy

            Thank you for sharing you personal testimony. You outlined the path our country has undeniably has chosen including a one world order. At every given opportunity, the belief in God is branded as evil, not necessary and illegal to promote or practice openly. If people don’t see what you so clearly articulated as a first hand account of the spread of Communism, we as a nation are in serious trouble. The spread is happening now. Open up your eyes.

    • judethom

      You are so correct. Russia has already been converted. Our Lady has appeared to the Orthodox, to its monks and nuns and she has also worked miracles through many icons. The salvation of Christianity shall come from the East.

  • Joel

    Most of what I know comes from you over beers…

  • James Finn

    Let’s try to use dispassionate reasoning here, everyone – a sensitive topic indeed.

    As regards your list of Papal Consecrations, and specifically No. 6 above, for the sake of argument, there are those who contend that your translation of the original Italian of Pope JP II is a little loose. Where you have:

    “. . . the whole world, especially. . .”

    the translation is in fact more accurate as a full stop, and then the start of a new sentence. Literally:

    “Enlighten especially the peoples of which you yourself are awaiting our consecration.”

    Thereby drastically changing the semantics of your translation. There are those who contend, that he effects a world consecration, and then immediately thereafter prays for those who “are awaiting our consecration.”

    I don’t know what to think, but it is unfair to dismiss those who adopt the “Gruner” position as extremists, thereby adopting the rhetoric of the left. We are all Catholics!

  • Kim Michaud

    I most definitely believe that Russia has been consecrated. Certainly the affirmations from Sr. Lucia and Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI are conclusive. Personally, my spirit was also reminded of this when Putin stepped out to condemn the persecution of Christians, and also established moral norms supporting marriage between a man and a woman. God accomplishes His plan in His own timing.

    • James Kohn

      Did Benedict as Pope or John Paul II specifically claim they knew as pontiffs that for sure the matter was closed? Just wondering? I know JPII once said he thought it was done

    • Jerry

      Please elaborate on the affirmation by Pope Emeritus Benedict XVI you have cited.

  • Benjamín

    It is sad that there are catholics that are more popish than the Pope. Didn’t God Himself say, “Before they call I will answer; while they are still speaking I will hear.” I trust God in all his divine intelligence and kindness accepted the consecration of Russia and the whole world.

  • James Kohn

    from what I have read from those who question the consecration it seems they dont really question Lucy herself, rather they question the people that carried the statements and made them public..Bertone and Sedano. There was also another name but I forgot and they are under the impression that these people are lying (which is sinful, but not beyond a person). They do make some interesting points about Ratzingers change on the issue since 2000. I dont know and its all too confusing to me. Patrick Madrid wont even touch the issue with a ten foot pole when asked so its well beyond my competence

  • Angela

    Pope John Paul II, when asked about the Third Secret in Germany, stated that,
    “we must be prepared to undergo great trials in the not too distant future, trials that will require us to
    be ready to give up our lives…”On March 25, 1984, Pope John Paul II departed from his prepared text with the words: “… enlighten especially the peoples of which You Yourself are awaiting our consecration and confiding.’ This means that even he knew that the consecration had not occurred. Furthermore, if Our Lady specifically asked for a consecration by the Pope in union with all the bishops, why would we not heed her words? She should know better than we what is necessary to bring about the period of peace…

  • Samuel L. Edwards

    It seems obvious to me that the Consecration has been done, based on the testimony of reliable witnesses, most notably Sr Lucia and Cardinal Ratzinger.

  • Mary

    No one has yet addressed the following: “The good will be martyred; the Holy Father will have much to suffer; VARIOUS NATIONS WILL BE ANNIHILATED. In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me, and she shall be converted, and a period of peace will be granted to the world.” Our Lady explicitly states Russia (not the world) IN THE END will be consecrated. Have several nations been annihilated? So confusing but I do believe our Ladies words need to be taken literally. In the meantime the world is seriously spiraling into an abyss of sin and immorality. So let us spend time praying her Rosary, doing penance and spending time with Jesus in front of the most Blessed Sacrament. Just like we averted a war with Syria through prayer, Adoration and fasting we can also lessen the just punishment due this world.

    • TomD

      No nation has been annihilated in the 20th century (100% population loss), but the real events are almost as bad. No nation ‘disappeared’ completely, but many saw losses so great that large parts of their cultures were lost – met any Prussians lately? The total death toll from war, famine, and disease due to Communism, the Fascism copycats that were partly inspired by Communism, and the Islamic and African tribal conflicts that were released by the Cold War total more than 275 million people. That is a lot of annihilation.

      World War Two: 80,000,000 including the Shoah, the related famines in China, French Indochina, and Bengal, and the related epidemics

      World War One (which was ongoing during the Fatima apparitions): 65,000,000 if you include the Spanish flu that was bred by trench warfare hygiene.

      Chinese Great Leap Forward: up to 55,000,000

      Russian famine of 1921: up to 10,000,000

      Chinese Civil War: 9,750,000

      Russian Civil War: up to 9,000,000

      The Holodomor: up to 8,000,000

      Vietnam War and Cambodian Genocide: up to 6,000,000

      Korean War: up to 4,500,000

      Afghan-Soviet War and Afghan Civil War: 4,000,000

      The Second Congo War: 5,400,000

      Nigerian Civil (Biafra) War: 3,000,000

      Pakistani-Bangladesh Civil War: up to 3,000,000

      Armenian, Assyrian, and Greek Genocides: 2,500,000

      Mexican Revolution: up to 2,000,000

      Iran-Iraq War: up to 2,000,000

      Spanish Civil War: 1,000,000

      Ethiopian famine: 1,000,000

      • TomD

        Forgot the Sudanese Civil Wars: up to 2,570,000

  • Pat Schwarz

    When Pope JOhn Paul II of Blessed Memory consecrated the world to the Immaculate HEart of Mary, Russia was still the Soviet Union. Wouldn’t that have prevented the Pope from naming Russia in the Consecration? Maybe the consecration of specifically Russia has to do with the conversion of the Russian Orthodox Church with the Catholic Church, bringing the East and West, both lungs of the Catholic Church, together again to stand united against the combined forces of evil coming upon the world. Vladimir Putin is showing the world his union with the Church in Russia by his words and actions. For this unity we pray everyday asking the Holy Spirit to guide Pope Francis according to the will of God. This has always been a confusing issue for me and it still is I must admit.

  • Tony Lee

    Our Lady wants the Pope to consecrate “Russia” (but did not mention “the world”), If indeed Russia was already consecrated, why is there no peace in the world? Although Sr. Lucia earlier stated that the consecration of Russia had not be fulfilled, she was alleged to have later said that Our Lady was satisfied that her request was fulfilled! Card. Tarcisio Bertone, the last person to have interviewed Sr. Lucia, had stated that she had at last agreed that Our Lady’s request was fulfilled, realising that nobody could check on him if what he said was true. Events had been proven that he had not spoken the truth by stating publicly that the episode of ‘Fatima’ was then a closed chapter! People will remember that Pope Benedict XVI had recently countered that “Fatima is not a closed chapter” which directly corrected Card. Bertone’s statement.
    For those who understand, no explanation is needed.
    For those who do not understand, no explanation is possible.

    • Angela

      Tony Lee you are 200% correct. There is no possible way that the third secret has been completed, because there is still no period of peace and Russia has not been converted. Furthermore, if the consecration had been completed, Pope Francis would not have felt it necessary to consecrate the world on October 13th. Pope Francis knows the divided opinions of so many concerning Fatima and that all eyes are watching his actions; he would have most assuredly picked a different venue and different title of the Blessed Mother’s from which to consecrate the world. Our Holy Father knows that it has not been consecrated!

    • pat

      Tarcisio … Iscariot … take it as you will … but … it does Not seem that anyone in Rome can understand a simple request … Russia by Name … is the request and command of our Lady. GOD Bless us all.

  • E G Lewis

    I would say that Russia has been consecrated. My proof: Look at the resurgence of religious fervor in Russia, their banning of gay marriage, opposition to abortion, etc. Even Vladimir Putin now says he’s a believer. The whole has been turned upside down. In 1980 Reagan called the Russia the Evil Empire. Today, I’d say they’re on the right road and the US has become the Evil Empire.

  • Phil

    I would agree. We also have to remember that Free Will is in play here. No one will force a person Especially God. He will give the Graces we have to open to accept them.

  • Albee

    Why can’t the Pope just do what Our Lady asked…. consecrate Russia by name…in public.
    What are the Pope’s afraid of? Can’t they just do their jobs? They work for God, not anyone else.
    All we get is second or third hand info from those who
    said they talked to Sr. Lucy and have “letters” etc. Just because they have some
    important title attached to their name, we are supposed to believe everything that they say?
    It has been known for over 50 years that communists and Masons have infiltrated the Church.
    Bishop Sheen investigated this himself and spoke about it, but later in his life was
    basically “silenced”, too.

  • Nora

    In my opinion, the answer lies in the condition of the world. The error of communism is spreading rampantlyi in our own country. As for the.question of deception, we have long suspected communist infiltration in the Vatican. We cannot judge intentions,,and we may not know the whole story. I agree with Dr. Marshall that we should pray uunceasinglyi that the Holy Father consecrate Russia specifically, that all may witness the victory ofOur Lady.

  • Pat Rutter

    I thank your for giving us the rundown on the consecrations. I myself thought Russia, the country,not just the people, should have been the big specification. I leave it in Mary’s Hands and Heart. Christ was specific in the scriptures, so I thought in that same direction about the Consecration.
    God bless the world. Pat Rutter.

  • Carol Brown

    Increasing addictions, pornography, human trafficking, beheadings, abortion, euthanasia, divorce and unnatural relationships…are these evidence of an era of peace? Persecution and martyrdom of Christians, scandals within the Church, liturgical abuse, heresy, apostasy, and spiritual wickedness in high places… evidence that the Consecration has taken place as requested by Our Lady?
    Communism is not dead. It is a shape changer which roams about seeking whom it may devour.

    The Bertone explanation of the Third Secret makes no sense, and has been contradicted by Pope Benedict XVI himself. Troubling is the interpretation of the murder of the “Bishop in white.” The explanation defies reason since it did not happen! Let us have the actual text of Our Lady’s words instead of the subjective views given with an agenda in mind.

  • Kevin Symonds

    The 1984 consecration was accepted in heaven. Our Lady appeared to Sr. Lucia and told her as much.
    Contact Rick Salbato over at Unity Publishing (unitypub@unitypublishing.com). He met with Sr. Lucia 11 times and asked her point-blank.

  • Bruce

    What is proposed as proof is supposedly a word from an officially silenced Sr. Lucy saying that a substitute fraction of a ceremony was good enough. All the bishops of the world, in union with the Holy Father, were to consecrate Russia specifically, not elsewhere. Simple logic. Does one consecrate a whole church to consecrate a chalice within it and say that’s good enough? Certainly not. Details are important. Our Lady from Heaven does not ask imperfectly or imprecisely. Why Russia specifically? Because they initiated the official atheistic form of government. Anyone with opened spiritual eyes sees how the errors of Russia (atheism) have spread everywhere, in almost all governments now with practical atheism incorporated into laws, along with many who are Catholic in name only by rejecting the faith, living just as the worldly do. Conversion? No, rather the exact opposite. The great apostasy is here within the Church, even within the Vatican. All the sleepy Catholics who think communism is dead will be greatly surprised soon as communism will make a great return for WW3 starting in the Middle East. Jesus says that He will come as a thief in the night, symbolically meaning when people are sleeping. That is the case now spiritually, where most people don’t realize that Jesus’ Second Coming is at our doorstep, with the Antichrist about to reveal himself. Fortunately the 6th seal (Rev 6:12-17) will awaken all consciences at the event commonly called the “Warning.”

    • Albee

      Our Lady’s request was very simple, using explicit terms. Why is the Vatican’s response always so ambiguous, confusing, filled with doublespeak, contradiction and allusions?

  • retiredladyann

    Thank you for your lucid explanation of the disagreement on whether or not Russia has been consecrated as Our Lady requested. We have a sizable group of “traditionalists” at our parish and it seems there are organizations who have made a cottage industry of sending out petitions, publishing books, scurrilous articles at times, about the recent Holy Fathers, and Sr. Lucia (who was either deluded or was murdered and an imposter put her in place). Their publications continue to rile people up and divide parishes and other groups. And make a lot of money for the organizations. Their publications have enough authentic teaching about the Faith, mixed with these “warnings.” They also have reservations about the Novus Ordo, believe a few recent Popes promoted homosexuality in the seminaries, etc. etc. Is not this a deception of the devil? To Divide good people?. Catholics from the Philippines and Vietnam seem to be the ones promoting this request of Our Lady; they have lived through persecution in their own countries. Also, Fr. Andrew Apostoli wrote a book on Fatima a few years ago. He believes the Consecration has been done, as Sr. Lucia said. I will take his expertise over the ones who continually “stir the pot.”

    • Albee

      Hmm, there are “Novus Ordo” groups that do the same thing and created cottage
      industries for their publication by promoting certain heresies. If you want to know about
      how the seminaries are and have been infiltrated by homosexual “sympathizers, then read
      Goodbye, Good Men by Michael Rose. And for women religious read
      Ungodly Rage: The Hidden Face of Catholic Feminism by Donna Steichen. These books
      are very difficult reads and hard to stomach.

      • retiredladyann

        Thank you. You are correct, especially in regard to the so-called liturgists who have wrecked the liturgical music in N.O. Masses. I read both books when they were published and passed them on to others. I think both could use some up-dating. God have mercy on the bishops who permitted the seminaries accepting SSA men. Am very familiar with the feminist nuns; the college from which I graduated was run by the IHMs (brilliant women and teachers) in L.A. The truth is not easy to find. Carl Rodgers and a side-kick had a hand in their undoing. Read the biography of Cardinal McIntyre by Weber-it tells the whole story, not just the nuns,’ who lost their canonical status in the 1970’s. Our Lady and her Divine Son will never turn away from our prayers, consecrations and dedication to them and to Holy Mother Church.

  • Pauline

    No, the consecration has not been done.The blessed Mother specifically said and easy to understand, to consecrate Russia To Her Immaculate heart. Not the world. it’s as simple as that It is not hard to understand.

  • Maccabeus

    I agree that Russia has been consecrated because Sr. Lucia and Blessed John Paul II affirmed it. What motive would they have to deceive the world? The fruits are there for all to see, as you listed them in your explanation. By the “conversion of Russia” could Our Lady not have meant the end of atheistic Communist rule and tyranny? We have certainly seen the remarkable collapse of the entire Communist system through all of Eastern Europe and the former USSR. There exists in Russia today freedom of religion, and the Catholic Church is no longer violently persecuted there. As for other evils within Russian society, individuals and government leaders are free to choose sin or virtue. No society in that regard is fully converted, but at least Russia has taken steps to remove the more egregious offenses against Almighty God, whereas the so-called democratic nations of Europe and North America continue on their downward spiral of trampling upon God’s commandments. Perhaps the Triumph of Our Lady’s Immaculate Heart will usher in the era of peace she predicted in such a way as to fully convert not only Russia, but the West and China too.

    • jdumon

      The end of a political system is not a conversion. Or are you meaning that Russia has converted from communism to capitalism?
      And where is the promised period of peace?

      • Maccabeus

        I regard the collapse of an evil, anti-Christian, anti-God political system that violently persecuted Christians, torturing, imprisoning, and executing them as a fruit of the papal consecration in 1984. Before this collapse, nearly 20 million Christians were killed during the 70 years of Soviet rule. There is most definitely a moral conversion in that, i.e., those individuals that were part of the Soviet government who did the torturing, imprisoning and executing of Christians stopped doing so. Those who ordered these violent acts against Christians stopped ordering them. Moral conversion implies a turning away from sin and turning toward God. There was a turning away from these violent acts by Soviet government authorities, and some of them, at least, profess faith in God, e.g., Gorbachev, even Putin, a former KGB officer.

  • adrienne p

    All Popes since 1984 agree they finally got it right. We are in mortal peril to argue with that. Consecration to Russia in this way or that way was not and is not a magic incantation. Pope Francis yesterday was not consecrating the world to the Immaculate Heart in any way to improve upon what was done before. Neither he nor the Vatican have issued any statements about that. His prayer before Mary Sunday did not even mention Fatima (and I was quite disappointed with that). It was all fairly standard stuff. It was simply a nice devotional gesture in honor of Mary on the 96th anniversary of Fatima. Nothing more. We use the prayer of consecration to Mary every First Saturday when we fulfill that devotion in our parish. Does your parish do that? Do you faithfully do all that was asked? The Blessed Virgin Mary did not ask the three children to badger the Vatican on this point. She asked for their personal prayers and penance.

    You can debate whether or not Russia and/or Evil itself has spread until the end of time. Only the end of time will end that argument. However, Russia right now has a President in Vladimir Putin who only recently made news stating that the European Union has lost its way in not placing God and religion into their affairs. Many authorities on what is really going on in Russia today will tell you that the government itself is repairing and restoring lost or destroyed Catholic churches there. (Yes, there is issue with Orthodox versus Catholic, but that is another matter entirely). Russia today has no problem with Christianity. The people are rebuilding their faith. The same cannot be said for modern America.

    Fr. Andrew Apostoli’s most excellent book on Fatima called Fatima for Today is a most excellent and thorough summation of the entire message of Fatima, its history, and all the current issues. Not the least of which was reprinting Pope Benedict’s homily at Fatima in 2010, in which he very strikingly stated that we can pray fervently for the FULFILLMENT of the TRIUMPH of the Immaculate Heart of Mary by 2017, the 100th anniversary. As Our Lady said, in the end my Immaculate Heart will triumph. It was quite startling to hear Pope Benedict even allude to the possibility by that date.

    • The Truth Will Set You Free

      Being a Third Order of the Alliance of Two Hearts, we do the reparation Vigil night every First Friday and First Saturday in front of the Most Holy Sacrament of the Altar. Our Lord Jesus Christ asked for the nine Fridays and Our Blessed Mother for five Saturdays. We do it every month.

  • William polakiewicz Sr.

    Please read “The Devil’s Final Battle” Our Lady’s Victory Edition, edited and compiled by Father Paul Kramer.
    It would be in the best interest of the Catholic Church and the world if Pope Francis and all, I repeat all the Bishops of the world take time out on the same day, at the same time, in every conner of the world to get down on their knees and Consecrate Russia, and Russia alone, to the Immaculate Heart of Mary.
    Does anybody recall what happened to Moses because he struck the rock twice instead of once to get water for the Jews? Moses was denied entrance into the promised land. God gives us instructions and he expects us to carry them out. We are not to change or modify what ever we want. The pope and all the Bishops of the Catholic Church are supposed to get together and Consercrate RUSSIA TO THE IMMACULATE HEART OF MARY.
    What is so hard about doing this?

    • alfred

      Very well said

      • JMJT

        Easier said than done…we have some strange bishops in various countries of the world. Do not forget only eighty out of approx. 440+ active and retired US bishops protested the honoring of Pres. Obama at the Notre Dame Univ. graduation.

    • Patti Day

      I don’t think anyone here disagrees that the consecration wasn’t carried out with the specificity that Our Lady requested, Why not hang any political correctness issues and consecrate Russia as Our Lady asked for the 100th Anniversary in 2017.

      • The Truth Will Set You Free

        Our Lord Jesus Christ asked to consecrate France to His Most Sacred Heart. The kings ignored him. After 100 years, when the French Revolution was at the door, Luis XVI finally decided to fulfil the request. It was 100 years too late 🙁

    • jdumon

      Yes, a quarter of an hour in the Pope’s agenda together with a mail to all the bishops in the world, is this so unsurmountable?

  • LisaBuss

    I may be completely off base here, because I really don’t understand. But…. Our Lady says “To prevent this, I shall come to ask for the consecration of Russia to my Immaculate Heart, and the Communion of reparation on the First Saturdays. ” So, I have a few questions:
    1. Our Lady says she “shall come.” Doesn’t that mean she is expected at some point in the future to ask for the consecration?
    2. Our Lady asks for consecration of Russia AND the Communion of reparation on the First Saturdays. Ok… let’s say “I shall come” also means “I am here”. If so, does this mean, perhaps, that the consecration HAS taken place, and now it is up to the people to receive communion each and every first saturday for reparation? Because “AND” means both things must occur. How many of us a) attend Mass on Saturday, and b) offer that communion in reparation for Russia? Maybe we should be looking at ourselves rather than blaming the Pope(s).

    • jdumon

      The Pope(s) are to be blamed for two reasons:
      1/ The many consecrations they did weren’t complying to our Lady’s requests
      2/ They never promoted and the five saturdays devotion and even ignored it.

  • Michael A. Six

    If you look carefully at the words of Our Lady that you have quoted you can see that she asked for TWO actions. One is to be done by the Pope and the Bishops in communion with him (the Consecration) while the second is to be done by all of us (Communions of Reparation). For those who say Russia has not been converted, let’s stop pointing our fingers at the Pope and the Bishops and spread the word that we are the ones who are slow to act. Perhaps the completion of the conversion will happen when we have made enough Communions of Reparation.

    • LisaBuss

      Wow Michael, I just posted the same thing. Great minds thinking alike here?

    • Kevin Symonds

      Five First Saturdays will go a long way to fulfill Our Lady’s requests!

      • Michael A. Six

        Kevin, the Five First Saturdays are one key, but just remember that Communions of Reparation can be don any time – you don’t need to wait for a First Saturday!

        • Kevin Symonds

          You seem to make the two distinct, yet I do not see them as such. Can you provide evidence they were separate things?

          • Michael A. Six

            It has been said that the message of Fatima is “reparation, reparation, Eucharistic reparation”. The children were told, “make of everything you do an act of reparation.” The Five First Saturdays devotion involves several actions (meditation, Rosary, Confession, Holy Communion) including reception of the Eucharist. The concept of Eucharistic Reparation is not limited to one particular day a month.

    • James Finn

      Hard to argue with that. But why can’t we get one Pope to say the word “Russia” in a consecration? Is that asking too much? You know me, Michael, and you know that I am new to all this. I’m just trying to parse the arguments coming from Gruner, Ferrara, et al. God bless you – (good seeing you here – have you signed up for NSTI?)

  • Alexandra Campbell

    Can someone please provide the direct quote of Pope Francis consecrating the world to the Immaculate Heart of Mary on October 13, 2013. I waded through his homily and could not find it…All the news outlets I can find, even the Vatican’s, have the headline that the Pope did this but I cannot find the specific words. Shouldn’t this consecration be in the form of an actual prayer or something? Please help me find the actual CONSECRATION before I go crazy looking for it. Thanks!

  • N Wright

    I believe that Russia has been consecrated but that many haven’t done their part in making the first Saturdays of reparation and devotedly saying the rosary daily, as you have mentioned. Since God lives out of time, the consecration IN IT’S FULLNESS will take more time, especially since all the bishops and laity have not responded as our Lady asked. Her request”S” have not been fully heeded. It’s our choice whether “various nations will be annihilated” before triumph ,which is promised, “In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph. The Holy Father will consecrate Russia to me, and she shall be converted, and a period of peace will be granted to the world.”
    I consecrate myself, my family and the world daily to the Immaculate Heart of Mary and the Sacred heart of Jesus. To do it daily and by many popes does not diminish the prayer but reinforces it.

    I believe the message from Medjugorje is a continuation of our Mother’s plea to pray, pray pray-for all to be accomplished in the plan of God.

  • Ellie

    I don’t think that the Consecration has been done properly. Remember in 2000 when the Vatican reported that the entire prophecy had been fulfilled and Pope Benedict said something a little different! Please read some of the books by Fr. Gruner. He is known as the Fatima priest and has dedicated his entire life to the Fatima message.

  • Donald

    The Consecration was done but it has never mentioned Russia by name.The Consecrations that have mentioned Russia by Pope Pius XII and Pope Paul VI did not include all the Bishops. As a result, despite the fall of the Berlin Wall and other events Russia has not converted ,but rather Russia has one of the highest abortion rates of

    any country of the world.The Conversion of Russia spoken of at Fatima means to

    the CATHOLIC faith,to a Russian that would mean the Byzantine-Catholic faith not
    the Roman Catholic faith ,but it would still be CATHOLIC,not Eastern Orthodox because the Byzantine Catholic Faith recognizes Rome. Some speculation of supernatural events at the time of the Consecration to prove that Russia had been
    validly Consecrated are only matters of speculation–such as Lenin’s tomb being swallowed by the earth and a bright light appearing over the Kremlin which would

    shine throughout Russia.Nevertheless I cannot totally conclude that because the fruits
    of the Consecration have not appeared the Consecration has not yet been properly made.

  • Joanne

    I encourage you read Antonio Socci’s Book–the Fourth Secret of Fatima. I think this is the best written book and examination of Fatima, by a well known Italian journalist, who did impeccable research and published this book in 2006. Until you read that book you can speculate all you want. But what he found, that there were 2 documents regarding the 3rd secret–only part of it was released–the vision, the 2nd part has not been disclosed–you can see the bigger picture. A friend of Pope Benedict–and well respected journalist–who set out to prove the full secret was revealed, and changed his mind after much research.

    Our Lady of Fatima, pray for us!

  • Allan Daniel

    Russia has not been converted. We mistook the end of Communism as conversion. One can argue that Russia is morally worst off than before. Pornography is rampant, crime is out of control and there is no sign of people living more moral lives, and the sounds of war are beginning to be heard.

    Fr Gruner has never suggested that Sister Lucia was replaced by an impostor!

  • adrienne p

    Yeah. You will “believe” in Medjugorje, third-rate journalists, and an ex-communicated priest before you believe Sr. Lucia (chosen by our Lady) and our Popes (Holy Spirit). Gnosticism reigns all around! That 2nd document, that real 3rd secret info must be the ticket to eradication of all evil, all right. I am more scared of those who are calling our Lady a liar because they believe that the Consecration was not done properly. She said that in the end her Immaculate Heart will triumph. Some reason why that is not good enough?

    You can appreciate why the Blessed Mother does not bother appearing to us “educated” adults . . .

  • abdiesus

    One thought that has occurred to me with increasing frequency: when Our Lady asked for “all” the Bishops of the world together with the Pope, to consecrate Russia to her Immaculate heart, is it not possible that she was, in effect, implicitly asking for an end to the schism of 1054? Correct me if I’m wrong, but isn’t it Catholic teaching that while the Eastern Orthodox churches which separated in 1054 are are not currently subject to the Pope, nevertheless they retain a valid Eucharist, and valid Orders, which means their Bishops are true Bishops, capable of transmitting Holy Orders to new generations of their Priests. If Catholic teaching identifies the Bishops of the East (and particularly Russia) as true Bishops, how can we exclude *these* Bishops from our Lady’s “all”? In this light, it is perhaps easier to see why it has not been possible to fulfill Our Lady’s request so far. She is (albeit somewhat implicitly) asking for nothing less than the healing of the great rift in Christendom which began in 1054, and that of course is not the work of a day.

    It is, I suppose, conceivable that the Bishops of the East (and particularly of Russia) could on their own, and with no intention of healing the 1054 schism, simply decide to join with the Pope and the rest of the Catholic Bishops in this one intention of consecrating Russia to Her Immaculate Heart. But it doesn’t seem very likely that this would occur without there being at the same time/in conjunction, some major changes of heart – in fact, without such changes of heart, it seems much more likely that a literal fulfillment of our Lady’s request by *only* the Bishops who are currently in submission to the Pope, excluding the Bishops of the East, and particularly, the Bishops of Russia, could only result in a worsening of ecumenical and political relations.

    Just wondering if anyone else has ever considered this question…

    Pax Christi,
    Jeff H.

    • TomD

      It’s not just the Eastern Orthodox churches that have valid bishops. The sacraments of the Eastern Oriental churches and the Church of the East are also valid in Catholic theology, though they prefer the word “mysteries” instead of sacraments.
      The movement for unity is growing, especially in the Coptic Church and the Church of the East. We may see some real fruits of this movement in the next twenty years. In the light of Fatima it is ironic that the largest obstacle to east-west unity is the Russian Orthodox Church.

      • abdiesus

        True – on both counts! Thanks for pointing this out!

  • Pat Schwarz

    Taylor, I agree with you that no matter where we stand, the laity have our own “Fatima responsibility”, that is, to pray the Rosary and to make the First Saturday Devotions. Reparation to the Sacred Heart of Jesus and The Immaculate Heart of Mary is so critical at this hour.

    • The Truth Will Set You Free

      Look up: an Alliance of the Two Hearts.

      • Pat Schwarz

        Thanks, I will.

  • Paul

    If Sr Lucia (the surviving visionary) declared Pope John Paul II’s act to be sufficient, then who am I, and who is any other lay person, to have any kind of special insight from which to argue against her judgment? This argument should stand on its own unimpeachable logic. Nevertheless, I offer perhaps useful info on witness credibility: my ability to affirm Sr Lucia’s statement. I’ve been a “Blue Army” member, more or less, since the early 1980s. I distanced a bit when it became clear that the Blue Army was a bit too singularly focused for my interests, and since it often impacted me as too scrupulous for the good health of lay members who also have to work hard in the world just to feed, house, clothe, and raise a family. Nonetheless, Blue Army has kept tabs on the Fatima issues probably more closely than most, and from the view of one affiliated with it for decades, I opine. Blue Army is 100% clear that Sr Lucia did tell the Pope that the first consecration was insufficient, but that she told the pope that the 1984 consecration did what was required. And I note that the vision to Sr Lucia (and her cousins) didn’t state equivocally what might happen if the pope did decide to consecrate Russia; rather, the vision stated unequivocally that the pope *would* consecrate Russia, and the other things would follow, period. But prophecy has never been like a history text; some parts happen quickly, while other parts take time to work out.

  • Frank B

    I’ve seen all the arguments, and can understand the confusion. I think the best way to look at this is to ask what the ulimate reason for the consecration is. On May 18, 1936 Sister Lucia wrote a letter to Fr. Goncalves and stated the following: “Intimately I have spoken to Our Lord about the subject, and not too long ago I asked Him why He would not convert Russia without the Holy Father making that consecration? {He said} ‘Because I want My whole Church to acknowledge that consecration as a triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary, so that it may extend its cult later on, and put the devotion to this Immaculate Heart beside the devotion to my Sacred Heart'”

    I infer from this that the consecration is to be a whole-shaking event with as much publicity as the election of a new pope, so that everyone will be in awe of its effects and will praise and glorify the Blessed Virgin. As a result, according to Our Lord’s desire, the cult of the Immaculate Heart of Mary will be raised in its significance. (Has the Church done this? I doubt it; e.g. I believe the feast of the Sacred Heart is a solemnity, whereas that of the Immaculate Heart is a lesser memorial).

    For me, the upshot is that the consecration will not be a subtle or stealthy event (i.e. included within the world’s consecration), and its effects will be dramatic; Also the conversion of Russia will occur soon enough after so that a connection is clear. The current events taking place in Russia can be seen as concessions to the lesser consecrations which have already taken place, and as an encouragement to go further still.

    • Thomas J. Grady Esq

      Christopher Ferrari Esq, President of The American Lawyers Ass’n has painstakingly reviewed each piece of evidence and measured it against the Rules of Evidence as if presented to a jury, to conclude that Cardinals Bertone and Sodano exercised “witness tampering” with Sr Lucia. Thus, her flip flop statements on the subject. One of her own words and volition years earlier than the controversy, and a new one after several meetings with Cardinal Bertone. The original one was closer in time to the facts, voluntary, spontaneous and without influence. This occurred because Vatican II took the day to day administration of the Curia away from the Pope and distributed it among the members of the Curia, and so those two Cardinals became intimately involved with reconciling the Metz Treaty with Our Lady’s request. I should say that the author says that he does not believe that Cardinal Bertone had any evil intent. As a lawyer this is a very persuasive and passionate presentation of this view, thereby making it very credible. The Metz Treaty caused the Vatican to say nothing bad about Russia. It was agreed at Vatican II that the Russian Orthodox would send reps to the Council, if the Vatican would refrain from saying bad things about it. I don’t see this book mentioned and it appears that some readers are quite informed about this. That would be consistent with Sr Lucia’s letter to Fr. Goncalves.

      • jdumon

        So this council which was called to address the main challenges that the Church actually faced, began to dismiss the main one that was in all the minds: The atheist Communism.
        The new policy was to be friendly with the reds who persecuted the catholics throughout the world and so we could see the Pope Paul VI welcoming the communist Vietcong delegation while he denied an audience to the catholic president of the South Vietnam. What a shame !

    • The Truth Will Set You Free

      Triumph, O Sorrowful and Immaculate Heart of Mary! Reign, O Most Sacred Heart of Jesus! In our hearts, in our homes and our families, in Thy Church, in the lives of all the faithful, in the hearts of those who as yet know Thee not and in all the nations of the world.
      (From the Act of Consecration to Two Hearts)

    • jdumon

      You are right, only the conversion of the orthodox to the catholic faith would be a shaking event of religious importance, not the fall of the Iron Curtain.

  • Ron

    Dr.,
    With all due respect, no way had Russia been consecrated. The BVM made it clear: Russia named alone along with every Bishop in the world at the same time. May I humbly suggest Fatima,org. There is more data there than in “War & Peace” concerning why Russia has not been consecrated, and that Sr. Lucy (If I recall correctly) was quoted as saying it was only because she was following a direct order of her superiors (I could be wrong on this point.) I value your opinion greatly On this matter. One need only look at the world, are we better off than 30 years ago, or not? I think NOT!

    • Steve

      The request for the consecration came in 1929. Our Lord complained of the delay in accomplishing the consecration just two years later, in 1931. Pius XII did the consecration without the Bishops in 1952. That’s why Our Lady predicted the Holy Father would do it but didn’t mention the Bishops and said it would be late. Our Lady also said the result of the imperfect consecration would be a “certain” period of peace granted to the world. The word “certain” has long since fallen out of use and is no longer remembered. Russia did spread the errors of Godlessness and abortion on demand throughout the world, but the catastrophic loss of Faith aka apostasy and not Russia, should remind us of the other request made at Fatima by Our Lady: God wishes to establish in the world, devotion (of reparation) to the Immaculate Heart of Mary. That is even less likely to happen, IMO.

    • jdumon

      No, you are right: Sr Lucy was ordered by her hierarchy to say that the consecration act of the world in 1984 by JPII was properly done as our Lady required. If not how to explain that she said the contrary many times (there are a lot of documented statements bearing in that way) from 1984 to 1989 until she suddenly changed her mind. The Vatican never allowed anyone to question her on that discrepancy (and many others) and silenced her, forbidding anyone to meet her unless he was duly authorized by Rome.

  • Dolores

    Sister Lucia began speaking out in 1989 before any Communist
    government of any country under the hammer and sickle gave up control. She said
    that God had accepted the Collegial Consecration by Pope and Bishops of March
    25, 1984, and the Lord would keep His word. One country after another in the
    eastern bloc of Russia’s Soviet Union gave up Communist control; the USSR
    dissolved in 1991. On October
    11, 1998, Russia’s first Shrine to Our Lady of Fatima, in St. Petesburg,
    Russia, was dedicated in honor of JP II the Great’s 20th anniversary
    of his papacy. The Pope and Bishops have done their job,
    now it’s up to the laity to do its. Fatima is about personal conversion,
    penance and reparation:

    Eucharistic – the First Saturday Program; reparation for our
    sins and the sins of the world, especially for the five offenses against Our
    Blessed Mother;

    Ecclesial – Prayer for the Pope and the Church;

    Trinitarian – central mystery of our faith; evangelization
    in the Name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit;

    Marian – Consecration to the Immaculate Heart; daily Rosary;
    “Russia
    will be converted…. In the end, my Immaculate Heart will triumph” are
    absolute promises;

    Vocational – Fidelity to the duties of our state of life

    Fatima: the most apt private revelation of modern times.

    • jdumon

      You liken the political meltdown of the communism in the eastern countries with a conversion? Sr Lucy meant of a conversion from the orthodox schism to the catholic faith, she said litterally that this would be a miracle of conversion. Changing from a political system to another in no ways may be a conversion. Although there is an undeniable renewal of the orthodox faith in Russia, can this be considered as a miracle? The demential abortions rate, the epidemic alcoolism, the criminogen mafias everywhere spreading even in remote countries are not a sign of conversion, open your eyes.
      Together with the conversion of Russia, our Lady promised that a period of peace would be granted to the world: Where is that peace?

  • Catherine H.

    I was under the impression that Lucia received confirmation from Our Lady that the Consecration had finally been made or “accepted” but that it was “late”. This implies to me that although the heavenly conditions for consecration of Russia have finally been met, there will be some sort of negative consequence(s) due to the lengthy delay.

    • Semper Fidelis

      Then why is Our Blessed Lady in 2014 giving messages to chosen ones all over the world that the Consecration of Russia was NOT done?
      All these people carry the same message but have never met — don’t know each other —- and yet give identical messages?

  • Alexandra Campbell

    This may be a bit off topic but does anyone have any proof in WORDS that Francis consecrated to world to the Immaculate Heart of Mary on Sunday? i can’t find evidence of it anywhere, please answer and post this…thank you!

    • The Truth Will Set You Free

      It was more an entrustment than consecration 🙁 as the word “consecrate” is nowhere to find:

      Blessed Virgin Mary of Fatima, with renewed gratitude for Your maternal presence we unite our voice with that of all the generations who call You blessed. We celebrate in You the great works of God, Who never tires to incline with mercy on humanity, afflicted by evil and wounded by sin, to heal it and save it. Accept with the compassion of a Mother the act of entrustment which today we make with confidence, before this Your image to us so dear. We are certain that each one of us is precious to Your eyes and that nothing which dwells in our hearts is unknown to You. Let us reach Your sweet gaze and receive the consoling caress of Your smile. Guard our life in Your arms: bless and strengthen every good desire; revive and foster faith; sustain and illumine hope; create and enliven charity; guide all of us in the path of holiness. Teach us Your same preferential love for the small and the poor, for the excluded and the suffering, for sinners and the lost: gather all under Your protection and give all of us to Your beloved Son, our Lord Jesus.
      Amen.

    • Semper Fidelis

      It wouldn’t matter if he did say the words – without ALL the Bishops joining with him ON THE SAME DAY and consecrating Russia specifically to the Immaculate Heart of Mary – it is NOT done.

  • Elaine Murray

    Our Lady of Fatima asked for the Collegial Consecration of Russia with all the Catholic Bishops of the World solemnly and publicly on one special day.

    She didn’t say go ahead and consecrate the World, no need to mention Russia because it is part of the world anyway.
    None of the Popes since 1917 have been obedient. Even Pope John Paul II knew his consecration Mar.24 1984 wasn’t the proper one as he prayed twice in the same day” Enlighten those people’s who You Yourself are awaiting our consecration.” after he consecrated the World.
    Our Lady of Fatima promised World peace and Russia’s conversion when it was done as She requested.
    Atheistic Communism is alive and well. Don’t be deceived. There is no peace in the world. There is War after war and no end in sight.
    There are 42,000,000 million unborn persons killed every year through abortion. Is that the peace promised?
    It’s amazing what people will believe even when the proof is given.
    It’s truly amazing how far the enemies of God will go to stop the knowledge of and the obedience to Our Lady of Fatima.

  • Babs

    Our faith never contradicts reason. We obviously are not living in the Marian age of peace as promised by Our Lady once the consecration is finally and properly performed. We have the word of Cardinals Soldano and Bertone that we should all relax and not to worry about the coming cataclysmic chastisement because Cardinal Bertone has had a conversation with the last seer of Fatima and never bothered video taping or even getting an audio of this living saint saying anything, and yet we are to take his word on something that holds the entire world in the balance not to mention the loss of countless souls redeemed by Our Precious Lord. Even Pope Benedict said during his last trip to Fatima that we are seeing events unfolding predicted in the third secret. Where ever there is confusion there is the diabolical. Now ask yourself, how can the consecration have truly been made without fulfilling Our Lady’s request? No mention of Russia and NOT in union with all the bishops of the world, But not to worry because Cardinal Bertone says everything is fine, Nothing to see here. God help us! Annihilation or peace? Mother of God help Us!

  • David L Alexander

    Concerning private revelations, this appears to be as good a time as any for what the Catechism of the Catholic Church has to say about them:

    + + +

    65 “In many and various ways God spoke of old to our fathers by the prophets, but in these last days he has spoken to us by a Son.” (Dei Verbum, 2) Christ, the Son of God made man, is the Father’s one, perfect and unsurpassable Word. In him he has said everything; there will be no other word than this one. St. John of the Cross, among others, commented strikingly on Hebrews 1:1-2:

    In giving us his Son, his only Word (for he possesses no other), he spoke everything to us at once in this sole Word – and he has no more to say. . . because what he spoke before to the prophets in parts, he has now spoken all at once by giving us the All Who is His Son. Any person questioning God or desiring some vision or revelation would be guilty not only of foolish behavior but also of offending him, by not fixing his eyes entirely upon Christ and by living with the desire for some other novelty. (St John of the Cross, The Ascent of Mount Carmel 2,22,3-5 in The Collected Works of St John of the Cross, tr K Kavanaugh, OCD, and O Rodriguez, OCD (Washington DC:Institute of Carmelite Studies, 1979)

    66 “The Christian economy, therefore, since it is the new and definitive Covenant, will never pass away; and no new public revelation is to be expected before the glorious manifestation of our Lord Jesus Christ.” (Dei Verbum 4, cf. I Tim 6:14, Titus 2:13) Yet even if Revelation is already complete, it has not been made completely explicit; it remains for Christian faith gradually to grasp its full significance over the course of the centuries.

    67 Throughout the ages, there have been so-called “private” revelations, some of which have been recognized by the authority of the Church. They do not belong, however, to the deposit of faith. It is not their role to improve or complete Christ’s definitive Revelation, but to help live more fully by it in a certain period of history. Guided by the Magisterium of the Church, the sensus fidelium knows how to discern and welcome in these revelations whatever constitutes an authentic call of Christ or his saints to the Church.

    Christian faith cannot accept “revelations” that claim to surpass or correct the Revelation of which Christ is the fulfillment, as is the case in certain non-Christian religions and also in certain recent sects which base themselves on such “revelations”.
    ___

    73 God has revealed himself fully by sending his own Son, in whom he has established his covenant for ever. The Son is his Father’s definitive Word; so there will be no further Revelation after him.

    + + +

    Yes, I read all of it.

    • Thomas J. Grady Esq

      The discernment given by Fr. Esseff ensures that it does not contravene the teachings of the Church and he specifically acknowledges in #2 that the locutions are private revelation and notes that it is their role “to help live more fully by it in a certain period of history..” if it helps the reader to do so as noted in Ch. 67 of the Catechism. In #1 Our Lady instructs the mystic to write down her words and give them to Fr. Esseff. If he approves they are to be published to the world.

      Section 66 of the Catechism states:” The Christian economy, therefore, since it is the new and definitive Covenant, will never pass away; and no new public revelation is to be expected before the glorious manifestation of our Lord Jesus Christ.Yet even if Revelation is already complete, it has not been completely explicit; it remains for Christian faith gradually to grasp its full significance over the course of the centuries.”

      Pope Leo XIII took the position that all private revelation is good, and even if erroneous a soul will be blessed as if it were true.

      The Fatima apparitions have been approved by the Church several years after she stopped appearing publicly to the children. One of the 2 deceased young visionariy’s bodys has been found to be incorrupt.

      Our Lady in the Esseff locutions in several places has referred to Medjugorje as the place in the world receiving the most blessings and graces in these times. She has said, “What I started in Fatima, I will finish in Medjugorje.” There she said, “My Immaculate Heart will triumph!”

      So, there is confirmation among Dr. Ferrari’s book, “False Witnesses of Fatima!”, the Esseff locutions, and Our Lady’s messages to the visionaries in Medjugorje that she wanted Russia consecrated to Her Immaculate Heart by the Pope and her Bishops, and still does. What this says to me is this. The Holy Spirit (Our Lady’s Bridegroom) has chosen young children and a Catholic lawyer, independent sources, through which to give the same message. The testimony of one corroborates the others and adds to the weight of the testimony and proof of the truth thereof as a whole and becomes the preponderance of the evidence.

      The Medjugorje Apparitions and Locutions have still not been approved, because there are ongoing daily apparitions to the world. They are however under the exclusive control of the Vatican. It appears that “The Marian Shrine of St James in Medjugorje”, (in those words of invitation) consisting of the pastor and 35 parishioners who were alive when they first started (June 25,1981), was invited to Consecration day (“of the world”) in Rome together with 9 other Marian Shrines in the world on this past Saturday, October 12, 2013.

      • David L Alexander

        I remember when I sent that portion of the Catechism out, I was thinking: “Hey, I just know somebody’s gonna write something to try and counter this, but it won’t change a thing that I’ve written.”

        I love being right.

  • Dennis

    As far as Communism has fallen comments go, just remember one thing. Communism has not fallen, it merely goes by the name of Socialism nowadays. If you don’t buy that look at the situation in the world today. Right after ”Communism fell”, South-Africa fell to Communism under the communist party: the ANC. What we are living in can hardly be called a period of peace, with abortion, homosexuality and every other kind of moral depravity rampaging throughout the world. It is of no importance weather or not a specific priest, bishop or cardinal propose or support one theory or another. The fact is that Our Lady asked for the consecration of Russia by the Pope AND ALL THE BISHOPS OF THE WORLD PRESENT IN ONE PLACE, AND CONSECRATING RUSSIA TO HER IMMACULATE HEART, AND TO OBSERVE THE FIRST SATURDAY DEVOTION. Every single Pope that has supposedly consecrated Russia has not done so in accordance with Our Lady’s request, they have done it in such a round about way, through saying stupid things like the world, or the peoples of Russia, or those you have a special care for. It is all rubbish and a waste of time. With so many ”consecrations”, shouldn’t the world be a golden paradise right now? Moreover the media always loves to misrepresent and misquote what good people say, so is it not so far fetched to say that Sr. Lucia was misquoted? Or that she never even said that the consecration had been fulfilled in the first place? On top of that, why would God waste His time in fulfilling the promise of Our Lady when at the first instant of her request he changed the water into wine? It is not just Russia that has a long way to go, but the whole world is slipping further into decadence and atheism, at least Russia has the benefit of being able to blame the Communist rule, who do we have to blame but ourselves? If a world full of Socialists, Liberals, Homosexuals, child murderers, corruption, blasphemy and everything else that goes against the will of God and His laws is a consequence of Russia’s consecration, then we were better off without it.

  • Magdalene

    Having met Sr. Lucia’s interpreter this past April in Fatima, he told us that Sr. said the consecration had been done. Not only that but a nuclear war in 1985 was also avoided.

  • Magdalene

    By the way, “we” have not done our part in the honoring of the 5 First Saturdays and the praying of the rosary. It used to be one would hear rosary prayers for the conversion of Russia but I cannot recall the last time I heard such a thing.

  • Rescued By Mary

    The Pope is devil possessed

  • jdumon

    How to explain why Sr Lucy stubbornly declared many times that the 1984 consecration was not properly done as requested by our Lady until she suddenly changed her mind and said the contrary in 1989?
    The late abbé Georges de Nantes said that the bishop of Fatima, Mgr Do Amaral acknowledged him that he himself conveyed to Sr Lucy the ORDER from the Vatican to say so and shut up.
    In my opinion now the case is closed. They definitively silenced Sr Lucy and restricted her in all her talks, writings and interviews. Nobody could ever double check Sr Lucy’s statements unless he was duly appointed by the Vatican.

  • Ricardo Otazu

    So if the Holy Father consecrates the world – as he did in 1982 and 1984 – it is not a specific consecration of a particular nation, and it is not the consecration requested by God in the Fatima Message. And so Our Lady told us at Tuy in June 1929 and again She told Sister Lucy in May 1952 that without this Consecration of Russia – without this instrument – Russia cannot be converted and the world cannot have peace. She has told us that there is no other way. And in case we didn’t get it in 1929, Our Lady returned in 1952 and told Sister Lucy: Make it known to the Holy Father that I am always awaiting the Consecration of Russia to My Immaculate Heart.” “Without the Consecration, Russia will not be able to convert, nor will the world have peace.”

  • Gladius

    “When the ways of man shall please the Lord, he will convert even his enemies to peace.” -Proverbs 16:7

    The consecration of Russia was done by Pius XII in 1952 without the Bishops. It came too late to prevent WWII and it was late in the sense that it belongs to the Second Part of the Secret that is concerned
    with material chastisements. Our Lady accepted this imperfect consecration of Russia and kept the Soviets from invading the West.

    The Third Part of the Secret is concerned with spiritual chastisements (loss of faith) and it was supposed to be made public no later than 1960. If you expect the Pope and Bishops to get together and consecrate Russia in the future, you could be out of luck. Pray the Rosary every day without fail and embrace the First Saturday devotion in reparation to the Immaculate Heart of Mary.

  • Sandie

    Before we point our fingers at the Popes, Cardinals or Bishops, have we done our required obligation of attending The Most Holy Mass and Sacraments, of reciting our daily Most Holy Rosary, yearly being Consecrated to Our Blessed Mother and keeping the First Saturdays? Can you imagine the change that would happen if millions of Catholics were so dedicated to Our Lord through Our Blessed Mother in faith, hope and trust on a daily basis for years upon years to the end of time? The change of hearts and actions would be astounding. The errors that were spread by Russia would be easily dissolved. Worry would be obliterated. Our Lord is looking for our conversion and growth as well as the Russians. They will know that we are Christians by our love.

  • Jerry

    What evidence supports the claim that Sr. Lucia confirmed that the 1984 consecration was acceptable to the Blessed Virgin? References, please; not just assertions that “Sr. Lucia said…”

  • Benjamin

    Ok. Let me leave scepticism behind the door, I came here to find positive answer to my question, so don’t judge me for my very personal POV. Whilst longing for positive answer that the Russia has been consecrated to Immaculate Heart Of Our Lady i stumbled upon this forum and i want to join with my opinion. I dunno know wheter it happend (and i would love to) but it seems to me that Russia’s position is misinterpreted in news so you are misleaded by it’s position in world politics. And you all seem to have very narrow angle of view. No offense.

    Is Russia joining it’s power with China? How dare anybody says that without mentioning any official treaty between those two? This is made up media garbage you read every day. Sure Russia has weapons of mass destruction, which somehow (do like it or not) creates balance in the world. Yet it can be danger.

    Former communist officials in governent. Ok, first you go to Deutschland and ask Mrs. Merkel about her backgrounds and we can discuss further. I mean.. very huge ammount of people were at the party those times and you can’t form government from dissidents. Its technically impossible. And some “formers” are way much better choice to elect than “opposers” of the regime. For example anyone should be better than our first post communist president Vaclav Havel which was 32nd degree freemason.

    Why i still hoping Russia has taken other way?

    Situation in Syria is very hard to read event of recent days. It’s only caused by blurred media picture. We all are being told that president is a dictator. Well he’s maybe more democratically elected than U.S. president, we can talk much longer about that someday other. You should read more than. See discussion in australian TV show about situation in Syria and you may se what Syrians think. What i want to say are two thinks. First: look how behaves North atlantic brotherhood and how responds Russia. Look who is here begging for “non-intervention”. Is NATO and EU along with US standing for peace?

    Russian legislative seems to start being “repressive”. But to whom? To people? To church? No, to homsexuals, banking houses robbing people. Another point to discuss.

    Sometimes see RT news. It might be one point of view, but opposed enought to US news to make more objective balanced view.

    I don’t see any perspective of Russians returning under curent papacy of rome.. I’m not a sedesvacantist, but I don’t see our pope being someone to listen immidiately after conversion. Only thing they should convert to is Immaculate Heart Of Our Beloved Lady Mary Mother Of Jesus Christ. That should be enough catholic. That should be right for this time.. when papacy is in crisis.

  • isabel kissinger

    No, Russia has not been consecrated to the Immaculate Heart of Mary, there is still no peace in the world. Cataclysmic events multiplies at fast rate all over the world. Hear, read and understand what Wisdom is saying in Proverbs 1-20-22:

    Wisdom cries aloud in the street, in the open squares she raises her voice; Down the crowded ways she calls out, at the city gates she utters her WORDs. “BECAUSE I CALLED AND YOU REFUSED, I EXTENDED MY HAND AND NO ONE TOOK NOTICE. BECAUSE YOU DISDAINED ALL MY COUNSEL, AND MY REPROOF YOU IGNORED. I will laugh at your doom; I will mock when terror overtakes you; when terror comes upon you like a storm, and your approaches like a whirlwind; when distress and anguish befall you…

    Hear and understand what our MOTHER is saying in Her apparition at Lasallette:

    La Salette, France 1846

    “Come to me, my children. Do not be afraid. I am here to tell you something of the greatest importance. If my people will not obey, I shall be compelled to loose my Son’s arm. It is so heavy, so pressing that I can no longer restrain it.”

    “How long I have suffered for you! If my Son is not to cast you off, I am obliged to entreat Him without ceasing. But you take no least notice of that. No matter how well you pray in future, no matter how well you act, you will never be able to make up to me what I have endured for your sake.”

    Oh, Mary conceived without sin (Wisdom 7:22-30), pray for us who have recourse to thee…

  • John

    Just wondering why people here don’t think Russia has been converted? For instance: Stalin demolished the cathedral of Christ the Savior in Moscow and built a swimming pool in its place. Now the cathedral has been rebuilt and Russian Orthodoxy flourishes again. True, the Russian church is not (yet) in communion with Rome — but it’s still orthodox by our standards. Why, then, do we not consider Russia converted?

  • Josefa

    Doesn’t look like we are in the Reign of the Immaculate Heart and her promised period of peace, does it?

    • Semper Fidelis

      Absolutely not Josefa.
      May our Blessed Mother keep you safe.

  • Jack Harris

    I’m not catholic my daughter is.all I know is russia is to busy helping syria or north korea build a nuke weapon to be conseceated

  • lynn

    in the booklet “the true story of fatima” by john de marchi, IMC, the author contends that sr. lucia never stated the proper consecation occurred. he cites the 1985 interview in “sol de fatima” where sr. lucia states “there was no participation of all the bishops and there was no mention of russia” (in the 1984 consecration) and that “many bishops attached no importance to this act.” again in 1986 & 7 the author cites 2 more sources that indicate she stated the consecration had not been done as requested. He also lists the many facts that prove russia has not been consecrated, e.g., abortion & divorce rates, catholicism still being on par with numbers of tiny sects of false religions like the moonies or jehovah’s. add to that 911; iraq; afghanistan; kosovo; somalia; el salvador; now ukraine and the list goes on. it seems to come down to the actual documentation of sr. lucia’s actual words- or not. someone has to be wrong here- either she said it or she didn’t. the facts seem to point to the fact that russia has not been consecrated just by looking at the state of affairs.

  • John

    Why doesn’t it seem like Russia has been converted? Used to be official state atheism and religious persecution, now Christianity again. It’s not perfect obviously, but no country is. I don’t think “converted” means “impeccable.”

  • white stallion

    I probably should add for the sake of those who see a ‘recurrence’ of Christianity in Russia within the Orthodox church that this is not so. Only 5% of Russians are practicing Orthodox. About another 20% were baptized after communism fell, but did not actually take up the faith. The Russian Orthodox church of the Moscow Patriarchate is an arm of the government, which is not surprising, since most of the current leaders were in seminary and promoted at a time when the hierarchy of the Russian church had been completely infiltrated by KGB agents. One of the devil’s ploys is to add a bit of truth to a giant lie, in order to lead the righteous astray (Russian’s call this disinformation). Pass one little law in Russia banning the distribution of homosexual literature, and suddenly certain Catholics see the Russian leadership as God’s chosen (exactly what they want) rather than a criminal gang who will stop at nothing to spread the evil of their “errors” around the world. Some people had better wake up before it is too late.

    • Semper Fidelis

      Excellent! Spot on. God bless you.

  • Babylon the New

    We are in 2014 now. Russia certainly has not been consecrated.
    The Pope is disobedient. Obamacare is an example of a marixst error.

  • Ann

    Hi guys…. You should all read up on garbandal in Spain…. It’s amazing. Also medjugorje is another heavenly place. Conchita one of the girls Mother Mary appeared to refers quite a bit to Russia and communism

  • Semper Fidelis

    Soon there will be a WARNING when every person on earth will see their souls as God sees them – and they will see the effects of their sins on other people. The advice from those chosen to receive Our Lady’s messages is to go to confession; make reparation for past sins and prepare NOW for that warning.
    After the WARNING will be the MIRACLE – which will NOT be possible for scientists to “rationalize” – it will be from God.
    After that – if men STILL refuse to believe and turn to God – the CHASTISEMENT – aka the 3 days of darkness. Look it up on a Catholic site

  • Looking for the truth….

    What of the “Locutions” out of Scranton,Pa.? I too thought the Consecration had been done but now I’m not so sure….

  • Susan

    Those who believe that Russia has not been properly consecrated do not believe Sister Lucia was an impostor! They believe she was hushed up by the Vatican. Communism by name has faded in Russia but not Marxist ideology. It has spread throughout the world. It’s alive and well in universities, media, governments around the globe, including America, and yes, it has a presence in the Vatican. Pope Paul famously said, “…the smoke of Satan has entered the walls of the Vatican”

  • Princess

    My answer would be this: Our Lady is still asking for Russia’s consecration under the conditions she set: The pope in the presence of and with the participation of all bishops in a public consecration of Russia to her IM. Her command, issued In 1929, on June 13, goes this way:

    “The moment has come in which God asks the Holy Father to make, and to order that in union with him and at the same time, all the bishops of the world make the consecration of Russia to My Immaculate Heart.” (Frère Michel, The Whole Truth About Fatima, vol. II, p. 555). goes this way:

    ~ (Frère Michel, The Whole Truth About Fatima, vol. II, p. 555).

    • Princess

      Some house-cleaning: 1) delete the second of two phrases, “goes this way:” 2) Delete cite embedded in quote: “(Frere Michel, The Whole Truth About Fatima, vol.II, p. 555).”

  • e fung

    “And by their fruits you shall know them!” According to Mr Putin the communist leadership of the country were 85% Jewish (sect) controlled which caused all the atrocities! Mr Putin himself is a devout Christian albeit of the Eastern rite and Mary is highly loved and honour in Russia.To prevent a world war Russia and China are demonstrating great show of force to discourage the criminal element of the US administration from taking a misstep. Roman Catholics please know that Greek Catholics are equal in the eyes of God and Mary of which Their Son died for! The (Greek) Catholic Church in Russia is recovering and with Mr Putin a very powerful supporter and facilitator. Open your eyes and see who are the peacemakers and war mongers in the world. Do you know that more than half a million innocent Iraqi children died when the US aggressed the country in the name of human rights and democracy?? Who has about 2000 military bases all over the world? Russia?? America?? Whose military spending is 50 % of the total world’s. After WW2 who started all the conflict in the world? Who caused all the starvation through trade embargoes and currency sanctions all under the false premises of human rights and democracy? More like demon-cracy?? Is this a case of “You will look and look: but for you there is no perceiving. You will listen and listen : but for you there is no understanding. etc.” May Mary save Russia. Who will open our mind and save us: if not ourselves?

  • Marjie Lewis

    Pope John Paul II and Sr. Lucia were both satisfied the consecration was achieved. I believe Pope JPII would have tried for another consecration if he believed his previous attempt had fallen short. He was a man who could hear from God for himself. As for the promised conversion of the Russians… Lingering mistrust of state interference in churches causes most Russian Christians not to officially register, but to risk fines instead. Still Pew Research Study charts 1991-2008 Russian Orthodox population increasing from 31% to 72%. And the percentage of Russians claiming No Religion dropped from 61% to 18%. The portion of adults who said they believe in God rose from 38% to 56%. For most Russians, the return to religion did not correspond with a return to church. 1 in 10 Russians attend church at least 1x/month. The number of Russian men identifying as Orthodox Christians has risen 46% since 1991. Women identifying as Othodox rose 38%.

  • William Duncan

    The consecration of Russia by name to the Immaculate Heart of Mary by the Pope together with all the world’s bishops has not been made according to the instructions given by the Blessed Mother at Fatima. Sister Lucia was silenced by the Vatican and hadn’t made any public statements for many years before her death. There has been no conversion of Russia to the Catholic faith and no period of world peace has been experienced. Father Gruner is right in continuing to call on the Pope to consecrate Russia as our Lady requested before we are chastised as our Lady also predicted.

  • Joanne

    I have been following this debate for many years. I am not convinced that the Consecration has been performed as Our Lady asked. There are questions on both sides of the issue. I am neither a sedevacantist, nor am I a modernist. I am merely a daughter of Our Blessed Mother who wants to further her cause. Communism isn’t dead by any means. Anyone who has observed the actions of the present administration should know that. Vladimir Putin seems intent on re-establishing the whole KGB, gulag system. He also seems intent on re-establishing the Soviet Union. I see no signs of conversion to Catholicism in any quarters. If anything, a neo-paganism has taken hold, almost worldwide. Between that and the Moslem jihad, I believe things will become very bad, very quickly.

  • Ghostrider

    There is vagueness in the message. “Russia will spread her errors..”. The message leads us to believe that Russia is ground zero for communism & secular humanism, as if it all originated there. It didn’t. It took financing, planning, and strategy to overthrow the Russian monarchy. It didn’t happen on its own. The financing came from the outside. Most the ‘soviet officials’ came from the outside as well. Meanwhile, even though the Soviet Union had collapsed, ‘Cultural Marxism’ has been and is still being pushed throughout western civilization since at least the 1960s. Cultural Marxism originated in Germany, not Russia. Russia just fell victim to the cabal that has unlimited financing and the ability to pull strings worldwide.

  • RosaMaria Arrojo

    Well, I am very confused as to whether or not the consecration of Russia to the Immaculate Heart of Mary has been truly ‘done authentically’, in the manner the Blessed Virgin Mary asked for. I believe that we are living in what Sister Lucia said, ‘a diabolical disorientation’.

  • Balanced and well supported article. Thank you!

  • liz stewart

    Unless yea become as a child. The question has Russia been consecrated to the Immaculate Heart. Sometimes we do not get it right the first time. I would implore the Holy Father and the Bishops to redoe it according to the specifics of the Third Secret. The Blessed Mother said yes when God called her the least we can do is be exact in carrying out the exact directions of the Third Secret. We will need to answer to God. He loves us.

  • judethom

    Did they rebuild a Catholic parish in Russia that is part of the neo Catholic modernist Church–with no icons, just an altar table, lay ministers and altar girls? If so, give my Orthodoxy!

  • Cicero

    With the Passing of Sr Lucia some years ago, and if the 1984 consecration as some claim, was not valid… how can we ever verify that a future consecration will properly fulfill the request of heaven. It would make more sense that Heaven would ensure that the one who is in a position to verify a proper consecration would be alive to announce it when it did occur… i.e. the 1984 consecration.

  • Alex

    Taylor Marshall, you have left out a key point. Russia has indeed spread her errors all over the world. One of the key things of Communism is that the idea of the wife at home looking after the family is fully abandoned, so she can be out working for the so called “common good”. Not to mention their entire plot to as from their own mouths the father of Marxism and Communism say, “To corrupt the culture of the west, to destroy the family, the modesty, and to feminize western society.” Need I say more? There is also their invention of liberation theology. Marxism and Communism go far beyond physical war for there worldwide revolution. And there are still many many more prophecies about the future Russian invasion of Europe.Those are all done by the saints.

  • as;ldf9a7f

    What would be the harm if Russia was consecrated again and more specifically mentioned in that consecration? Only a liberal would object!